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Tippit Murder - who what why and when.

on Sat 26 May 2018, 3:46 pm
Dispatcher78.  
 12:54pm78 (Ptm. J.D. Tippit)78.  
 DispatcherYou are in the Oak Cliff area, are you not?  
 78Lancaster and Eighth.  
 DispatcherYou will be at large for any emergency that comes in.  
 7810-4.

 
 
The JFK Assassination Dallas Police Tapes
[size=32]History in Real Time

Part Two
 
 
 
 
[/size]
CitizenHello, police operator?  
 1:16pmDispatcherGo ahead. Go ahead, citizen using the police radio.  
 CitizenThere's been a shooting out here.  
 DispatcherWhere's it at?  
 DispatcherThe citizen using the police radio . . .  
 CitizenTenth Street.  
 DispatcherWhat location on Tenth Street?  
 CitizenBetween Marsalis and Beckley. It's a police officer. Somebody shot him. What -- what's . . . 404 Tenth Street.  
 DispatcherCan you hear me?  
  (Man and woman's voices in background)  
 Dispatcher78.  
 CitizenIt's in a police car, number 10.  
 Dispatcher78.  
 Dispatcher (?)78.  
 CitizenGot that?  
 CitizenHello, police operator. Did you get that?  
 DispatcherAttention. Signal 19, police officer, 510 E. Jefferson.  
 CitizenThank you.  
 35 (Ptm. J.M. Lewis)35.  
 259 (unknown)259.  
 DispatcherThe citizen using the police radio: Remain off the radio now.  
 Dispatcher91.
[size]

 
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/dpdtapes/tapes2.htm
[/size]
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Re: Tippit Murder - who what why and when.

on Sat 26 May 2018, 3:47 pm
Dispatcher to Tippit at 12.54pm

"you'll be at large for any emegency that comes in"

Tippit reports he is at Lancaster and Eighth.


Tippit was killed not more than 3 1/2 blocks away near 10th and Patton St. sometime after the last communication back to base at 12.54pm.







The hospital report notes Tippit was DOA at 1.15pm. 




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Re: Tippit Murder - who what why and when.

on Sat 26 May 2018, 3:49 pm
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Re: Tippit Murder - who what why and when.

on Sat 26 May 2018, 3:50 pm
Hello, police operator?  
 1:16pmDispatcherGo ahead. Go ahead, citizen using the police radio.  
 CitizenThere's been a shooting out here.  
 DispatcherWhere's it at?  
 DispatcherThe citizen using the police radio . . .  
 CitizenTenth Street.  
 DispatcherWhat location on Tenth Street?  
 CitizenBetween Marsalis and Beckley. It's a police officer. Somebody shot him. What -- what's . . . 404 Tenth Street.  
 DispatcherCan you hear me?  
  (Man and woman's voices in background)  
 Dispatcher78.  
 CitizenIt's in a police car, number 10.  
 Dispatcher78.  
 Dispatcher (?)78.  
 CitizenGot that?  
 CitizenHello, police operator. Did you get that?  
 DispatcherAttention. Signal 19, police officer, 510 E. Jefferson.  
 CitizenThank you.  
 35 (Ptm. J.M. Lewis)35.  
 259 (unknown)259.  
 DispatcherThe citizen using the police radio: Remain off the radio now.  
 Dispatcher91.



 
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/dpdtapes/tapes2.htm



So the transcribed police radio dispatch communication by the Washington Research Section has Citizen calling in at 1.16pm.


Strange that seeing the Methodist Hospital notes Tippits body arrived DOA at 1.15pm.



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Re: Tippit Murder - who what why and when.

on Sun 27 May 2018, 12:59 pm
Dispatcher to Tippit at 12.54pm

"you'll be at large for any emegency that comes in"

Tippit reports he is at Lancaster and Eighth.


Tippit was killed not more than 3 1/2 blocks away near 10th and Patton St. sometime after the last communication back to base at 12.54pm.







US secret service report on timing of Tippit's murder at 1.00pm. Taken from copies of the original police dispatch recordings.

Tippit was most likely shot and killed according to this report, around 1.00pm-1.05pm
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Re: Tippit Murder - who what why and when.

on Sun 27 May 2018, 2:48 pm
Tippit shot at 1.00pm-1.05pm

Credit Ed:
The witness Mrs. Wright whom called police said she called within seconds of the shooting (didn't wait a minute) and Dudley Hughes ambulance was dispatched within seconds of the call by police dispatcher. 








