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The Lunchroom Incident Revisited

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Gilbride - The Lunchroom Incident Revisited - Page 22 Empty The Lunchroom Incident Revisited

Wed 02 Apr 2014, 7:42 pm
First topic message reminder :

I want to begin by focusing on the notorious vestibule door, with the plate-glass window, that Baker first glimpsed Oswald looking through. It's WC Exhibit 498, at XVII p. 213, and even in the Warren volumes you can easily discern the fresh grain pattern in the wood. First Day Evidence, on p. 286, is even clearer.

http://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh17/html/WH_Vol17_0120a.htm

Very probably this was a new door, installed during the late 1962 overhaul, when the Sexton Grocery warehouse was remodeled to accommodate the TSBD company and several other publishers. By the way, Sexton had its offices on the 1st & 2nd floors and very likely used the same lunchroom that we all know so well. The vestibule door had an automatic closing device, and Truly had to come in and make a special affidavit about that on August 3rd (WCH VII p. 591). It took several seconds to close. This device was probably pneumatic.

This vestibule door had some weight to it. It was sturdy. It could be described as heavy-duty. Installing it was a 2-man job. In comparison, the doors to the up & down flights of stairs were downright flimsy. (Same link as above, but page 217). These stairwell doors were normally open during the course of the day, as was the lunchroom door (WCD 496, p. 32). The vestibule door closed by itself and was always in the closed position, if not in use.

The vestibule door helped muffle the sounds from the landing and stairwell, so that people in the lunchroom could eat in relative peace & quiet. The stairs were old and quite noisy and the landing floors were wood. Warehouse workers habitually came up to use the lunchroom Coke machine. And office workers also came down from the 3rd  & 4th floors, human nature being what it is, rather than wait impatiently at lunchtime for the passenger elevator. For example, Victoria Adams and Sandra Styles' run down the stairs on November 22nd wasn't their first experience on them. They instinctively knew they could head for the corner stairwell when they discovered the passenger elevator wasn't operating.

Considering the potential for irritable human traffic, the vestibule door kept disturbing sounds to a reasonable minimum. It was installed with that purpose in mind.

****************************************************************

Adams & Styles watched the motorcade from their 4th-floor office window overlooking Elm Street. Adams estimated the time it took them to reach the 1st floor, after the shots, was "no longer than a minute at the most." She confirmed to author Barry Ernest that she left the window just before the limousine reached the Triple Underpass (The Girl on the Stairs p. 329).

The first point that needs to be appreciated is that Adams & Styles could not have beaten Truly & Baker to the freight elevators. Even if these women made it to the 1st floor in 60 seconds, Truly & Baker had 60 seconds to make it only as far as the will-call counter, or just a bit further into the warehouse, to see the women across the floor. And Adams & Styles continued running in front of the freight elevators for the rear door. Even the most sluggard time estimate for Truly & Baker brings them onto the warehouse floor well before Adams & Styles. And in one re-enactment they made it to the 2nd-floor lunchroom in 75 seconds.

The second point is that Adams' & Styles' supervisor, Dorothy Garner, stated for the record that after they went downstairs, she saw Truly & Baker come up. The purpose of Garner's statement was to refute the WC argument that Adams must have gone downstairs several minutes after the shots, because otherwise she should have encountered Lee Harvey Oswald fleeing down the steps. Garner's statement was given in the U.S. Attorney's office in Dallas, and they sent it to WC Chief Counsel J. Lee Rankin. But he never brought it to light, since it helped refute the Commission's contention that Oswald was the 6th-floor assassin. And the statement lay buried in the National Archives in the papers of the Dallas U.S. Attorney until Barry Ernest discovered it.

We can boil the stairs down to a mathematical problem, where A & S are descending from the 4th while T & B are ascending to the 4th (and then the 5th). Yet they never interact with each other. Why is this the case? Because T & B removed themselves from the stairs for a time, and went into the lunchroom. And it is a mathematical certainty that A & S passed T & B while they were in the lunchroom.

