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barto
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Anatomy of Lee Harvey Oswald's Interrogations - Page 2 Empty Re: Anatomy of Lee Harvey Oswald's Interrogations

on Mon 21 May 2018, 8:12 pm
Boyd on Oswald and the interrogations, if body language could speak.....my my aren't we nervous.....
http://emuseum.jfk.org/view/objects/asitem/classification@Oral%20Histories/48/title-asc?t:state:flow=02a2bd54-83c8-4af7-a087-6e1aebe3b87e

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on Tue 22 May 2018, 10:57 am
Thanks Bart for this incredible thread,

You're a star mate.

cheers Mick
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on Tue 10 Jul 2018, 8:58 am
A couple of videos that start to fit together in a short time frame, the moment Oswald had just been arraigned for Tippit and the Patsy sequence.

http://www.prayer-man.com/oswald-in-the-corridor-nov-22nd-after-his-hearing/

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on Tue 10 Jul 2018, 12:11 pm
This is cool Barto. I never understood the spatial sequences in those clips. Crystal clear now though. Thanks.

The audio is an interesting, if very brief, insight into his personality. He seems a little less guarded or panicked as he first moves between the two rooms. Seems to be putting up a public face and showing a little swagger. It fades very quickly though and he digresses into the panicky (and likely fatal) patsy talk. Rational and controlled at first, then he's spooked by the drum beat emanating from the reporters. Sad.

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on Wed 11 Jul 2018, 6:35 am
Thanks Jake, I only new of the Patsy seq being at about 19:50, and once I heard the audio of the other one I realised they were close together, as Oswald was arraigned at about 19:00-ish. 

The biggest issue is that no one has ever tried to piece all these bits of film together, they have always been shown randomly in docus.

Well that's about to change Wink


Last edited by barto on Sat 03 Aug 2019, 1:34 am; edited 1 time in total
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on Wed 11 Jul 2018, 9:59 am
Thanks Jake, I only new of the Patsy seq being at about 19:50, and once I heard the audio of the other one I realised they were close together, as Oswald was arraigned at about 18:30-ish. 






approximately 4 1/2 hours after arriving at the DPD he was arraigned for the murder of Tippit. That's some mighty hot police work right there. Fritz, Decker and Wade were mighty impressive.
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on Wed 11 Jul 2018, 4:24 pm
They were impressive how else do you obtain a 98% clearance rate Wink
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on Thu 12 Jul 2018, 9:52 pm
In the HSCA interview of Deputy Sheriff Ralph Alvin Walters, it has become evident that the Sheriff’s Department was in no way involved with any of the planning of J.F.K.’s visit to Dallas.  And after the event Walters enters the T.S.B.D. and assists in the search of the building and is in close proximity when the shells and the rifle were found.

Once arriving back at the office the supervisors were were all gathered inside Decker’s office for an immediate meeting and Decker told them that: “The Secret Service and/or F.B.I. were the first-line investigators and they were to stay out of it. If they had anything thus far, they were to turn it over to either agency right away.”

http://jfkassassinationfiles.com/180-10113-10250.pdf
Thanks to Dennis Morissette.

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on Tue 05 Mar 2019, 7:23 pm
One neat package.....


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on Sun 14 Apr 2019, 5:50 am
I have decided to delay its release a little, and that is because I have been rummaging through Malcolm's archive and found a few things which are pertinent to this part of the case. Since I am visiting his place later this month and the next again I have decided to sit this out until end of May and then release it, it will be worth the wait. Trust me Wink

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Anatomy of Lee Harvey Oswald's Interrogations - Page 2 Empty Re: Anatomy of Lee Harvey Oswald's Interrogations

on Sun 14 Apr 2019, 8:19 am
barto wrote:I have decided to delay its release a little, and that is because I have been rummaging through Malcolm's archive and found a few things which are pertinent to this part of the case. Since I am visiting his place later this month and the next again I have decided to sit this out until end of May and then release it, it will be worth the wait. Trust me Wink
Bart,

after 55 years, I think we can wait a bit longer to get it right.

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Anatomy of Lee Harvey Oswald's Interrogations - Page 2 Empty Re: Anatomy of Lee Harvey Oswald's Interrogations

on Sat 04 May 2019, 10:40 pm
HARRY D. HOLMES U.S. Postal Inspector

 “In the case of Oswald, I don’t think that he would have ever confessed; he was that adamant. He was so direct. He’d look you right in the eye and ask you a question. He had an uncanny ability to determine or guess when I had evidence or when I was fishing . . . In fact, I thought in my own head that probably in Russia he had been trained to evade questions and be able to keep himself composed to guard what he wanted to keep secret . . .”