Ambulance arrived on scene with in a couple of minutes. 
1.03-1.07pm Ambulance on scene.


Ambulance officers Load the Truck and head to Methodist Hospital on Beckley. Trip takes 4 minutes or less.


At 1.15 at the hospital Tippit is pronounced dead on arrival.


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Re: Tippit Murder - who what why and when.

on Tue 29 May 2018, 9:47 am
https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh21/pdf/WH21_RobertsonV_Ex_1.pdf





Robertson was at the Adolphus hotel on a phone to John Allen of WFAA station at the time of the assassination according to the FBI report. 

So the timing for the above is around 12.32pm perhaps a moment or so before. We can assume this to be accurate because of the following statement.

Allen suddenly tells Robertson whilst on the phone "he's been hit" and left the phone.

Robertson hears whilst on the phone to Allen that JFK has been hit and Allen leaves the phone. Assuming the phone call has not lasted more than a few minutes then Robertson heads out of the building onto the Street Near Houston. Has to be around 12.35 12-40 pm give or take. 

Robertson immediately started running from the building out into the street toward Houston, Kennedy had already been taken to Hospital.

Should be around 12.40 maybe 12.45pm. Not much later than this anyway.

While at that location he along with fellow photographer (WFAA) Hugh Aynseworth heard on a police radio that officer Tippit had been shot in Oakcliff and they proceeded to Oakcliff.

My view would be Robertson and Aynesworth would not have waited at Houston for very long without moving to another location as required. No newsman in their right mind would wait there without making moves to attempt to follow the unfolding story of the assassination. Given that, I believe that Robertson had to have heard the news of the Tippit shooting over the police radio somewhere around 12.55pm-1.00pm. As I've said I just can't buy into two news guys just hanging around on Houston for too long after just hearing about the biggest news story of their careers.

When they arrived at the policeman's murder scene Tippit's body had already been removed from the vicinity of the shooting so they proceeded to the Texas theater in Oakcliff where Lee Harvey Oswald was apprehended by dallas policemen.


They drove as fast as they could to the Tippit murder scene, they missed the body it had already been transferred to Methodist Hospital.




Approximately a 6-7 minute drive.






allowing for traffic on the day that would have put them in the Oak Cliff area at Tenth and Patton anywhere between 1.07pm - 1.10pm
Robertson claims Tippits body had already been removed from the scene when they arrived.


Tippits body arrived at the Methodist Hospital at around 1.15pm The body would have been removed from the murder scene at approx 1.10pm
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Re: Tippit Murder - who what why and when.

on Sat 02 Jun 2018, 10:07 am


https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh17/pdf/WH17_CE_705.pdf

The 1:10pm time line if accurate is extremely important. In this document citizen is being asked to remain off the air. In other words the conversation regarding the report of a policeman shot - over the police radio has already transpired - prior to the 1:10pm time stamp. Allowing say- a minute or so for that conversation then the devil in this detail would have the Tippit murder having happened before 1:09pm.
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Re: Tippit Murder - who what why and when.

on Mon 04 Jun 2018, 10:08 am
Assuming Benavides is the first person whom tried to make contact with the DPD dispatch then that had to before Bowley had arrived at the scene at about 1:10pm according to his December 2nd affidavit


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Re: Tippit Murder - who what why and when.

on Mon 04 Jun 2018, 10:10 am
The following is an excerpt from a letter written to Joachim Joesten concerning a Shirley Martin interview with Hugh Aynesworth, Dallas Morning News reporter.










“… It has intrigued me that Aynesworth was so convinced in his conversation with me that Tippit had been killed around 1 p.m. Aynesworth is extraordinarily proud of the fact that he is the only reporter in the United States to have been at all four major scenes (the assassination, the Tippit killing immediately after, the arrest of Oswald in the Texas Theater, and the murder of Oswald in the police basement). 


When I praised Mr. Aynesworth for this and suggested that perhaps he should have been considered for the Pulitzer Prize (rather than Mr. [Merriman] Smith whom Mr. Aynesworth claims does not deserve the prize as another Dallas reporter did all his, Smith’s, writing for him), Mr. Aynesworth modestly admitted to an oversight on the part of the committee, but continued to speak at great length over his four unique experiences. 


