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Geraldean Reid
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Frankie Vegas
StanDane
greg_parker
Albert Rossi
beowulf
ianlloyd
10 posters
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Geraldean Reid
Tue 26 Nov 2013, 1:44 am
Robert Groden's Absolute Proof has been out for one week, and I obtained a copy at the COPA conference. I've only had time to flip through it the plane ride back home, but will say it's aptly titled. There is some stunning stuff in here that's going to reshape my thinking on what actually occurred on that black day in Dallas. This book would be a great Christmas present to yourself. I think it's going to become something you can't do without, to stay current with the discussions about November 22. Seriously, it'll completely overhaul what you presently think you may know about the wounds to both JFK and Connally. And what's in the Z-film.
In the interests of JFK research, because it pertains to the recent discussions about Prayer Man, I'm posting Groden's interview with his mystery witness who said she was with Oswald at the time the shooting erupted. Contrary to popular belief, she isn't Geneva Hine. And contrary to popular belief, Mrs. Robert A. Reid is not Geraldine (or Jeraldean) Reid.
********************************
Quite a few years ago, I was given a lead about a key witness who was employed in the Texas School Book Depository. Her name was Geraldine Reid, and her interview conditions included no taping of her story and no revealing the story while she was alive. I recently received word and confirmation of her passing. At the time I did the interview, the witness appeared to be in her late seventies to early eighties. The interview took place near Fort Worth. She is mentioned only once in the Warren volumes, but was perhaps the single most important witness in the Kennedy case....
Geraldine Reid
The Warren Commission spoke to a Depository employee witness who they simply refer to as "Mrs. Robert Reid," failing to refer to her real first name, which was Delores. She was standing in front of the Book Depository as the motorcade drove by.
However, there was a second Mrs. Reid who worked on the second floor of the Book Depository. Her name was Geraldine Reid. The Warren Commission avoided mentioning this Mrs. Reid like the plague. She was flown to Washington and interrogated by the Commission. Her testimony was so devastating to their preconceived conclusion of Oswald's guilt that they buried all references to her. She said, "I was threatened to keep my mouth shut, or else."
Anyone reading the testimony of "Mrs. Robert Reid" would naturally assume that there had been only one 'Mrs. Reid'. In fact there were two: Mrs. Robert Reid (Delores) and Mrs. Geraldine Reid. Here, for the first time, is Geraldine Reid's story:
About one minute before the fatal shots were fired at the motorcade, Lee Oswald walked into the office across the second floor hallway from the snack room where he had been eating his lunch. He wanted to buy a bottle of soda and did not have the required change for the machine. He walked up to Geraldine Reid at her desk and handed her a dollar bill and asked her for change.
"Mr. Oswald didn't like pennies. I remember that," she recalled. "As I was counting out the change, I heard what I later learned were gunshots. Mr. Oswald and I looked at each other quizzically for a moment, but neither of us said anything about the sounds. I did not know that they were shots at the time. I gave Mr. Oswald the change and he turned and walked back into the hallway toward the snack room. That's the last time I saw him until he passed by me a few minutes later as he was leaving the building."
Approximately seventy-two seconds after the shots ended and Oswald had returned to the snack room to buy a soda from the machine, Officer Marrion Baker and Oswald's boss, Roy Truly, confronted him in the snack room. Truly told Baker that it was alright and that Oswald, in fact, worked for him. At that time, Truly mentioned to Lee that President Kennedy had been shot. Oswald seemed genuinely surprised. Baker and Truly then left the lunchroom and headed upstairs to investigate further. In the meantime, someone had informed Geraldine Reid about the assassination.
Geraldine Reid's final encounter with Lee Oswald occurred a few minutes later. "The last time I saw Mr. Oswald, he was leaving the building," Reid stated. "As he passed me by, I noticed that he had his jacket slung over his arm. I told him that the President had just been shot and he simply said 'Oh?' or something like that, and kept on walking out of the office to go downstairs and, I assume, out of the building."
**********************************
Groden also spoke with a corroborating witness, an ONI investigator, who confirmed that she had been interviewed by the Warren Commission and who "saw suppressed documents on her."
In the interests of JFK research, because it pertains to the recent discussions about Prayer Man, I'm posting Groden's interview with his mystery witness who said she was with Oswald at the time the shooting erupted. Contrary to popular belief, she isn't Geneva Hine. And contrary to popular belief, Mrs. Robert A. Reid is not Geraldine (or Jeraldean) Reid.
********************************
Quite a few years ago, I was given a lead about a key witness who was employed in the Texas School Book Depository. Her name was Geraldine Reid, and her interview conditions included no taping of her story and no revealing the story while she was alive. I recently received word and confirmation of her passing. At the time I did the interview, the witness appeared to be in her late seventies to early eighties. The interview took place near Fort Worth. She is mentioned only once in the Warren volumes, but was perhaps the single most important witness in the Kennedy case....
Geraldine Reid
The Warren Commission spoke to a Depository employee witness who they simply refer to as "Mrs. Robert Reid," failing to refer to her real first name, which was Delores. She was standing in front of the Book Depository as the motorcade drove by.
However, there was a second Mrs. Reid who worked on the second floor of the Book Depository. Her name was Geraldine Reid. The Warren Commission avoided mentioning this Mrs. Reid like the plague. She was flown to Washington and interrogated by the Commission. Her testimony was so devastating to their preconceived conclusion of Oswald's guilt that they buried all references to her. She said, "I was threatened to keep my mouth shut, or else."