Why didn't T & B hear them? Truly said that he, Baker & Oswald were only 2 or 3 feet inside the lunchroom. The answer is that the vestibule door muffled a lot of sound, coming from Adams' & Styles' high heels clomping down the wooden stair treads and across the wooden landing. And T & B were in an intense, gun-in-the-belly situation with Oswald. Even if a little bit of noise from those high heels filtered into their eardrums, it was only high heels and they quickly brushed it off and forgot about it.

Baker estimated the lunchroom encounter took 30 seconds. The stairs were roughly L-shaped, split-level. I think it's fair to say that for someone in the lunchroom, floor "2 1/2" to floor "1 1/2" constitutes their hearing range. Half a flight of steps gets descended in about 5 seconds, with another 5 seconds for crossing the 10-foot landing. That's 15 seconds total for A & S to be in hearing range. They probably were on the 3rd-floor landing just as B & T entered the lunchroom.

Skeptics of the lunchroom incident not only have to construe Baker & Truly as liars. Since 2010, when Garner's information came out, they have to construe her as misbegotten as well- yet her statement was made with Oswald's escape in mind, not the lunchroom incident.

What the simple mathematics of this problem means is that the totality of evidence cited by the skeptics, as supporting the lunchroom episode as a non-event, is nothing more than a red herring. The disparate news stories are just that- disparate news stories, and they tell us little more than that reporters will write anything.

And etc. Bring your best arguments to the table, in favor of the non-event. Prepare for a whuppin'.  cat

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Thu 19 Jun 2014, 5:56 am
terlin wrote:
greg parker wrote:
There is more - and very specific info - that ties all this to stuff in LHOCW Vol One - but that has to wait.

Titillate...

then leave them wanting for more.

Curses on you, Parker!!!
 :joker:

You want 33 pages of real juicy stuff, Terry? Then you're going to have to go and ask your government for it because things like the transcript below are still postponed for release:



ORIGINATOR : HSCA
FROM : [No From]
TO : [No To]
TITLE : SWORN TESTIMONY OF WILLIAM JAMES LOWERY
DATE : 05/26/1978
PAGES : 33
DOCUMENT TYPE : TRANSCRIPT
SUBJECTS : LOWERY, WILLIAM JAMES, DEPOSITION; HOSTY, JAMES;
OSWALD, LEE, POST-RUSSIAN PERIOD, POLITICAL AND
SUBVERSIVE..; ...ACTIVITIES, COMMUNIST PARTY
CLASSIFICATION : UNCLASSIFIED
RESTRICTIONS : REFERRED
CURRENT STATUS : POSTPONED IN FULL
DATE OF LAST REVIEW : 07/29/1993
COMMENTS : Folder 1 of 2. Enclosed testimony; 157-5. Routing slip
008624 attached to doc. #008652. Folder 2 contains
three copies of deposition. Box 157.
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Thu 19 Jun 2014, 7:26 am
greg parker wrote:
Like other aspects of his later accounts, this is totally different to what he said at the time.
Telling lies is easy. Trying to remember them all is the hard part.
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Thu 19 Jun 2014, 8:22 am
Hello Goodbye wrote:You want 33 pages of real juicy stuff, Terry? Then you're going to have to go and ask your government for it because things like the transcript below are still postponed for release:

Well, Lee, I would like to help but my government and I are no longer on speaking terms. It was for postponing the release of just such documents, I believe.

And whatever happened to The Times? I used to subscribe - back in the 70's - because they would at least print honest news about the U.S. You know, the stuff the local press wouldn't dare print. Nowadays it seems they are under the same gag-order as their US counterparts.

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Thu 19 Jun 2014, 5:51 pm
terlin wrote:
Hello Goodbye wrote:
Just partially shooting from the hip here, Terry, but that kind of where my head goes when thinking about your question.

What are your thoughts?

Lee,

That was brilliant!!

Everybody spying on everybody and no one knowing about it.

I had already pieced together the Joe Molina connection - I believe from something either you or Greg had mentioned months ago - as the motive for getting Oswald into the TSBD but if Paine was CIA (?) and Hosty was FBI, did the two agencies know they were working together?

And did the USSS know about this in advance or was this operation just coincidentally coincided with the killing of JFK? With so many of the strands from Oswald reaching back toward Hoover, I am certain he would obstruct everything about those connections (just as Stanton did when Lincoln was killed) but do we have anything connecting this bizarre ménage à trois to the actual killing?