When I asked Mr. Aynesworth how and when he first heard about Tippit, he replied: “I was standing near the Texas Book Building, all the other reporters had gone to Parkland (Hospital), but I felt a story was breaking near the building, when I heard a squad radio blast out that a policeman had been shot in Oak Cliff. This was around one o’clock. 


I ran to the car and went with it to Patton and Tenth. I had a hunch that the policeman’s murder was tied in with the assassination. I got to the Tenth Street area about 1:05, no later than 1:10 p.m. …” [1]


Years later, Aynesworth gave author Larry Sneed additional details. [2] He was at the police command post at the corner of Houston and Elm with Inspector Herbert Sawyer, Sgt. Calvin Owens, Sgt. Gerald Hill, Assistant District Attorney Bill Alexander, and news reporter Jim Ewell. As Gerald Hill urged Sawyer to get the crime lab over to the Texas School Book Depository, the police radio traffic was interrupted: “This is a citizen. A policeman’s been shot! He’s hurt pretty bad, I think!” The citizen then gave the location.


If Tippit was shot at precisely 1:00 p.m. and Aynesworth heard the unknown citizen’s call twoto three minutes later, then Craig’s time of 1:06 represents the time that it took for a messenger from the command post on the street to reach the search party on the sixth floor.


The unknown citizen’s call at 1:02 or 1:03 does not appear in the transcript of police radio messages. On the audio recording at precisely 1:02 there is 30 seconds of noise, indicating an erasure. About a minute later, at 1:03, the dispatcher attempted to reach Tippit and got no response.



After receiving the call, Hill, Alexander, and Owens promptly left for Oak Cliff. Aynesworth went with WFAA-TV newsmen Ron Reiland and Vic Robertson in the Channel 8 cruiser. 


Reiland drove the cruiser recklessly, making a lot of fast moves to pass other cars and barreling through intersections as fast as he could go, using an illegal flashing light accessory to warn other drivers. These details show how the three newsmen managed to reach the scene of the crime between 1:05 and 1:10.


Aynesworth statement to Martin agrees with that of T.F. Bowley who arrived at the scene at about the same time. He noted the time as 1:10 on his watch.

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Re: Tippit Murder - who what why and when.

on Mon 04 Jun 2018, 10:41 am
Warren Commission counsel David Belin wrote:

“The Rosetta Stone [the key to Egyptian hieroglyphics] to the solution of President Kennedy’s murder is the murder of Officer J. D. Tippit.” 

From the Warren Commission’s standpoint, the killing of Tippit, who presumably challenged the assassin’s flight after he killed Kennedy, was said to prove “that Oswald had the capacity to kill.”



Warren Commission critic Harold Weisberg saw Tippit’s murder instead as the government’s way of poisoning the public mind against Lee Harvey Oswald: 

“Immediately the [flimsy] police case [against Oswald] required a willingness to believe. This was provided by affixing to Oswald the opprobrious epithet of ‘cop-killer.’”
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Re: Tippit Murder - who what why and when.

on Mon 04 Jun 2018, 11:01 am
excerpt from a letter written to Joachim Joesten concerning a Shirley Martin interview with Hugh Aynesworth, Dallas Morning News reporter.





The unknown citizen’s call at 1:02 or 1:03 does not appear in the transcript of police radio messages. 


On the audio recording at precisely 1:02 there is 30 seconds of noise, indicating an erasure. 


About a minute later, at 1:03, the dispatcher attempted to reach Tippit and got no response.
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Re: Tippit Murder - who what why and when.

on Fri 08 Jun 2018, 9:46 am
Greg R Parker.
Tippit Essay

https://www.thenewdisease.space/tippit

Quoting from a 1967 interview with dispatcher Murray Jackson:


We had received a call from a citizen. They called us on the telephone and the call sheet came - came to me and there was a disturbance in street in the 400 block of East 10th. And I had called. I said '78' and he didn't answer. And almost immediately to [sic] this a citizen came in on the police radio and said 'send me some help; there;s been an officer shot out here.' And know that JD was the only one that should have been in Oak Cliff, my reaction was to call 78, and of course, JD didn't answer.

Greg wrote:



The call by phone was not the Davis girl. The testimony suggested she was a bit more specific than just calling in a "disturbance". And nor would Jackson refer to a shooting of a policeman as a mere "disturbance" which in police parlance, is no more than unruly behavior. 

I also believe Jackson misspoke in the interview and meant to say "almost immediately AFTER this, a citizen came in on te police radio...