Anyone reading the testimony of "Mrs. Robert Reid" would naturally assume that there had been only one 'Mrs. Reid'. In fact there were two: Mrs. Robert Reid (Delores) and Mrs. Geraldine Reid. Here, for the first time, is Geraldine Reid's story:
About one minute before the fatal shots were fired at the motorcade, Lee Oswald walked into the office across the second floor hallway from the snack room where he had been eating his lunch. He wanted to buy a bottle of soda and did not have the required change for the machine. He walked up to Geraldine Reid at her desk and handed her a dollar bill and asked her for change.
"Mr. Oswald didn't like pennies. I remember that," she recalled. "As I was counting out the change, I heard what I later learned were gunshots. Mr. Oswald and I looked at each other quizzically for a moment, but neither of us said anything about the sounds. I did not know that they were shots at the time. I gave Mr. Oswald the change and he turned and walked back into the hallway toward the snack room. That's the last time I saw him until he passed by me a few minutes later as he was leaving the building."
Approximately seventy-two seconds after the shots ended and Oswald had returned to the snack room to buy a soda from the machine, Officer Marrion Baker and Oswald's boss, Roy Truly, confronted him in the snack room. Truly told Baker that it was alright and that Oswald, in fact, worked for him. At that time, Truly mentioned to Lee that President Kennedy had been shot. Oswald seemed genuinely surprised. Baker and Truly then left the lunchroom and headed upstairs to investigate further. In the meantime, someone had informed Geraldine Reid about the assassination.
Geraldine Reid's final encounter with Lee Oswald occurred a few minutes later. "The last time I saw Mr. Oswald, he was leaving the building," Reid stated. "As he passed me by, I noticed that he had his jacket slung over his arm. I told him that the President had just been shot and he simply said 'Oh?' or something like that, and kept on walking out of the office to go downstairs and, I assume, out of the building."
**********************************
Groden also spoke with a corroborating witness, an ONI investigator, who confirmed that she had been interviewed by the Warren Commission and who "saw suppressed documents on her."
- ianlloyd
- Posts : 151
Join date : 2010-03-18
Re: Geraldean Reid
Tue 26 Nov 2013, 3:07 am
..."saw suppressed documents on her."
And therein lies the problem - I wonder if these documents have now been "routinely" destroyed following a "review"?
Oops, started breathing again...
And therein lies the problem - I wonder if these documents have now been "routinely" destroyed following a "review"?
Oops, started breathing again...
- ianlloyd
- Posts : 151
Join date : 2010-03-18
Re: Geraldean Reid
Tue 26 Nov 2013, 3:15 am
A quick search found this:
http://www.ancestry.com/1940-census/usa/Texas/Jeraldean-Reid_5jdxbv
Seemingly a Mrs Robert Reid with the first name of Jeraldean???...
I'm sure Tom Scully can do better than me though!!!!
http://www.ancestry.com/1940-census/usa/Texas/Jeraldean-Reid_5jdxbv
Seemingly a Mrs Robert Reid with the first name of Jeraldean???...
I'm sure Tom Scully can do better than me though!!!!
- beowulf
- Posts : 373
Join date : 2013-04-21
Re: Geraldean Reid
Tue 26 Nov 2013, 5:15 am
Geraldine Reid mentioned in a next day FBI interview
Mrs. SANDERS advised that this morning she called GERALDINE REID, another employee, telephone number FE 1-6617, who told her that the police officer who had first entered the building ran into the lunch room where Mr. TRULY, the warehouse manager, and OSWALD were evidently lunching. The police officer put his gun into OSWALD's stomach but TRULY advised the police officer that OSWALD worked for him. Police officer turned turned away and evidently left the area. She said according to REID, OSWALD then went to the main office and REID, although she had not observed the initial incident with the police officer, told OSWALD that the President had been shot. According to SANDERS, Mrs. REID claimed that OSWALD just mumbled something and left the office.
http://jfkassassination.net/russ/exhibits/ce1434.htm
The last part of Geraldine's (secondhand) story is exactly what Mrs. Robert A. Reid told the WC.
Mrs. REID. Well, I kept walking and I looked up and Oswald was coming in the back door of the office. I met him by the time I passed my desk several feet and I told him, I said, “Oh, the President has been shot, but maybe they didn’t hit him.” He mumbled something to me, I kept walking, he did, too.
http://www.aarclibrary.org/publib/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh3/pdf/WH3_Reid.pdf
Mrs. SANDERS advised that this morning she called GERALDINE REID, another employee, telephone number FE 1-6617, who told her that the police officer who had first entered the building ran into the lunch room where Mr. TRULY, the warehouse manager, and OSWALD were evidently lunching. The police officer put his gun into OSWALD's stomach but TRULY advised the police officer that OSWALD worked for him. Police officer turned turned away and evidently left the area. She said according to REID, OSWALD then went to the main office and REID, although she had not observed the initial incident with the police officer, told OSWALD that the President had been shot. According to SANDERS, Mrs. REID claimed that OSWALD just mumbled something and left the office.
http://jfkassassination.net/russ/exhibits/ce1434.htm
The last part of Geraldine's (secondhand) story is exactly what Mrs. Robert A. Reid told the WC.