Sneed, Larry A.. No More Silence: An Oral History of the Assassination of President Kennedy (p. 351). Texas A&M University Press. Kindle Edition.
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Anatomy of Lee Harvey Oswald's Interrogations - Page 2 Empty Re: Anatomy of Lee Harvey Oswald's Interrogations

on Sat 04 May 2019, 11:59 pm
That is classic Mick. So, what kind of a person has an uncanny ability to determine or guess when there is evidence or when someone is fishing? Could it be, is it within the realm of universal possibilities, maybe, just maybe he's a person who is telling the f-ing TRUTH!?


Oh no, it's got to be he's guilty. And so amazingly guilty that he's seemingly superhuman. Holmes knew which way the wind was blowing, he just didn't have the full meteorological data set. Otherwise he wouldn't have been so amazed.

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on Sun 05 May 2019, 10:21 am
he's a person who is telling the f-ing TRUTH!?




I think so Jake, I really do believe that. 
Holmes is an interesting subject too. His notes discovered recently marries exactly with the available evidence.


I think the witness statements - the ones that show us Oswald's most likely movements for the last 45 minutes inside that building before the shots are as important as any other pieces of evidence in the case. It's those in my view which show quite simply and clearly that he was telling the truth and that he had an alibi for his whereabouts for 12.30pm.
That's why in my opinion the case should be re-investigated with a view to clearing Oswald's name. He deserves that, and so do the surviving members of his family.


Last edited by Mick Purdy on Mon 06 May 2019, 7:57 am; edited 1 time in total
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on Sun 05 May 2019, 7:40 pm
All the new bits of evidence have helped strengthen the case for Prayer Man. There is no excuse anymore for anyone to not get aboard the Prayer Man train.
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on Mon 06 May 2019, 8:01 am
Jake Sykes wrote:That is classic Mick. So, what kind of a person has an uncanny ability to determine or guess when there is evidence or when someone is fishing? Could it be, is it within the realm of universal possibilities, maybe, just maybe he's a person who is telling the f-ing TRUTH!?


Oh no, it's got to be he's guilty. And so amazingly guilty that he's seemingly superhuman. Holmes knew which way the wind was blowing, he just didn't have the full meteorological data set. Otherwise he wouldn't have been so amazed.
And just maybe Fritz had not come across one of his dodgy suspects before this event who had been so reluctant to go along with the railroaded confession. Fritz was most likely infuriated.
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on Mon 06 May 2019, 8:30 am
Anatomy of Lee Harvey Oswald's Interrogations - Page 2 Img_9110

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Anatomy of Lee Harvey Oswald's Interrogations - Page 2 Empty Re: Anatomy of Lee Harvey Oswald's Interrogations

on Mon 06 May 2019, 8:52 am
barto wrote:Anatomy of Lee Harvey Oswald's Interrogations - Page 2 Img_9110
and yet we are told over and over again by LNs and CTs that the cops went to the theater for a Tippit suspect. They are all led by the fucking nose - by each other!

My current thinking is that the pistol at the theater was a throw-down which they were attempted to plant - traditionally such throw-downs are weapons that can't be fired at you -which was the case with piece of shit.  It was not originally supposed to be the Tippit weapon - it was just any old weapon that could be used as an excuse to kill him.

When Tippit was tacked on to the JFK case, this throw-down now had to be transformed into the Tippit weapon - thus Hill's original correct call on the shells as being from a 38 automatic,  had to be dismissed as wrong.

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Mixing Pop and Politics he asks me what the use is
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             Lachie Hulme            
-----------------------------
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“God favors drunks, small children, and the cataclysmically stoned...” Steve King
"The worst thing about some men is that when they are not drunk they are sober." Billy Yeats
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on Mon 06 May 2019, 9:21 am
From my paper anatomy Of LHO Interrogations


·         Gus Rose took no notes during Oswald’s chat, but in this article in 1998 for D Magazine he said the following about what Oswald said.
"The suspect had suffered a small red abrasion over his right eye while scuffling with officers at the Texas Theatre in Oak Cliff. But the young man didn’t seem dazed or confused at all. He was angry and arrogant. "I don’t know what I’m doing here," he said.  
A homicide detective for only three years. Rose would later gain renown as a skilled interrogator. Blocking out the hubbub, he turned his attention to the hostile suspect.
"I don’t own a gun," the man said. "I didn’t have that gun. They planted that on me when they arrested me."
"Have you ever owned a gun of your own?" Rose asked evenly.
"No," he retorted. "I never owned one."

