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David Ferrie's Early Influence Over Lee Oswald

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David Ferrie's Early Influence Over Lee Oswald

Post by Guest on Fri 02 Aug 2013, 6:46 am

Someone has today bumped a thread at the EF that I had forgotten I had contributed something to, in between ripping Mike Williams a new arsehole and trying to crack Tom Purvis's Enigma code posts.

The thrust of my post was whether David Ferrie was pulling Oswald's strings while he was in the NOLA Civil Air Patrol:

Marguerite Oswald was onto David Ferrie, although not by name, in February/March 1964.

When she appeared on a Cleveland Radio Show, Harv Morgan's "Contact", on Februray 24, 1964, Marguerite made the following statement to a caller's question:

"Q. KARL: Was Lee OSWALD a "loner" and did not have close friends?
A: I will bring this out in another program. It is too long a story for the present program. I have a wonderful thing to relate that happened to Lee, and it is something that has never been made public. I intend to make this known on Radio Station WBZ, Boston, on Bob Kennedy's "Contact" program next Wednesday (2/26/64) from 6:30 to 8:)) PM or, if we cannot do the program on this date, it will be on the following Monday (3/2/64). He had a normal relationship with all people."


The transcript for the show is here:

http://www.maryferre...12&relPageId=97 (This runs for 15 pages)

When she appeared on Bob Kennedy's show at the beginning of March, Marguerite's "wonderful thing" was the following (taken from an FBI report):

"Mrs Oswald then indicated that she was sure her son was in the employ of the U.S. Government, and then said she was going to to divulge information she had never before discussed. This information consisted of a statement by Mrs. Oswald to the effect that Lee Harvey Oswald, when he was 15 1/2 years of age, was a Civil Air Patrol cadet. She said that while he was in the Civil Air Patrol, a civilian who she believes was associated with the Civil Air Patrol, induced Lee Oswald to join the United States Marines. Mrs. Oswald said she was living in New Orleans at that time, and that her son had left school without her knowledge and tried to obtain her consent to have him enlist in the U.S. Marines. She stated that a Marine Recruiting Officer also appeared at her home and tried to get her permission to allow Lee Oswald to enlist in the Marines, however, she refused. She said that her son, Lee Harvey Oswald, at the age of 15 or 16, was reading communist books, and that she knew he was reading these books. According to Mrs. Oswald, her son obtained these books in the public library, and was also studying a Marine Manual that had been left in her home by another son, who was a member of the United States Marines at that time. The point Mrs. Oswald said she wanted to make was that at the age of 16, Lee Harvey Oswald was studying communism and the Marine Manual to become an agent for our intelligence services."

http://www.maryferre...12&relPageId=89 (Last paragraph of document)

Unfortunately, I cannot find any sort of show transcript for the Bob Kennedy show so do not know the specifics of what has been paraphrased by the FBI. I'm sure most of us would agree that she is talking about David W. Ferrie and it was he that was instrumental in "grooming" Oswald leading up to his enlistment in the United States Marines. And also the reason why Guy Banister was using Oswald's name whilst Oswald was in the Soviet Union. But it would take another three years for Marguerite's "wonderful thing" to be fully realised.


All pages of FBI report:
http://www.maryferre...12&relPageId=87
http://www.maryferre...12&relPageId=88
http://www.maryferre...12&relPageId=89
http://www.maryferre...12&relPageId=90
http://www.maryferre...12&relPageId=91

Related documents:
http://www.maryferre...12&relPageId=92
http://www.maryferre...12&relPageId=93

http://www.maryferre...12&relPageId=94
http://www.maryferre...12&relPageId=95
http://www.maryferre...12&relPageId=96

Newspaper report of WBZ "Contact" show:
http://www.maryferre...bsPageId=737113

Why do I, and many others, believe Jim Garrison? For the very simple reason that he was right..."


END OF POST

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Re: David Ferrie's Early Influence Over Lee Oswald

Post by James DiEugenio on Fri 02 Aug 2013, 8:49 am

One of reasons I am glad to be out of Simkin's nuthouse is not having to deal with that liar Ray Carroll.  FIrst about Mark Lane and then Marina.

And he was always on JG as an Oswald accuser. 

What a loon.

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Re: David Ferrie's Early Influence Over Lee Oswald

Post by Guest on Fri 02 Aug 2013, 9:00 am

James DiEugenio wrote:One of reasons I am glad to be out of Simkin's nuthouse is not having to deal with that liar Ray Carroll.  FIrst about Mark Lane and then Marina.

And he was always on JG as an Oswald accuser. 

What a loon.

 We have a Mark Lane thread here, Jim, where I raised my own issues concerning some of Lanes strange decisions.  Everyone has their own views and I respect the opinions of the members here who think he has always been a white knight searching for justice.  I don't share those sentiments through and through.  If you get a chance I wouldn't mind your take on Jonestown and Lane's bizarre involvement.

Carroll, meanwhile, is simply an antagonistic little turd.  The "I say old chap" routine he par takes in simply suggests he's not a real Irishman like he claims.  One can only hope a big fucking box falls on his head next time he goes into his garage to look for the tape he doesn't have.

I think we're all better off out of there if I'm honest with you.  Had a little look over there earlier.  Von Pein's bullshit is still being smeared all over the walls.  75% of our time was wasted counteracting and responding to complete bollocks.  It wore me out.  I also hope Paul Trejo has been hit by a bus.