Mrs. REID. Well, I kept walking and I looked up and Oswald was coming in the back door of the office. I met him by the time I passed my desk several feet and I told him, I said, “Oh, the President has been shot, but maybe they didn’t hit him.” He mumbled something to me, I kept walking, he did, too.
http://www.aarclibrary.org/publib/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh3/pdf/WH3_Reid.pdf
Albert Rossi- Posts : 417
Join date : 2013-08-29
Age : 69
Location : Naperville, IL USA
Re: Geraldean Reid
Tue 26 Nov 2013, 5:20 am
Richard,
It was great to meet you at Lancer. I wish I had had the chance to pop on over to COPA; this was really a whirlwind 4 days for me. Groden's book was not available over at the Adolphus, I even asked Andy Winiarczyk, who said it hadn't appeared yet.
Do you know when and where it can be ordered?
Cheers, Al
It was great to meet you at Lancer. I wish I had had the chance to pop on over to COPA; this was really a whirlwind 4 days for me. Groden's book was not available over at the Adolphus, I even asked Andy Winiarczyk, who said it hadn't appeared yet.
Do you know when and where it can be ordered?
Cheers, Al
- beowulf
- Posts : 373
Join date : 2013-04-21
Re: Geraldean Reid
Tue 26 Nov 2013, 5:33 am
Wait, so there were THREE Reids working in TSBD (Mrs Robert (Delores), Mrs. Geraldine, Miss Martha)?
WC testimony of Geneva Hine
BALL: Did you see Mrs. Reid come back in?
HINE: Yes, sir; I think I felt sure that I did. I thought that there were five or six that came in together. I thought she was one of those...
BALL: Who were they?
HINE: Mr. Williams, Mr. Molina, Miss Martha Reid, Mrs. Reid, Mrs. Sarah Stanton, and Mr. Campbell; that's all I recall, sir.
http://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh6/pdf/WH6_Hine.pdf
---------
Off the cuff, I think Mrs. Robert and Geraldine are the same person. My suspicion [if its not a hoax] is Mrs. Reid had a guilty conscience and wanted to come clean about Oswald's innocence without implicating anyone else in committing perjury (Truly and Campbell are long dead, of course, but a certain tall coworker on the front steps is very much one of the living).
EDIT: Forgot about those last minute FBI affidavits from every TSBD employee. In fact, Miss Martha's last name is Reed. Also we learn that Mrs. R.A. Reid was born on August 24, 1912. (pdf p 39 of 55). She was 51 in 1963 and would be 101 today. If Jeraldean (to go by Census name) is Mrs. Robert A. Reid, well, the math doesn't work if Groden spoke to her when she was in late 70s/early 80s (assuming, of course, that he hasn't been sitting on this for 20 years). Groden probably got hoaxed.
http://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh22/pdf/WH22_CE_1381.pdf
WC testimony of Geneva Hine
BALL: Did you see Mrs. Reid come back in?
HINE: Yes, sir; I think I felt sure that I did. I thought that there were five or six that came in together. I thought she was one of those...
BALL: Who were they?
HINE: Mr. Williams, Mr. Molina, Miss Martha Reid, Mrs. Reid, Mrs. Sarah Stanton, and Mr. Campbell; that's all I recall, sir.
http://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh6/pdf/WH6_Hine.pdf
---------
Off the cuff, I think Mrs. Robert and Geraldine are the same person. My suspicion [if its not a hoax] is Mrs. Reid had a guilty conscience and wanted to come clean about Oswald's innocence without implicating anyone else in committing perjury (Truly and Campbell are long dead, of course, but a certain tall coworker on the front steps is very much one of the living).
EDIT: Forgot about those last minute FBI affidavits from every TSBD employee. In fact, Miss Martha's last name is Reed. Also we learn that Mrs. R.A. Reid was born on August 24, 1912. (pdf p 39 of 55). She was 51 in 1963 and would be 101 today. If Jeraldean (to go by Census name) is Mrs. Robert A. Reid, well, the math doesn't work if Groden spoke to her when she was in late 70s/early 80s (assuming, of course, that he hasn't been sitting on this for 20 years). Groden probably got hoaxed.
http://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh22/pdf/WH22_CE_1381.pdf
- beowulf
- Posts : 373
Join date : 2013-04-21
Re: Geraldean Reid
Tue 26 Nov 2013, 6:38 am
11/24/63 FBI report
Mrs. SANDERS advised that this morning she called GERALDINE REID, another employee, telephone number FE1-6617...
----
11/23/63 Dallas PD affidavit
Mrs R.A. Reid
1914 Elmwood FE1-6617
http://jfk.ci.dallas.tx.us/01/0136-001.gif
Christ, how many different ways is Groden going to make us prove that Geraldine (or Jeraldean) Reid and Mrs. Robert A. Reid are the same person? They had the same phone number!
Mrs. SANDERS advised that this morning she called GERALDINE REID, another employee, telephone number FE1-6617...