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on Mon 06 May 2019, 9:32 am
Gus Rose:




"When you’re interrogating somebody, you try to establish a rapport with them, and you set about to do that without getting into the actual case. I did ask him about his arrest and he said, “Oh, I was just sitting in the theater and officers came in and planted a gun on me and accused me of shooting somebody. I don’t know nothing about that!”

Sneed, Larry A.. No More Silence: An Oral History of the Assassination of President Kennedy (p. 338). Texas A&M University Press. Kindle Edition.
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on Tue 07 May 2019, 1:09 am
Bart,

As always thank you for the information you provide. So often it is context and sequence we miss in analyzing the facts surrounding the JFK assassination. You are really skilled at linking facts, context and sequence of events to present a more accurate perspective and rational picture of what likely happened.

Larry King [who has interviewed many key individuals associated with the JFK assassination including Jim Garrison, John and Nelly Connelly, Jim Wright and at least one Dallas Police officer] has said several times that LHO was saying "he was a patsy" as early as in the police car going from the Texas Theater to the Dallas Police Headquarters.

Here is one example beginning at 8:45. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=43jMzaGuAw8

For what it is worth, over the years, I have written by e-mail and hardcopy letter to Larry King several times asking for the name of this Dallas Police Officer without any response.
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on Tue 07 May 2019, 1:43 am
Couldn't agree more. Bartos " Prayerman" site is a veritable treasure trove of source materials, essays and analysis.
I found the work on Richard Bernabei especially interesting.
How come we hadn't heard about him until now? A true forgotten hero buried under the accumulated detritus from over 5 decades of tabloid bullshit.
The last time the JFK case really captured the public imagination was in the early 90s after Oliver Stone's film. The focal point and the catalyst was undoubtedly the Zapruder footage. " Back and to the left"..the Emperors nakedness revealed on the Silver Screen.
Enter the Research Community. With David Lifton in the lead, riding shotgun on a pantomime horse.
How did they choose t capitalise on this breakthrough? With the ARRB and all? Surely a critical mass could now be reached? Building on the work of the early researchers. Finally expose the Warren Report for the deceitful charade it was. Begin the process of rebuilding.
Instead we get Roscoe fucking White then the whole thing quickly descended into internecine squabbling over the Zapruder film's authenticity.
In my opinion a catastrophic strategic AND tactical error.Even if it was faked. The impact it had, and still has surely outweighs arguments about authenticity. Fight that battle when the war has been won. What to the vast majority care about such arcane details? What's more important? Seeing the Presidents head being blown off in such horrendous detail and in such a way that obviously contradicts the Official Fable. Or bickering over 7 foot women and the colour of Mary Moormans shoes?. It made the" research community" look like a bunch of fools. More interested in their petty doctrinal disputes. Reading Fetzer and Thompson squabble was like watching the old bastards up in the box on the Muppet Show.
The Peoples Front of the Plaza vs The Plazas Peoples Front..
And here we are again..nearly 30 years later..with simple compelling visual proof of Oswalds innocence. Backed up with solid documentary proof.
And what do we get? Sarah fucking Stanton and contrarian quibbles. Holding on tightly t the evidence that took them no further than the ocean floor..more interested in arguing with the deep sea bloaters about buttons. It's all eerily familiar. With Doyle the ultimate useful idiot and Larry Trotter, the illiterates illiterate attempting t muddy the waters. And the rest of the research cognoscenti busying themselves by arguing with David Von fucking Pein for the 500th time about the SBT.
Vinny summed it up perfectly:" no excuse for anyone not t get on the Prayer man train"
ROKCs work has been criminally neglected IMHO. It's so fucking demoralising.
The actual mechanics of how it went down- Oswalds alibi, the 2FLRE that never was, the phantom bus and cab ride, Oswalds interrogation- have been meticulously and expertly disassembled and put back together.
The original Prayer man thread, the Buell Frazier where's your rider? and others were joys t read. Ed and Greg's work on the Neely St thread in particular sticks in my mind.
There's no excuse for anyone not t see now. Unless their hands are covering up their eyes. I remember Dragos eloquent response t the Prayer man work:
"Fuck Prayerman" quoth the High Priest of the Deep Political, before embarking on a hyperbole strewn sermon about the all knowing all seeing Sponsors..it was like reading David Icke channeled by a first year English lit student. His idea of weaponising the truth would be having a second glass of Chateau La Tour before lunch.
Fuck all the mythologising..fuck all the bullshit and bluster..if I'd wanted t read a handful of pompous middle aged men preening each others egos and trying on each others tin foil hats...I'd have joined the Catholic church..Jeffries Lemkin et al have simply swapped a cardinals biretta for a tin foil hat.
Nearly 55 years later this is the last chance. The deep political conspirati with their paranoia drenched ravings have alienated the very people we need on our side. The sight of Ralph Cinque on Infowars being touted as an expert was the absolute nadir. If i was Fetzer inclined or even Fetzer curious i might think the whole Oswald as Doorman provocation had been dreamt up precisely to derail the Prayer man express...to wit; anyone who attempts t put Lee Oswald anywhere near the TSBD Doorway is Fetzer grade certifiable.
In my opinion Fetzer and his merry wankster cohorts have done more damage than anyone t the serious study of this case.
He and the sainted Jack White. JVB, Harvey and Lee, Oswald in the Doorway, wholesale film alterations, LBJ as Mastermind, Sinjin Hunt..the list is almost endless. And someone on Der Forum had the unbelievable audacity t refer t Bart as "Flat Earth Kamp" A fucking joke..if anything Bart is the Galileo and Der Forum the weary old Pope clinging desperately t outmoded beliefs.
Their work turned off more than one generation of critical thinkers. Leaving JFK research wallowing alongside the recently probed alien love children from Zeta Reticuli and the Alex Jones tin foil hat brigade in the tabloid infested gutter.
ROKCs work is the antithesis of that. ROKC brutally and sometimes cruelly exposes the utter bankruptcy of their approach. Thus ROKC is reviled by both the probed and by the probers. By the Deep Political theorists who thought Alice in Wonderland was a work of political science.
Sorry for the rant but when i compare something like Bartos work t the majority of what passes as JFK research it makes my blood boil.
Some people hate ROKC because ROKC exposes them as the fools and pedants they are. Greg's business nearly went under, he had a fucking heart attack too..no doubt the hours spent researching, not t mention the strain, contributed t his illness and his business problems..THAT'S the difference between the ROKC approach and those who treat research as an unsolvable philosophical conundrum or a polite parlour game..what's next? Deep Political Charades.." Your turn Sandy..its a book..and a cult like psuedo religious movement..three letters? Thats too easy.." Harvey and Lee" ok Sandy you've had your turn..you can get up off your knees now..give Brother Jimmy a chance.."
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on Tue 07 May 2019, 5:07 pm
"Reading Fetzer and Thompson squabble was like watching the old bastards up in the box on the Muppet Show.
The Peoples Front of the Plaza vs The Plazas Peoples Front.."

