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Rifles seen in TSBD and around the Grassy Knoll on 11/20/63

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Rifles seen in TSBD and around the Grassy Knoll on 11/20/63

Post by capone81 on Wed 28 Aug 2013, 1:36 pm

Does anyone have anymore info about the Roy Truly and Warren Caster rifle story from 11/20/63? Has anyone looked into whether they may have been part of the conspiracy? The whole thing seems highly suspicious given that it was only two days before 11/22/63

---------------------

Testimony of Roy Truly:


Mr. BALL. On November 20, 1963, you saw two guns owned by Mr. Warren Caster, can you tell me where and when and the circumstances under which you saw these guns? 

Mr. TRULY. It was during the lunch period or right at the end of the lunch period on November 20. Mr. Caster came in the door from the first floor and spoke to me and showed me two rifles that he had just purchased. I looked at these and picked up the larger one of the two and examined it and handed it back to Mr. Caster, with the remark that it was really a handsome rifle or words to that effect, at which time Mr. Caster explained to me that he had bought himself a rifle to go deer hunting with, and he hadn't had one and he had been intending to buy one for a long time, and that he had also bought a .22 rifle for his boy. 


Mr. BALL. Did you handle the .22 rifle? 
Mr. TRULY. Not that I recall. 
Mr. BALL. You did see it, though? 
Mr. TRULY. I did see it. 
Mr. BALL. Was it out of the carton? 
Mr. TRULY. The carton was open, I believe, and I saw it. I don't recall picking it up or taking it out of the carton, but I could see it lying in the bottom part of the carton. 
Mr. BALL. And you did take the large rifle out? 
Mr. TRULY. And raised it to my shoulder and go through the motion of it, but not cocking it---just looking at it. 
Mr. BALL. Who else was there besides you and Mr. Caster? 
Mr. TRULY. Well, the only person I can recall being there was Mr. Shelley. 
Mr. BALL. And what is his position with the Texas School Book Depository? 
Mr. TRULY. He is manager of the miscellaneous department. 
Mr. BALL. Was this in the open warehouse? 
Mr. TRULY. Yes; right at the front. Mr. Caster had placed the cartons on the counter near the front door and that's where the rifles were when I them, and I picked one up out of the cartons. 
Mr. BALL. And were they employees of the Texas School Book company on the first floor at that time? 
Mr. TRULY. Yes; they were---as I recall the time that the boys had ably gone back to work and could have been walking around before they went in the shipping department. 
Mr. BALL. That would have been about what time of the day? 
Mr. TRULY. I'd say around 1 o'clock--very close to it. It could have a little after or a little before. The boys go back to lunch at 12:45, so I'm not too clear. 
Mr. BALL. What happened to these two rifles, Mr. Truly, that Mr. Caster got during the noon hour? 
Mr. TRULY. They were placed back in the carton and Mr. Caster carried them out of the lobby door with him. That's the last I saw them. 
Mr. BALL. Did you ever see them again? 
Mr. TRULY. Never--never. 
Mr. BALL. Did you ever see from that day until Friday, November 22, did you ever see those guns in the School Book Depository Building? 
Mr. TRULY. No, sir; I never did. 

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Re: Rifles seen in TSBD and around the Grassy Knoll on 11/20/63

Post by capone81 on Wed 28 Aug 2013, 1:39 pm

Also on 11/20/63, the DPD reported seeing several men sighting a rifle near the Grassy Knoll. 

I wonder if these stories are connected or just another strange coincidence in this case...

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Re: Rifles seen in TSBD and around the Grassy Knoll on 11/20/63

Post by ianlloyd on Wed 28 Aug 2013, 4:45 pm

Ian Griggs interviewed Warren Caster later in his life and Caster apparently confirmed the innocent nature of the rifles he took into the TSBD. It's in Griggs's book, No Case To Answer...

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Re: Rifles seen in TSBD and around the Grassy Knoll on 11/20/63

Post by greg parker on Wed 28 Aug 2013, 4:59 pm


_________________
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Re: Rifles seen in TSBD and around the Grassy Knoll on 11/20/63

Post by beowulf on Wed 28 Aug 2013, 11:47 pm

Ian Griggs interviewed Warren Caster later in his life and Caster apparently confirmed the innocent nature of the rifles he took into the TSBD. It's in Griggs's book, No Case To Answer...