----
11/23/63 Dallas PD affidavit
Mrs R.A. Reid
1914 Elmwood FE1-6617
http://jfk.ci.dallas.tx.us/01/0136-001.gif
Christ, how many different ways is Groden going to make us prove that Geraldine (or Jeraldean) Reid and Mrs. Robert A. Reid are the same person? They had the same phone number!
greg_parkerAdmin- Posts : 8368
Join date : 2009-08-21
Age : 66
Location : Orange, NSW, Australia 
Re: Geraldean Reid
Tue 26 Nov 2013, 7:29 am
There was no "Delores Reid" working in the depository -- the "Delores" standing on the steps was "Delores Kounas"
http://www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/viewer/showDoc.do?docId=1317&relPageId=689
I guess it is possible Mrs Kounos divorced and remarried someone named Reid.
As for "Martha Reid"... again - no employee by that name in the building. However, Geraldean had multiple kids and a grandchild. I think it''s more than possible "Martha Reid" was one of Geraldean's daughters who came by to watch the parade with her mother.
http://www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/viewer/showDoc.do?docId=1317&relPageId=689
I guess it is possible Mrs Kounos divorced and remarried someone named Reid.
As for "Martha Reid"... again - no employee by that name in the building. However, Geraldean had multiple kids and a grandchild. I think it''s more than possible "Martha Reid" was one of Geraldean's daughters who came by to watch the parade with her mother.
_________________
Australians don't mind criminals: It's successful bullshit artists we despise.
Lachie Hulme
-----------------------------
The Cold War ran on bullshit.
Me
"So what’s an independent-minded populist like me to do? I’ve had to grovel in promoting myself on social media, even begging for Amazon reviews and Goodreads ratings, to no avail." Don Jeffries
"I've been aware of Greg Parker's work for years, and strongly recommend it." Peter Dale Scott
https://gregrparker.com
- greg_parkerAdmin
- Posts : 8368
Join date : 2009-08-21
Age : 66
Location : Orange, NSW, Australia
Re: Geraldean Reid
Tue 26 Nov 2013, 7:39 am
Okay. "Martha Reid" was actually "Martha REED". There was also a Carol REED.greg parker wrote:There was no "Delores Reid" working in the depository -- the "Delores" standing on the steps was "Delores Kounas"
http://www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/viewer/showDoc.do?docId=1317&relPageId=689
I guess it is possible Mrs Kounos divorced and remarried someone named Reid.
As for "Martha Reid"... again - no employee by that name in the building. However, Geraldean had multiple kids and a grandchild. I think it''s more than possible "Martha Reid" was one of Geraldean's daughters who came by to watch the parade with her mother.
_________________
Australians don't mind criminals: It's successful bullshit artists we despise.
Lachie Hulme
-----------------------------
The Cold War ran on bullshit.
Me
"So what’s an independent-minded populist like me to do? I’ve had to grovel in promoting myself on social media, even begging for Amazon reviews and Goodreads ratings, to no avail." Don Jeffries
"I've been aware of Greg Parker's work for years, and strongly recommend it." Peter Dale Scott
https://gregrparker.com
- beowulf
- Posts : 373
Join date : 2013-04-21
Re: Geraldean Reid
Tue 26 Nov 2013, 7:42 am
Ian was johnny on the spot with the 1940 Census. It says Jeraldean was "27, born abt 1913" (Census asks age, not birthdate). Mrs. R.A. Reid's FBI affidavit says she was born August 24, 1912.
- greg_parkerAdmin
- Posts : 8368
Join date : 2009-08-21
Age : 66
Location : Orange, NSW, Australia
Re: Geraldean Reid
Tue 26 Nov 2013, 8:04 am
According to this, she died on the 21st April, 1973. And he only "recently" learned of her passing?
http://billiongraves.com/pages/record/person/5462540
When was it exactly Groden claims to have to talked to her, anyway? Geraldean did not reach her "late eighties" before she died.
http://billiongraves.com/pages/record/person/5462540
When was it exactly Groden claims to have to talked to her, anyway? Geraldean did not reach her "late eighties" before she died.
_________________
Australians don't mind criminals: It's successful bullshit artists we despise.
Lachie Hulme
-----------------------------
The Cold War ran on bullshit.
Me
"So what’s an independent-minded populist like me to do? I’ve had to grovel in promoting myself on social media, even begging for Amazon reviews and Goodreads ratings, to no avail." Don Jeffries
"I've been aware of Greg Parker's work for years, and strongly recommend it." Peter Dale Scott
https://gregrparker.com
- beowulf
- Posts : 373
Join date : 2013-04-21
Re: Geraldean Reid
Tue 26 Nov 2013, 9:12 am
Wow, great find, even has a photo of her gravestone! I think we can go by that and stipulate her name is spelled Jeraldean. It is amusing to imagine Groden sitting on a scoop for 40 years before publishing (mentioning it neither to HSCA or Oliver Stone) but that's not what happened.
What's irritating here is not just that Groden was sloppy but the person hoaxing him was sloppy as well. Groden (and no doubt his "witness") used the name Geraldine Reid but there never was a Geraldine Reid working at the TSBD. What happened was TSBD employee Pauline Sanders was interviewed by FBI on Nov. 24 and when she mentioned a call that morning from Jeraldean Reid, the agents (Hasam & Anderson) dictated Mrs. Reid's first name incorrectly on their report, Geraldine instead of Jeraldean. However, we know they wrote down Mrs. Reid's phone number correctly because it matches the number Mrs. Robert A. Reid gave the Dallas police (FE1-1667), this matching number is how we know that Jeraldean Reid IS Mrs. Robert A. Reid.