Splitter! 😂

The masses need their religion.
Tells them not to pry into matters of faith.
Like figure J.
Even the Harvey and Lee cult's supreme leader has dismissed us. (Wait for the SMUDGEGROVE REPLY BY ROKC AND PRAYERMAN Bart is processing)
Besides,
Lee Harvey Oswald's day was boring...
Till some goon in a theater grabbed him and his crotch.
Imaging waking up in Irving,
Try not to wake wife or baby
Find clothes and jacket to wear
Having a shitty cup of instant coffee,
Making a cheese sandwich,
Try to find a lunch sack
Get sandwich and apple into a lunch sack,
Look outside for Wesley,
He is late,
You go to Frazier's
You go to the door and see Buell is eating.
You wait for him to finish and brush his teeth.
Then you ride to work,
Only discussions are of weather and not parade, and being late.
Wes drops him off at front corner of building and goes to park.
Lee goes in, takes off jacket and starts pulling orders.
He picks the easiest orders and fills his clipboard,
Spends the day on first floor pulling books.
At around noon he sees everyone heading out to lunch.
Finishes an order and makes a call to Marina, she is outside hanging up laundry to dry with Ruth, and missed the call.
Lee goes to the domino room and starts to have lunch,
He goes and grabs a coke from upstairs,
He sees a lady who mentions the parade,
He says great have fun, and goes to front stairs where a pleasantly plump woman asks if he is going out to lunch
He says no he is just having the coke,
He goes downstairs in the lobby and sees another lady through the glass or just inside.
He sees she is pregnant.
He goes back to the domino room and there is a black employee in there alone at the domino table,
Lee grabs a newspaper and a booth
Eats lunch while reading
The black employee leaves.
He finishes his sandwich and apple and sees the black employee with another colored employee enter the rear of the building.
As he is reading and not yet finishing his coke he hears excitement from outside
He wanders towards the noises
He steps outside as the parade is passing
From his view he sees the limo pass by
He hears a firework or motorcycles backfire then a couple gunshots across the street.
He sees people running to see what happened.
He finishes his coke and goes into the lobby
He was going in to put the bottle in the crates for bottles kept in a small storage room but in comes a cop with his pistol out to check the roof
Lee begins to explain to the policeman the lobby stairs only go to the offices, and the lobby elevator only goes to the fourth floor
Brushing him aside, Roy Truly says follow me he's just an employee.
Then Lee goes to put his coke bottle away
There the big boss and his secretary see him in the storage room,
Lee goes to the bathroom to drop a deuce.
Lee hears Shelley saying no more work today to his wife over the phone.
Lee walks to the front door and hascto show his library card to exit.
Truly is there and says hes okay.
Lee goes to the corner and catches the Beckley bus.
He rides to Jefferson and walks to the theater passing a shoe store.
He checks the prices of tennis shoes,
Walks to the theater and buys a dollar ticket
Buys popcorn and sits down to watch film,
Eats the popcorn and is feeling thirsty so stands up
The theater lights come on
He sees cops enter the stage area and rear of theater
He sits back down
The cops search people in the seats in front of him
The cop comes to him and says stand up
He stands
Lee asks what's this all over
Cop puts his hand on Lee's crotch
Lee knocks the cops hat off as he brings his own hands to his crotch instinctively
The cop pushes Lee back into the seats and attempts to put a pistol in Lee's waistband
Lee pushes the gun away
Lee is punched, pulled, drug, twisted, choked, and handcuffed.
Multiple officers are injured
No charges are pressed tho....