From Det. Potts testimony


Mr. POTTS. When I was walking across the street there, I parked my car over at the Scottish Rite parking lot there and it's the Masonic lot and when I come across the street there at Commerce and Harwood this officer on the corner there said, "Did you hear about Tippit getting killed?" I said, "No; I didn't hear about that." He said, "Yes; I understand he got killed on a disturbance call over in Oak Cliff.


So:


excerpt from a letter written to Joachim Joesten concerning a Shirley Martin interview with Hugh Aynesworth, Dallas Morning News reporter.





The unknown citizen’s call at 1:02 or 1:03 does not appear in the transcript of police radio messages. 


On the audio recording at precisely 1:02 there is 30 seconds of noise, indicating an erasure. 


About a minute later, at 1:03, the dispatcher attempted to reach Tippit and got no response.






The excerpt from Greg Parker's Tippit Essay seems to suggest strongly that the erasure on the police recording was not the "citizen's call" (Police radio)  because it was made by phone. It may more likely have been Jackson sending Tippit to that disturbance call which was at 400 block of East 10th. 


I believe the following to be more likely the timeline and reason for Tippit being where he was when he was killed.




At 1:54 Dispatch and Tippit communicate (Assuming the times from the log are accurate for this)

At 1:02 there appears 30 seconds of noise on the radio dispatch recording indicating an erasure. 

It would seem then that that erasure was to delete the dispatch call to Tippit for the Disturbance 400 Block E 10th Street. 

At about 1:03 dispatch tries to call Tippit with no response.

It's then extremely likely Tippit was shot at or about 1:03.




Greg wrote:








Disturbance call made by phone so that call doesn't appear on radio logs. 
Murray sends Tippit. That call was erased. 
Someone uses Tippit radio to call in cop down in shooting.
Jackson tries to call Tippit, gets no response. In the 1967 interview he tries to claim he knew the victim was Tippit because he was the only officer supposed to be in Oak Cliff. 
That is CYA. There was one, maybe two other officers in the area. He claimed only Tippit to cover for the fact he had sent Tippit to that exact location and THAT is how he knew it was Tippit.
Second call on police radio confirms it is Tippit (via car number). 
 

......................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................

Either all coincidental and absolutely nothing to do with the assassination -or- there was no such disturbance call and Jackson sent Tippit there on that pretext, but it was really an ambush to further frame Oswald.



It would appear at least to me the former would be the most likely scenario








Last edited by Mick Purdy on Fri 08 Jun 2018, 11:49 am; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Tippit Murder - who what why and when.

on Fri 08 Jun 2018, 11:07 am
You snapped it right into focus for me Mick. Excellent.

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Re: Tippit Murder - who what why and when.

on Fri 08 Jun 2018, 11:36 am
Jake Sykes wrote:You snapped it right into focus for me Mick. Excellent.
Thanks Jake,

more thanks to Greg. I think it's becoming clear that Tippit's murder most likely was not part of the assassination but just as a lot here have suspected for a long time, a separate incident which was used to paint Oswald as a lone nut desperately fleeing a scene.
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Re: Tippit Murder - who what why and when.

on Fri 08 Jun 2018, 11:39 am
https://rtdna.org/content/scanners
 
 
47 C.F.R. § 73.1207(c)(1).    

In 1963, the FCC issued a Public Notice declaring that the prohibition in Section 705 “is applicable to the practice of monitoring police and fire radio transmissions for the purpose of obtaining information as to events worthy of on-the-spot news coverage.” Monitoring or Police and Fire Radio Transmissions by Broadcast Stations, Public Notice, 1 RR2d 291 (1963) (“1963 Public Notice”).  The Commission reasoned that “the activity of some few broadcast stations in monitoring and divulging to the general public the content of police and fire radio transmissions has resulted in interference with the work of police and fire departments contrary to the requirements of public safety” and warned broadcasters “that unauthorized use or divulgence of public safety messages is a violation of Section [7]05 of the Communications Act and may subject the licensees and others involved to criminal prosecution.”  Id.  As an alternative, the FCC recommended that broadcasters “contact officials of the public safety agencies whose radio transmissions are desired to be monitored in order to obtain the necessary authorization and to ascertain the conditions under which use and divulgence are appropriate.”  
 