"Geraldine" then only exists as a typo on an FBI document, that's why she's only mentioned once (as Groden points out) by the Warren Commission. If the hoaxer had done her homework, she would have surely spelled "her own name" correctly-- hell she could have looked up the tombstone on the internet-- Jeraldean Bray Reid, wife of Robert Anthony Reid.
What's irritating here is not just that Groden was sloppy but the person hoaxing him was sloppy as well. Groden (and no doubt his "witness") used the name Geraldine Reid but there never was a Geraldine Reid working at the TSBD. What happened was TSBD employee Pauline Sanders was interviewed by FBI on Nov. 24 and when she mentioned a call that morning from Jeraldean Reid, the agents (Hasam & Anderson) dictated Mrs. Reid's first name incorrectly on their report, Geraldine instead of Jeraldean. However, we know they wrote down Mrs. Reid's phone number correctly because it matches the number Mrs. Robert A. Reid gave the Dallas police (FE1-1667), this matching number is how we know that Jeraldean Reid IS Mrs. Robert A. Reid.
"Geraldine" then only exists as a typo on an FBI document, that's why she's only mentioned once (as Groden points out) by the Warren Commission. If the hoaxer had done her homework, she would have surely spelled "her own name" correctly-- hell she could have looked up the tombstone on the internet-- Jeraldean Bray Reid, wife of Robert Anthony Reid.
- greg_parkerAdmin
- Posts : 8368
Join date : 2009-08-21
Age : 66
Location : Orange, NSW, Australia
Re: Geraldean Reid
Tue 26 Nov 2013, 9:27 am
Richard,
without passing judgement on the rest of the book, I have to agree that this part of it is sloppy and makes him look slightly foolish.
That said, I'll put my hand up and say I made a major mistake regarding a witness identification as well, once - which came about because of a mis-transcribed name by the WC stenographer and finding someone who matched the description who happened to live in the right area AND had the mistranscribed name... everything fell into place with that - until the person was interviewed and it all unravelled. Finally it was worked out (by Sean Murphy, god bless his cotton socks!) what the stenographer had MEANT to type...
without passing judgement on the rest of the book, I have to agree that this part of it is sloppy and makes him look slightly foolish.
That said, I'll put my hand up and say I made a major mistake regarding a witness identification as well, once - which came about because of a mis-transcribed name by the WC stenographer and finding someone who matched the description who happened to live in the right area AND had the mistranscribed name... everything fell into place with that - until the person was interviewed and it all unravelled. Finally it was worked out (by Sean Murphy, god bless his cotton socks!) what the stenographer had MEANT to type...
_________________
Australians don't mind criminals: It's successful bullshit artists we despise.
Lachie Hulme
-----------------------------
The Cold War ran on bullshit.
Me
"So what’s an independent-minded populist like me to do? I’ve had to grovel in promoting myself on social media, even begging for Amazon reviews and Goodreads ratings, to no avail." Don Jeffries
"I've been aware of Greg Parker's work for years, and strongly recommend it." Peter Dale Scott
https://gregrparker.com
- GuestGuest
Re: Geraldean Reid
Tue 26 Nov 2013, 10:30 am
At first blush, it does appear probable that Robert Groden got hoaxed. He's a sincere, likable guy and it's easy to imagine someone targeting him for a hoax, as he's out at Dealey Plaza all the time making the case for conspiracy and trying to sell a few books. I'm glad you guys have looked into this as I didn't quite have the time. Some further keys to this story may be: in WCD 87, the Secret Service interviews of early December, what the FBI in March spelled as "Delores Kounas" is therein spelled "Delores Konnes". Now, maybe she re-married someone named Reid.
And the ONI investigator who "saw suppressed documents" on Mrs. Reid was named David Thiess. As Groden relates, he unfortunately died of a heart attack on January 7 of 2013. I have to admit that when I read that, I went "Uh-oh"- there goes your corroboration, Robert.
Someone asked him a question about Prayer Man, basically what was his opinion about him, after his presentation at the conference, but he didn't really answer the question. He was aware of PM but admitted that he hasn't been following the topic on the internet. Groden, I would surmise, would be the number one man to look to for producing the best-resolvable image. I think he owns 1st-generation copies of the Darnell and Weigman films.
Albert, the book is published by Conspiracy Publications, 3700 Broadway, Suite 300, Kansas City, MO 64111 It's $75.00 without shipping & handling. There is plenty of jaw-dropping stuff in it. Robert Groden is in a league of his own when it comes to JFK photography.
I don't see it listed yet on his website JFKMurder.com, nor on Amazon. But an alternative is to obtain his address by clicking on "Order Now" for a publication from his website.
I also took immense pleasure in meeting you face-to-face. It's a shame we had so little time; had the conference gone on for 3 more days, that would have suited me fine. My own schedule was whirlwind also; I'm glad I had a chance to scoot over to the Adolphus for a bit. I looked for you about a half hour after we chatted, as I was leaving. I had wanted to mention that the reason I brought up Dartmouth College was that's it's in my home state. I'd done a lot of my early research, around 2002, at Baker Library there. I lived a couple hours away, in the White Mountains, and would spend a day off in the bowels of Baker looking through the troves of books in the stacks and microfilm/microfiche collections. Exceptionally pretty campus.