The big picture stuff is not my forte.  Greg is the man who can take the pieces and extrapolate into much broader terms.

However, that being said I believe the plot was, to use the often overused term, heavily compartmentalised.  The cover up was heavily compartmentalised.  The intimidation/buttering-up of witnesses was heavily compartmentalised. The tampering of evidence was heavily compartmentalised.

I doubt very few people knew the full extent of how what they were being asked to do fit into a much bigger picture.  I'm sure some of the dirty work crossed over between the FBI, USSS and the CIA but most individual agents (junior or senior) knew very little about how the small things would ultimately have a massive impact on the overall direction of the case.

The Hosty-Paine relationship is one that is quite strange.  Was Ruth pure CIA?  It's possible but I doubt it -- not in the strictest sense of the term.  I think she did what she believed was her duty for her country whilst trying to adhere to her religious principles.  Goban Saor said in his last post that Ruth's lying was more overt than we possibly originally believed.  I don't necessarily agree - at least not when looking at it from a particular perspective.  I have yet to find any blatant in-your-face lies from Ruth Paine in any of the documents.  That is not to say that I believe she told the truth.  It simply means that she very carefully chose the language she used to make sure she didn't lie about anything.  Most of her Warren Commission testimony (and it's extensive) is a masterclass in subterfuge, manipulation, and wriggling out of sticky situations -- all without any actual bald-faced lies.

I also doubt that Paine was knowingly working with Jim Hosty on any aspect of manipulating Oswald.  I think they both played their parts the way they were supposed to play them without knowing that their actions would at some point merge -- with the help of Mrs. Roberts possibly being used as an informer/helper for Hosty.

It was just a big game of chess and the pieces had some grandmasters making them move.  Who were the chess masters?
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Thu 19 Jun 2014, 7:55 pm
Hello Goodbye wrote:The big picture stuff is not my forte.  Greg is the man who can take the pieces and extrapolate into much broader terms.

...

However, that being said I believe the plot was, to use the often overused term, heavily compartmentalised.  The cover up was heavily compartmentalised.  The intimidation/buttering-up of witnesses was heavily compartmentalised. The tampering of evidence was heavily compartmentalised.

Compartmentalization is an aspect of the case that has been used frequently, especially to talk about the different things going on in this case. There must have been a helluva lot of compartments!! But, what IF it was not all one big mess but a set of rather smaller messes? (This may be directed more toward the big picture man, Greg, more than yourself)

The Big D - A Tale of One City, Two Conspiracies, and Three Cover-ups

Yes, the city was large enough that five crimes could live side-by-side, though they bumped into each other quite often

The way that I understand the overall big event is through two different conspiracies:

1 - the conspiracy to kill President Kennedy; this one involved the Secret Service and a few friends at the DPD who helped arrange the motorcade route;

2 - the conspiracy to eliminate the meddling undercover operative, Lee Harvey Oswald; this one involved the criminals working out of the TSBD and their associates on the DPD (at least one of whom was affiliated with #1 above);

and the mess was furthered hampered by three different cover-ups:

A - the cover-up to hide the involvement of the FBI with one Lee Harvey Oswald, basically tossing him to the wolves;

B - the cover-up to hide the framing of Oswald by the locals, basically by allowing the DPD to look like a bunch of incompetent idiots (losing face to save their butts) which wasn't too difficult;

C - the cover-up to hide the Secret Service involvement in the assassination, at Dealey Plaza, at Parkland, and points beyond, continuing to the present.

Three cover-ups, two conspiracies, and one blasted partridge in the stinkin' pear tree. Merry freakin' Christmas, what?

#1 above was not a political coup d'etat. It was small and personal. In the history of coups, there is a lot more that changes other than just the head of state. The massive "takeover" of the government that supporters of this theory imagine did not seem to occur in any real sense. Sure the country has gone down the toilet since Kennedy but it has been a very gradual descent into the abyss. Not what one imagines as the outcome of a violent coup.

That said, the shadow government (i.e. the confluence of State/Cia [the Dulles/Dulles creation]), is known for its opportunism. They did not take an active part in killing JFK but they were certainly not going to let any moss grow on their backsides when such a marvelous chance was given them.