As with my own personal experience in the News game in the late 70’s this was standard procedure, it was illegal yes – but used extensively in gathering information on the spot. This would include scanning Ambulance and Fire department frequencies too.
According to the above it’s a fair bet that scanners were being used by the media at the time of Kennedy’s assassination.
This could go some way in explaining how news was being gathered quickly as it unfolded especially regarding the Tippit murder and the Theatre arrest of Oswald.
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Re: Tippit Murder - who what why and when.

on Fri 08 Jun 2018, 12:30 pm
A 2001 google group post by Jim Olmstead:

 dcwillis: One of the two sons lived out of state......I forget which
one.....the other son was deeply involved in stolen cars.....I believe he
is the younger of the two....James?  There is some information around
dealing with the DPD arresting this son, and he almost broke his neck
trying to escape.  Two of the Tippit wittnesses, that live at the end of
the street were conncected to this son and one I believe was on probation
at the time of the Tippit killing.
I will have to get into my files, I beleive that I posted on this last
year.
just  remembered this might help

Mr. BALL. Did you go down to where the policeman was shot?
          Mr. SMITH. Yes.
          Mr. BALL. What did you see?
          Mr. SMITH. Saw the policeman lying on the ground. I mean on the
street.
          Mr. BALL. And did a crowd gather around there?
          Mr. SMITH. Yes, sir.
          Mr. BALL. How long did you stay there?
          Mr. SMITH. About 45 minutes.
          Mr. BALL. Did you give your name to the police?
          Mr. SMITH. No, sir.
          Mr. BALL. Why?
          Mr. SMITH. Because I was on probation. I thought it might hurt
my probation record.
          Mr. BALL. All right; you did tell someone you had seen it,
didn't you?
          Mr. SMITH. Yes.
          Mr. BALL. Who?
          Mr. SMITH. This boy I ran around with.
          Mr. BALL. What's his name?
          Mr. SMITH. James Markham.
          Mr. BALL. Is he the son of Helen Markham?
          Mr. SMITH. Yes, sir.






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Re: Tippit Murder - who what why and when.

on Fri 08 Jun 2018, 12:36 pm
Ed wrote:Why I believe it was Helen's son.

Helen gave a false description.

Helen became confused and flustered.

Helen picked Oswald out of lineup, and Lee was only one whom gave his real place of work the TSBD when the subjects were asked to state their name(?) and place of employment, the cops he was handcuffed to gave false answers to their place of employment (made up answers)
Lee was bruised, beaten, in shambles and complaining.

Helen had LOTS of help in the line up room (normally one cop with witness, partner in showup room) 




Helen had this to say in 1976:

Thirteen years ago, Helen Grant, then Helen Louise Markham, was walking toward the bus she caught every day to get to her job at the Eat-Well Cafe when she saw Lee Harvey Oswald murder Officer J.D. Tippit. Mrs. Grant says she reported the shooting by calling in on Tippit’s squad car and was holding the policeman’s head in her hands when he died. After being questioned at police headquarters, she still managed to spend the rest of the day at work waiting tables. Mrs. Grant recalls it as “like a nightmare, that’s something you’ll never forget.” According to her, Oswald’s mother threatened her during visits and phone calls after the assassination. “She scared the life out of me.” Since then Mrs. Grant has suffered a stroke and says her left side still troubles her. Now married to a concession operator who is blind, she is reluctant to reveal her age, but says she has 14 grandchildren. She lives in a duplex next door to the one she was living in on November 22, 1963, and earns extra money by managing the apartment complex next to her home. What does she think about that weekend today? “It makes a nervous wreck out of you. I still feel that way.”


Concession operator, concession theft... WTF is going on here with a blind man selling concessions (I didn't know she was married to Butch Burroughs j/k   )

I believe the walkie talkies were either used for burglaries, one for a spotter one for the inside man. Walkie talkies would come in handy to pull off a coordinated shooting also. Shaver would be to cut hair afterwards to change appearances, and pillows are to change appearance before the deed so everyone is looking for a heavy man with longer hair???
"She later described the killer as being short and somewhat on the heavy side, with slightly bushy hair."
Bushy hair... not anymore buzzzzzzzz.
I believe her son was on his way home knowing when Helen would be gone for work.
I believe Helen saw her son shooting the cop, she panicked and her son ran away. 

Helen was a family member of Raymond Hamilton who died in the electric chair in 1938, and Floyd Hamilton, brothers.
Floyd Hamilton was eventually pardoned by then President Lyndon B. Johnson of all criminal Charges and by Governor John B. Connolly of all Texas Charges.