And the ONI investigator who "saw suppressed documents" on Mrs. Reid was named David Thiess. As Groden relates, he unfortunately died of a heart attack on January 7 of 2013. I have to admit that when I read that, I went "Uh-oh"- there goes your corroboration, Robert.
Someone asked him a question about Prayer Man, basically what was his opinion about him, after his presentation at the conference, but he didn't really answer the question. He was aware of PM but admitted that he hasn't been following the topic on the internet. Groden, I would surmise, would be the number one man to look to for producing the best-resolvable image. I think he owns 1st-generation copies of the Darnell and Weigman films.
Albert, the book is published by Conspiracy Publications, 3700 Broadway, Suite 300, Kansas City, MO 64111 It's $75.00 without shipping & handling. There is plenty of jaw-dropping stuff in it. Robert Groden is in a league of his own when it comes to JFK photography.
I don't see it listed yet on his website JFKMurder.com, nor on Amazon. But an alternative is to obtain his address by clicking on "Order Now" for a publication from his website.
I also took immense pleasure in meeting you face-to-face. It's a shame we had so little time; had the conference gone on for 3 more days, that would have suited me fine. My own schedule was whirlwind also; I'm glad I had a chance to scoot over to the Adolphus for a bit. I looked for you about a half hour after we chatted, as I was leaving. I had wanted to mention that the reason I brought up Dartmouth College was that's it's in my home state. I'd done a lot of my early research, around 2002, at Baker Library there. I lived a couple hours away, in the White Mountains, and would spend a day off in the bowels of Baker looking through the troves of books in the stacks and microfilm/microfiche collections. Exceptionally pretty campus.
- Albert Rossi
- Posts : 417
Join date : 2013-08-29
Age : 69
Location : Naperville, IL USA
Re: Geraldean Reid
Tue 26 Nov 2013, 11:09 am
Oh yes, I have rather idyllic memories of Hanover back in the 1980s and early 1990s. I've returned recently and found it rather transformed (for the worse). As for Baker, I owned my own area of specialization that it seems I was the first to have checked out a good number of volumes since the preceding century, believe it or not. And interlibrary loan at Baker was utterly fantastic. In one summer, those people managed to get me somewhere near 100 titles not held at Baker.
I truly hope we can meet again face-to-face, Richard. Thanks for the suggestions re Groden's book.
I truly hope we can meet again face-to-face, Richard. Thanks for the suggestions re Groden's book.
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Re: Geraldean Reid
Tue 26 Nov 2013, 11:15 am
Yes, Richard - it's possible she remarried. But it doesn't matter since she's not the person Groden claims to have interviewed - unless she also started using the name "Geraldine".Richard Gilbride wrote:In WCD 87, the Secret Service interviews of early December, what the FBI in March spelled as "Delores Kounas" is therein spelled "Delores Konnes". Now, maybe she re-married someone named Reid.
_________________
Australians don't mind criminals: It's successful bullshit artists we despise.
Lachie Hulme
-----------------------------
The Cold War ran on bullshit.
Me
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StanDane- Posts : 3645
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Re: Geraldean Reid
Tue 26 Nov 2013, 5:05 pm
If I had 1st-generation copies of the Darnell and Weigman films in my possession and I was made aware of Prayer Man, the implications of this would make me immediately stop everything I was doing and check those films to see if I had better images of PM than those floating around the Internet.Richard Gilbride wrote:Someone asked him a question about Prayer Man, basically what was his opinion about him, after his presentation at the conference, but he didn't really answer the question. He was aware of PM but admitted that he hasn't been following the topic on the internet. Groden, I would surmise, would be the number one man to look to for producing the best-resolvable image. I think he owns 1st-generation copies of the Darnell and Weigman films.
If Prayer Man is indeed Oswald, then, as Sean Murphy said on September 8, 2013, "Game over" (post #647 http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=20354&page=44).
Look at the vast improvement in image quality when Robin Unger provided the images from the Blu-ray version of the JFK movie. PM became much more Oswald-looking. It was also possible to absolutely nail the visage of Wesley Buell Frazier standing on top of the steps. Huge.
This is the biggest issue. Demonstrate that Oswald is Prayer Man and it's game over. I hope the lights come on for Groden and he checks this out and lets folks know. Hell, put it in another book and sell it if that's what it takes, but just do it.
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Re: Geraldean Reid
Fri 29 Nov 2013, 11:54 am
I feel bad about Robert Groden being set up like this. He has suffered a lot for this case. I have to wonder if it has anything to do with his constant harassment by the 6FM.
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Re: Geraldean Reid
Fri 29 Nov 2013, 12:39 pm
Frankie, it's okay to feel bad for him, but the reality is, he only has himself to blame. It took me two minutes of googling to work out this was all wrong.Frankie Vegas wrote:I feel bad about Robert Groden being set up like this. He has suffered a lot for this case. I have to wonder if it has anything to do with his constant harassment by the 6FM.
So either Groden didn't try and verify any of it. Or he did, but he just really sucks at using the internet.
_________________
Australians don't mind criminals: It's successful bullshit artists we despise.
Lachie Hulme
-----------------------------
The Cold War ran on bullshit.