Totally boring day in Dallas.
Ed
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on Wed 08 May 2019, 2:15 am
Look forward t reading Bartos response t Ole Brother Smudgegrove..now that he's borrowed a set of Brian's pom poms( i hope he gave them a thorough dry cleaning) and joined Brian, Mr Trotter (the Delphi Oracle comes t Dallas via the Sandoz Laboratory and Miss Gaals 1st Grade Remedial English Classes) and Dickie Gilbride( Playgirls Prohibitionist of the year 1963) in the anti Prayerman chorus line you know what the logical conclusion will be? After discussing the problem with Obi- Wank Kenobby Armstrong and the other 3 members of the cult ( remember the Cantina band in Star Wars? Can anyone honestly say they've seen the pink hermaphrodite keyboard playing elephant and Sandy the Singin Cowboy in the same room?) Smudgegrove will dazzle the Ed forum with this revelation- Listen Up! I've just spoken t John and he tells me there were actually TWO Sarah Stantons!! One a 300lb American woman while the other was a masculine looking 180lb dark haired Hungarian born go go dancer.
It was a cunning plan by the CIA t lower the Soviet birth rate by switching their exotic dancers with less attractive ones t stop Soviet men from getting turned on. It was the Hungarian Sarah Stanton who was in the TSBD Doorway that day.
American Sarah was round the back with American Lee having a threesome with De Niro Lovelady.
It's all so simple..you're getting sleepy..forget what Greg Parker and his ROKC minions say..you're getting very sleepy...as my friend Scum Cum.sorry Scrum Drum says they're just troll punks and deniers..your eyes are getting heavy..very heavy..now repeat after me " Help us oh master tell our Harveys from our Lees..in the name of Myra DeRouses Holy Stretch Marks let me never mistake my short bookish Hungarians for my tall husky Americans and may my fake Marguerites never smile in the name of Edwin Ekdahls Holy 6 foot frame..Amen"
greg parker
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Anatomy of Lee Harvey Oswald's Interrogations - Page 2 Empty Re: Anatomy of Lee Harvey Oswald's Interrogations

on Wed 08 May 2019, 6:05 am
First came the Goons

Then Monty Python

SNL

And now...  Ed, Alex, Stan & Steely...  

Pure gold.

_________________
Mixing Pop and Politics he asks me what the use is
I offer him embarrassment and my usual excuses
While looking down the corridor
Out to where the van is waiting
I'm looking for the Great Leap Forward

            Billy Bragg
-----------------------------
 Australians don't mind criminals: It's successful bullshit artists we despise. 
             Lachie Hulme            
-----------------------------
The Cold War ran on bullshit.
              Me

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Anatomy of Lee Harvey Oswald's Interrogations - Page 2 Empty Re: Anatomy of Lee Harvey Oswald's Interrogations

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