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Re: David Ferrie's Early Influence Over Lee Oswald

Post by greg parker on Fri 02 Aug 2013, 5:21 pm

She said that while he was in the Civil Air Patrol, a civilian who she believes was associated with the Civil Air Patrol, induced Lee Oswald to join the United States Marines
She stated that a Marine Recruiting Officer also appeared at her home and tried to get her permission to allow Lee Oswald to enlist in the Marines, however, she refused. 
Marguerite is differentiating between the person associated with CAP and the Recruitment officer.

Going through her testimony, I conclude that the CAP associated person was none other than Ed Voebel.

Could Ferrie have been the Recruitment Officer? That is entirely possible. It is recorded that he encouraged some boys to join the Marines. The question is, did he have - or have access to - a Marine uniform (which I presume a recruitment officer would be wearing)?

The Cleveland, Ohio USAR MI units were involved in the studies and evaluations of Korean POWs during the time that Ferrie was in the USAR in Cleveland.

From the HSCA Ferrie bio - "In 1950, Ferrie returned to Cleveland. He worked as an insurance inspector,(57) and joined the Army Reserve for a 3-year stint, leaving with an honorable discharge in 1953." From such studies, a profile of potential defectors was developed... and Lee's "Recruiter", according to Marguerite, was the one who encouraged his reading of Marx - essential reading for all the best defectors...   

There are a hell of a lot of issues raised in Marguerite's testimony - even just in this one area of Lee's recruitment, her belief he was being trained as an agent, and the defection... 

A couple of examples - 
The reason why he didn't go into the Marines until October 24th was the recruiting officer at the Marines could not understand his birth certificate, because his father had died 2 months before. So I had to send for an affidavit, even though I had the death notice from the paper and everything, and they could have. they could not understand that about that two months. I had to send to New Orleans for an affidavit of his father's death. And so then Lee joined the Marines on October 24th. 
Okay so the Marines couldn't understand how Lee could be born 2 months after his father died. Were they total maroons, or do New Orleans women have a gestation period of less than 2 months?  I don't buy it. There had to be some other reason for the delay that they could not openly say, then or now. I just can't figure out what.

Oswald lied on the actual recruitment papers by declaring he had never been rejected for service before. His previous attempt to join before he was of age, failed.
Now, a recruiting officer from the Marine Reserve in New Orleans, La., was in my home the next day when I arrived from work, with Lee, in uniform, in the home when I got into the home. He introduced me to him and he said, "Mrs. Oswald"--he didn't tell me what to do. He was very vague about the thing. 
I said, "No, Lee is too young, age 16, to join the Marines. They are liable to send him overseas." 
He said, "There is less delinquency in Japan and those places than we have here." 
He saw nothing wrong with it. 
What he was doing was telling me to falsify his birth certificate, but not in plain words. He was telling me it would be all right for the boy to join the Marines. He came to my home personally. 
So I went to an attorney with Lee, because here is the thing. 
Lee's birth record is in New Orleans. And I knew that the Marine Corps could easily check on this child, age 16--his birth record. So in order to have a happy situation, so I could work, and to see Lee, I went to an attorney and paid $5 and said that I lost Lee's birth certificate, and kind of motioned to the attorney. I knew it would not stand up. I bought Lee a duffle bag and everything, and Lee went-we told him goodbye, and Lee was going to join the Marines. 
I had to accept that, gentlemen. There was no other way I could do, but accept the fact to let him go. 
Mr. RANKIN. Who was that attorney? 
Mrs. OSWALD. Mr. Clem Sehrt. 
Mr. BOGGS. What did Mr. Sehrt allegedly tell you? 
Mrs. OSWALD. Pardon? 
Mr. BOGGS. What did Mr. Sehrt tell you? 
Mrs. OSWALD. Mr. Sehrt is a family friend. 
Mr. BOGGS. I know Mr. Sehrt very well. 
Mrs. OSWALD. He said according to attorney ethics that he would not be able to advise me. Before you came in, sir, I had stated that. 
Now, when I get interrupted, I lose this is a big thing for me. I am not making excuses. But, gentlemen, it is awfully hard to do this. 
So Lee came home. And he said the captain said that he was too young. 
Now, I don't question much. I don't know whether Lee changed his mind, or they sent Lee home. I do not know. I do not question that. 
All right. 
Lee, at age 16, read Robert's Marine manual back and forth. He knew it by heart. Robert had just gotten out of the Marines, and his manual was home. And Lee started to read communistic material along with that. 
The above shows his failed attempt to enlist, but also has two other issues:

1. Would a Recruitment Officer really encourage someone to give false information on government documents? 
2. Were Recruitment Officers really in the habit of making home visits?


Last edited by greg parker on Sat 03 Aug 2013, 8:47 am; edited 1 time in total

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Re: David Ferrie's Early Influence Over Lee Oswald

Post by James DiEugenio on Fri 02 Aug 2013, 11:59 pm

Concerning your last two queries. 
 
I think that is why many think it was Ferrie.
 
I agree Marguerite's testimony is really interesting. That is why Specter and the WC tried to make her into a loon.

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Re: David Ferrie's Early Influence Over Lee Oswald

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