Me
"So what’s an independent-minded populist like me to do? I’ve had to grovel in promoting myself on social media, even begging for Amazon reviews and Goodreads ratings, to no avail." Don Jeffries
"I've been aware of Greg Parker's work for years, and strongly recommend it." Peter Dale Scott
https://gregrparker.com
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Re: Geraldean Reid
Fri 29 Nov 2013, 1:08 pm
I think that as well, but also that he is under a lot of pressure with the court case and harassment. It is bizarre that he didn't check it out a bit more.greg parker wrote:Frankie, it's okay to feel bad for him, but the reality is, he only has himself to blame. It took me two minutes of googling to work out this was all wrong.Frankie Vegas wrote:I feel bad about Robert Groden being set up like this. He has suffered a lot for this case. I have to wonder if it has anything to do with his constant harassment by the 6FM.
So either Groden didn't try and verify any of it. Or he did, but he just really sucks at using the internet.
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Re: Geraldean Reid
Fri 27 Dec 2013, 3:11 pm
Zach Robertson's not very flattering review of Groden's (apparently exorbitantly priced) book) http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=20663&p=283087
_________________
Australians don't mind criminals: It's successful bullshit artists we despise.
Lachie Hulme
-----------------------------
The Cold War ran on bullshit.
Me
"So what’s an independent-minded populist like me to do? I’ve had to grovel in promoting myself on social media, even begging for Amazon reviews and Goodreads ratings, to no avail." Don Jeffries
"I've been aware of Greg Parker's work for years, and strongly recommend it." Peter Dale Scott
https://gregrparker.com
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Re: Geraldean Reid
Fri 27 Dec 2013, 9:26 pm
greg parker wrote:Zach Robertson's not very flattering review of Groden's (apparently exorbitantly priced) book) http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=20663&p=283087
I read Zach's post about Groden's book yesterday. One thing surprised me and one thing did not.
It surprised me that Zach wrote what he wrote because he is genuinely one of the most respectful and postitive JFK researchers out there so it came as a shock that he felt it necessary to speak out. The book must be bad and seems to have been put together to appeal to the lowest possible denominator brigade. The thing that didn't surprise me was that Groden would do this.
The one thing he said he had was the extra witness who would turn out to be explosive but he couldn't publish anything until after her death. Turns out that after years and years of waiting he was actually talking out of his arse and actually had sod all. Now, we are told he is also trying to pass a JFK movie still from the autopsy scene as being a genuine unpublished autopsy photograph. On top of all this he actually gives page space to some of most crackpot and bullshit theories that have ever floated down the sewer.
So, now we know his new witness was anything but new, and his new autopsy photo is from the 1990's, what is new about Groden's book other than the date it was published? Sod all!
I completely agree with Stan concerning his comments about Darnell and Weigman. Groden allegedly has first generation copies of these films and yet he has completely ignored th issue of Prayer Man. One of the most exciting developments in fifty years and Groden instead wants to pretend it hasn't happened and doesn't want to help? I take it that foisting fake photos onto unsuspecting people purchasing his book and pretending he has witnesses who will blow the case open is more important to Groden?
I just cannot fathom how he receives so much support. The first time I encountered Groden next to the concrete pergola on the grassy knoll he was selling two of his books and two dvd's to a lady customer who was paying by credit card. Groden was actually taking Credit and Debit card transactions on the knoll. I don't remember the exact amount but I do remember it was well over a hundred bucks. I just shook my head and walked away. No overheads, no rent, no power or utility bills, no repair costs, just pure profit. Great gig if you can get it I suppose. But he is selling the truth - just as long as everyone is happy with Groden's version of the truth.
Let me ask a question. If I decided to move to Dallas tomorrow and turned up extra early at Groden's commercial spot on the knoll with a shit load of books, dvd's, newspapers and a selection of cold drinks and cupcakes to sell, regardless of the fact that I would be immediately arrested, does anybody here think Groden would be happy to give up his pitch to a new purveyor of "truth" who also takes credit and debit cards?
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Re: Geraldean Reid
Fri 27 Dec 2013, 10:17 pm
Yeah, I know what you mean about Zack. Surprised me, too.Lee Farley wrote:greg parker wrote:Zach Robertson's not very flattering review of Groden's (apparently exorbitantly priced) book) http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=20663&p=283087
I read Zach's post about Groden's book yesterday. One thing surprised me and one thing did not.
It surprised me that Zach wrote what he wrote because he is genuinely one of the most respectful and postitive JFK researchers out there so it came as a shock that he felt it necessary to speak out. The book must be bad and seems to have been put together to appeal to the lowest possible denominator brigade. The thing that didn't surprise me was that Groden would do this.
The one thing he said he had was the extra witness who would turn out to be explosive but he couldn't publish anything until after her death. Turns out that after years and years of waiting he was actually talking out of his arse and actually had sod all. Now, we are told he is also trying to pass a JFK movie still from the autopsy scene as being a genuine unpublished autopsy photograph. On top of all this he actually gives page space to some of most crackpot and bullshit theories that have ever floated down the sewer.
So, now we know his new witness was anything but new, and his new autopsy photo is from the 1990's, what is new about Groden's book other than the date it was published? Sod all!
I completely agree with Stan concerning his comments about Darnell and Weigman. Groden allegedly has first generation copies of these films and yet he has completely ignored th issue of Prayer Man. One of the most exciting developments in fifty years and Groden instead wants to pretend it hasn't happened and doesn't want to help? I take it that foisting fake photos onto unsuspecting people purchasing his book and pretending he has witnesses who will blow the case open is more important to Groden?