No statute of limitations on murder, of course Caster will confirm the innocent nature of the rifles. Its not like Caster (assuming he was involved) is going to tell a researcher, "Oh yeah, after Oswald told the cops about the guns, Truly and I had to come up with a cover story fast to explain them. THAT was a close one!".

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Re: Rifles seen in TSBD and around the Grassy Knoll on 11/20/63

Post by Hasan Yusuf on Fri 30 Aug 2013, 7:06 am

On page 4 of the following Baylor file is information that Sam Pate, who had gone to the rear of the TSBD following the assassination, had seen DPD detective Charlie (C.W) Brown carrying two rifles out of the TSBD:
 
Http://digitalcollections.baylor.edu/cdm/compoundobject/collection/po-arm/id/41510/rec/28
 
This is an FBI interview with Sam Pate concerning his observations of the TSBD’s rear (WCD 529):
 
Http://www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/viewer/showdoc.do?Docid=10928&relpageid=7
 
The Same FBI interview with Sam Pate also found in WCD 897:
 
Http://www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/viewer/showdoc.do?Docid=11293&relpageid=59
 
Although there are contradictions in Pate’s recollections; and his claim of seeing smoke in the Zapruder film emanating from the driver’s side of the President’s limousine is utterly ridiculous, I don’t think this necessarily negates his claim of seeing Charlie Brown with the rifles. If Pate’s claim is true, then these were obviously Warren Caster’s rifles.

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Re: Rifles seen in TSBD and around the Grassy Knoll on 11/20/63

Post by Hasan Yusuf on Fri 30 Aug 2013, 7:08 am

Keep in mind that Pate told the FBI that he went to the rear of the TSBD. This was confirmed by James Elbert Romack. The following is from Charlie Brown’s testimony:
 
Mr. BELIN.
 
Then what did you do?
 
 
Mr. BROWN.
 
My partner went in the front of the building. I went to the back of the building, and I proceeded up the back stairs to the sixth floor where I met Captain Fritz and several other officers on the sixth floor.
 
Report by Brown to Chief Curry:
 
Http://jfk.ci.dallas.tx.us/09/0935-001.gif
 
“Detective [Jim] Leavelle went in one direction, and I went to the rear of the building [TSBD] and entered.”
 
Leavelle confirmed in his report to Chief Curry that he went to the TSBD with Brown, but there is nothing about which direction Brown had entered the building.
 
Http://jfk.ci.dallas.tx.us/09/0955-001.gif
 
Since Brown entered the rear of the TSBD, it’s only logical to believe that he exited via the rear where Pate was; and that he was carrying two rifles with him out the back of the building.
 
I also find it to be quite interesting that Brown was the DPD detective who took an affidavit from Seymour Weitzman, who, as we all know, claimed the rifle he found was a 7.65 mm Mauser.
 
More tomorrow if time permits.

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Re: Rifles seen in TSBD and around the Grassy Knoll on 11/20/63

Post by capone81 on Fri 30 Aug 2013, 10:12 am

Thanks for the information Hasan. There are so many odd stories surrounding this case. 

It's also worth noting that Arnold Rowland said he saw two men with rifles on the sixth floor of TSBD.

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Re: Rifles seen in TSBD and around the Grassy Knoll on 11/20/63

Post by Hasan Yusuf on Fri 30 Aug 2013, 10:19 am

No worries. When did Rowland say he saw two men with rifles?

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Re: Rifles seen in TSBD and around the Grassy Knoll on 11/20/63

Post by capone81 on Fri 30 Aug 2013, 1:26 pm

Hasan Yusuf wrote:No worries. When did Rowland say he saw two men with rifles?
I stand corrected. Rowland described two different men on the sixth floor but only one with a rifle.

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Re: Rifles seen in TSBD and around the Grassy Knoll on 11/20/63

Post by Hasan Yusuf on Fri 30 Aug 2013, 7:59 pm

I stand corrected. Rowland described two different men on the sixth floor but only one with a rifle.
No problem. I thought that's what you meant. The second man he saw was Eddie Piper.
 
http://reopenkennedycase.forumotion.net/t34-was-eddie-piper-on-the-6th-floor?highlight=was+eddie

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Re: Rifles seen in TSBD and around the Grassy Knoll on 11/20/63

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