Escape attempt shows James Markham would likely murder JD Tippit and run than go to prison. Of course when James was arrested he no longer had his pistol... 
Here is James and his Huntsville prison burial:
https://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=36482057


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Re: Tippit Murder - who what why and when.

on Fri 08 Jun 2018, 12:45 pm
Greg wrote:


We now have two witnesses to the Tippit murder close to James - his mother and a friend - both tried to avoid hanging around to speak to police.

There is also this curiosity from the FBI report dated 12/13/63:


SMITH advised that his reason for being in the area was that he was visiting a friend of his, one JIMMY BURT, who was living with his father-in-law, DAVID SCHAFFER at 505 East 10th Street. He said he thought JIMMY might have seem the shooting also but he wan not certain for he believed be had arrived at JIMMY'S house prior to the time of JIMMY'S arrival. He advised that JIMMY was AWOL from the Army Missile Base at Denton, Texas, at the time. He said that he believed JIMMY was awaiting discharge for being AWOL on a number of occasions. He believed that JIMMY was presently visiting his father, ROSS BURT somewhere in Louisiana, possibly Bellmont.
SMITH advised that he did not have any relatives in New Mexico and ANZAIWA, his brother-in-law, is originally from Refurgio (ph), Texas, near Corpus Christi. He said that he did not believe ANZALDUA had any relatives in New Mexico either.
The FBI didn't get to Burt for another 13 days and gives a completely different account:
 
He and a friend WILLIAM SMITH were sitting in his brother, BILLY BURT's house located at the corner of 9th and Denver Streets, Dallas. It was some time after lunch when they heard two gunshots. He and SMITH immediately ran from the house toward his car, a 1952 two—tone blue Ford which was parked facing south on Denver Street. As they ran from the house they heard four more shots making a total of six.
BURT Said he drove his car to the next intersection which is Denver and 10th Streets and turned west on 10th. He immediately saw a police car parked at the curb in the middle of the block. It was parked facing east on 10th Street. A police officer was lying on the street near the left front wheel. BURT later recognized him as being an officer who frequented that neighborhood. This particular officer was known by the name "Friendly" to the residents of that area.
BURT parked his car in front of the police car on the same side of the street with the front end facing the west. He and SMITH jumped out of the car and as they did so he looked west on 10th Street. At that moment he caught a glimpse of a man running on the sidewalk on the south side of the street. The man at this point had reached the intersection of 10th and Patton Streets. He described this man as a white male, approximately 5'8". He was wearing a light colored short jacket. BURT stated he could not describe the man further as he was never closer than 50 to 60 yards from the man. He said at one point he did notice the man had a pistol in his right hand. Although he is familiar with hand weapons he said that because of the distance he could not describe the pistol.
Smith was interviewed by the WC in April 64.  Burt was never interviewed by them.

Somehow by April, Smith now recalled that Burt was with him. He sticks to the address he gave the FBI, and again mentions no car ride. 

I know they can claim lying due to being on probation and being AWOL respectively, but when you add James and mother into the picture, I think there was another reason altogether for the lies.




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Re: Tippit Murder - who what why and when.

on Fri 08 Jun 2018, 12:50 pm
 by Mick Purdy on Thu 27 Apr 2017, 2:05 am

In 1977, ambulance driver Clayton 
Butler was interviewed by 
investigators for the House Select 
Committee on Assassinations. When 
asked how long it took him to reach 
the scene, he replied: "I was on the 
scene one minute or less. From the 
time we received the call in our 
dispatch office until Officer Tippit was 
pronounced dead at Methodist 
Hospital was approximately four 
minutes. 









[url=https://archive.org/stream/nsia-TippitJD/nsia-TippitJD/Tippitt J D 68_djvu.txt]https://archive.org/stream/nsia-TippitJD/nsia-TippitJD/Tippitt%20J%20D%2068_djvu.txt[/url]






The Dudley M. Hughes 
Funeral Home 
 
The ambulance reached the murder 
scene so quickly simply because the 
central ambulance dispatching point 
for southern Dallas was only about 
three blocks away. It was, and still is, 
the Dudley M. Hughes Funeral Home, 
located at 400 East Jefferson 
Boulevard 
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Re: Tippit Murder - who what why and when.

on Sat 09 Jun 2018, 8:30 pm
There is a mathematically provable very high probability that the Tippit murder was part of the JFK assassination plot. Hence, there is a very slim possibility that it was not.