I just cannot fathom how he receives so much support. The first time I encountered Groden next to the concrete pergola on the grassy knoll he was selling two of his books and two dvd's to a lady customer who was paying by credit card. Groden was actually taking Credit and Debit card transactions on the knoll. I don't remember the exact amount but I do remember it was well over a hundred bucks. I just shook my head and walked away. No overheads, no rent, no power or utility bills, no repair costs, just pure profit. Great gig if you can get it I suppose. But he is selling the truth - just as long as everyone is happy with Groden's version of the truth.
Let me ask a question. If I decided to move to Dallas tomorrow and turned up extra early at Groden's commercial spot on the knoll with a shit load of books, dvd's, newspapers and a selection of cold drinks and cupcakes to sell, regardless of the fact that I would be immediately arrested, does anybody here think Groden would be happy to give up his pitch to a new purveyor of "truth" who also takes credit and debit cards?
Sean Murphy may be bitterly disappointed, too. He's been patiently waiting for the details of Groden's witness ever since he first cottoned onto to PM.
_________________
Australians don't mind criminals: It's successful bullshit artists we despise.
Lachie Hulme
-----------------------------
The Cold War ran on bullshit.
Me
"So what’s an independent-minded populist like me to do? I’ve had to grovel in promoting myself on social media, even begging for Amazon reviews and Goodreads ratings, to no avail." Don Jeffries
"I've been aware of Greg Parker's work for years, and strongly recommend it." Peter Dale Scott
https://gregrparker.com
- GuestGuest
Re: Geraldean Reid
Fri 27 Dec 2013, 10:50 pm
greg parker wrote:Yeah, I know what you mean about Zack. Surprised me, too.Lee Farley wrote:greg parker wrote:Zach Robertson's not very flattering review of Groden's (apparently exorbitantly priced) book) http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=20663&p=283087
I read Zach's post about Groden's book yesterday. One thing surprised me and one thing did not.
It surprised me that Zach wrote what he wrote because he is genuinely one of the most respectful and postitive JFK researchers out there so it came as a shock that he felt it necessary to speak out. The book must be bad and seems to have been put together to appeal to the lowest possible denominator brigade. The thing that didn't surprise me was that Groden would do this.
The one thing he said he had was the extra witness who would turn out to be explosive but he couldn't publish anything until after her death. Turns out that after years and years of waiting he was actually talking out of his arse and actually had sod all. Now, we are told he is also trying to pass a JFK movie still from the autopsy scene as being a genuine unpublished autopsy photograph. On top of all this he actually gives page space to some of most crackpot and bullshit theories that have ever floated down the sewer.
So, now we know his new witness was anything but new, and his new autopsy photo is from the 1990's, what is new about Groden's book other than the date it was published? Sod all!
I completely agree with Stan concerning his comments about Darnell and Weigman. Groden allegedly has first generation copies of these films and yet he has completely ignored th issue of Prayer Man. One of the most exciting developments in fifty years and Groden instead wants to pretend it hasn't happened and doesn't want to help? I take it that foisting fake photos onto unsuspecting people purchasing his book and pretending he has witnesses who will blow the case open is more important to Groden?
I just cannot fathom how he receives so much support. The first time I encountered Groden next to the concrete pergola on the grassy knoll he was selling two of his books and two dvd's to a lady customer who was paying by credit card. Groden was actually taking Credit and Debit card transactions on the knoll. I don't remember the exact amount but I do remember it was well over a hundred bucks. I just shook my head and walked away. No overheads, no rent, no power or utility bills, no repair costs, just pure profit. Great gig if you can get it I suppose. But he is selling the truth - just as long as everyone is happy with Groden's version of the truth.
Let me ask a question. If I decided to move to Dallas tomorrow and turned up extra early at Groden's commercial spot on the knoll with a shit load of books, dvd's, newspapers and a selection of cold drinks and cupcakes to sell, regardless of the fact that I would be immediately arrested, does anybody here think Groden would be happy to give up his pitch to a new purveyor of "truth" who also takes credit and debit cards?
Sean Murphy may be bitterly disappointed, too. He's been patiently waiting for the details of Groden's witness ever since he first cottoned onto to PM.
Sean doesn't need anything more. He has put together the best available evidence and it's up to people to have an open mind to reflect upon it all. A couple of small leaps of faith are required but that it true of many aspects of this case.
Sean should have his head held high, and Groden should go and bury his.
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Re: Geraldean Reid
Sat 28 Dec 2013, 6:24 am
Oh, I agree entirely. But I know from discussing PM with Sean privately a few times over the last few years that he was eagerly awaiting the name.Sean doesn't need anything more. He has put together the best available evidence and it's up to people to have an open mind to reflect upon it all. A couple of small leaps of faith are required but that it true of many aspects of this case.
Sean should have his head held high, and Groden should go and bury his.
_________________
Australians don't mind criminals: It's successful bullshit artists we despise.
Lachie Hulme
-----------------------------
The Cold War ran on bullshit.
Me
"So what’s an independent-minded populist like me to do? I’ve had to grovel in promoting myself on social media, even begging for Amazon reviews and Goodreads ratings, to no avail." Don Jeffries
"I've been aware of Greg Parker's work for years, and strongly recommend it." Peter Dale Scott
https://gregrparker.com
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