The fact that James Markham may have played a bit part in the Tippit sub-plot doesn’t negate that bigger picture.
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Re: Tippit Murder - who what why and when.

on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 10:19 am
Goban,

Thanks mate

I've waxed and waned on the Tippit murder for as long as I can remember. But I'm also mindful of where the vast majority of information on which we rely to piece the case together for the murder originates from. 

Dallas police to my mind used the murder to solidify the assassination case against Oswald. I really don't know who shot Tippit, in my opinion only the actual perpetrator and a few of the eye witnesses at the scene would've known.

It maybe true with what you say, and to be honest I've never never read about the mathematical possibilities for the murder being part of the JFK assassination plot. I'm open to most things.
I'd be interested in seeing the mathematical probabilities spelled out for the Tippit murder being part of the JFK assassination plot or not. Although I confess I'm not an academic, far from it.
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Re: Tippit Murder - who what why and when.

on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 10:33 am



The Dudley M. Hughes 
Funeral Home 
 
The ambulance reached the murder 
scene so quickly simply because the 
central ambulance dispatching point 
for southern Dallas was only about 
three blocks away. It was, and still is, 
the Dudley M. Hughes Funeral Home, 
located at 400 East Jefferson 
Boulevard 
Posts : 354
Join date : 2013-07-16
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Re: Tippit Murder - who what why and when.

on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 7:37 pm
We recently had a fairly robust discussion about the Tippit murder, apparently in your absence, Mick. I seem to be in a minority of one who thinks there is a mathematically provable very high probability that the Tippit murder was part of the JFK assassination plot. My argument is based mainly on probability theory. I said that the argument may have to be modified by some kind of non-mathematical calculation or algorithm as it is too “abstract”, for want of a better word.

I think I may have since found the key, though I lack the expertise to apply it. I’ll come back to it below. First, a summary of the mathematical argument:

Over many years up to and including the early sixties the frequency of DPD officers being fatally shot while on duty was about one officer per year. Therefore, the chances of that happening on any given day were one in 365. The chances of it happening during a given half hour period on any given day were one is many multiples of 365. And there’s also the location factor which would lengthen the odds even further.

It follows from this that the probability of the JFK and JD Tippit shootings being connected is at least 10,000:1.

I think I may be mistaken in incorrectly equating (a) the probability of the concurrence of the JFK and Tippit killings with (b) the probability of their being part of the same plot. The two things may not be the same because they are in two different dimensions so to speak. Calculation (a) is purely mathematical. Calculation (b) involves all kinds of “real life” factors that cannot be numerically quantified.

Therefore calculation (a) must be modified by calculation (b). That modification may or may not reduce the odds considerably. There was an interesting discussion of the Tippit murder recently in the Education Forum during which numerous pieces of “real life” circumstantial evidence linking the Tippit murder to the JFK assassination were adduced.

The question is how that “real life” evidence relates to the mathematical argument. If anything, it would seem to underpin it.

However, let’s assume for the sake of argument that allowing for “real life” non-mathematical factors would reduce the odds. While it would probably be impossible to quantify that reduction numerically, let’s assume the odds would be reduced to one hundredth of what they were. One would be still left with odds of at least 100:1.

That is to say, the odds in favour of the JFK and Tippit murders being part of the same plot are at least 100 times greater than the odds against. Given those odds, it would be perverse to work on the assumption that they are not part of the same plot.

The key, algorithm or calculation method I alluded to above is Bayes’ theorem, which is defined as:

“a theorem describing how the conditional probability of each of a set of possible causes for a given observed outcome can be computed from knowledge of the probability of each cause and the conditional probability of the outcome of each cause.”

https://www.google.ie/search?q=bayes+theorem&oq=Bayes+theorem&aqs=chrome.0.69i59j69i60j0l4.4807j0j8&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

Now all that’s needed is a statistician, logician, mathematician, actuary or some such expert to explain how to apply Bayes’ theorem to the JFK-Tippit murder problem – and indeed to many other aspects of the JFK case.

In the meantime, given the odds, it would seem that the most rational working hypothesis upon which to base a study of the Tippit murder is that it is part of the JFK assassination plot. The fable of the blind men and the elephant seems apposite.
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Re: Tippit Murder - who what why and when.

on Sun 10 Jun 2018, 9:10 pm
Do you believe that Tippit was part of the conspiracy,Goban.
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