The chance? Not to take over the government - with the sort of power they wield, the reins of power and the stifling architecture of due process would have been an immense bother - but the increase the level of fear in the populace. Many writers seem to think that they want the people to become demoralized zombies. Not so. They want them on edge in fear. People in fear are set and ready to move when directed; zombies are slow and cannot be put into action quickly. What action, you wonder? Panic, most likely. That is the natural result of instilling fear in a large mass of people. Why? Hey, I don't know everything! I'm mostly filling in the blanks as I go.

You may notice I did not mention Tippit or Ruby.

Tippit, it seems to me, was a throw-away. Either he was already on someone's short-list or the killing occurred coincidentally with the other activity. Fortune does sometime shine brightly for the bad guys. Whether it was kismet or planned, Oswald was set-up for killing Tippit. Once arrested by the DPD the framing of him for the killing of JFK was put into motion. There does not seem to be a lot of interest in Oswald before this time and it seems to me that most of the case to frame him for JFK began to take shape after he was framed for Tippit. Someone began this process of shifting the case to Oswald.

It appears the DPD was content to frame him for Tippit alone until someone else started feeding them material to include the killing of the President.

Ruby was working with the guys at the TSBD and their friends on the force. When the government began looking into the case, they realized looking too deeply was going to reveal more than they wanted. Ruby was sent to finish off the patsy. And he really thought he was going to get off rather easily for saving the country the trouble of a trial. (Or so he said. He probably thought his friends at the DPD were going to help spirit him away.)

Of course, Ruby could have been doing the deed at the behest of the FBI, the CIA, the Mafia, the Vienna Boys Choir, or his great-aunt Gertrude. It makes more sense that the locals put him up to it rather than the national organizations, or agencies. I think Hoover really thought they could fix the trial well enough - probably by talking to Oswald about some sort of deal or something of that sort. Of course, I could be wrong and Hoover ordered the hit. It just feels wrong to me, though.

Looking at it in sectionalized portions like this (not as one giant plot) it takes on a whole new shape. It does not look anything like the case we're used to looking at and I think that's a start. We cannot keep going over the same ground expecting the eureka moment. We have to step outside the box a little to do that.

Anyway, that's all I got at my end.

Feel free to add, detract, or correct any of my thinking.

I'm sure we have not broken through the wall of fictions completely.

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Gilbride - The Lunchroom Incident Revisited - Page 22 Empty Re: The Lunchroom Incident Revisited

Thu 19 Jun 2014, 10:01 pm
terlin wrote:
Hello Goodbye wrote:The big picture stuff is not my forte.  Greg is the man who can take the pieces and extrapolate into much broader terms.

...

However, that being said I believe the plot was, to use the often overused term, heavily compartmentalised.  The cover up was heavily compartmentalised.  The intimidation/buttering-up of witnesses was heavily compartmentalised. The tampering of evidence was heavily compartmentalised.

Compartmentalization is an aspect of the case that has been used frequently, especially to talk about the different things going on in this case. There must have been a helluva lot of compartments!! But, what IF it was not all one big mess but a set of rather smaller messes? (This may be directed more toward the big picture man, Greg, more than yourself)

The Big D - A Tale of One City, Two Conspiracies, and Three Cover-ups

Yes, the city was large enough that five crimes could live side-by-side, though they bumped into each other quite often

The way that I understand the overall big event is through two different conspiracies:

1 - the conspiracy to kill President Kennedy; this one involved the Secret Service and a few friends at the DPD who helped arrange the motorcade route;

2 - the conspiracy to eliminate the meddling undercover operative, Lee Harvey Oswald; this one involved the criminals working out of the TSBD and their associates on the DPD (at least one of whom was affiliated with #1 above);

and the mess was furthered hampered by three different cover-ups:

A - the cover-up to hide the involvement of the FBI with one Lee Harvey Oswald, basically tossing him to the wolves;

B - the cover-up to hide the framing of Oswald by the locals, basically by allowing the DPD to look like a bunch of incompetent idiots (losing face to save their butts) which wasn't too difficult;

C - the cover-up to hide the Secret Service involvement in the assassination, at Dealey Plaza, at Parkland, and points beyond, continuing to the present.

Three cover-ups, two conspiracies, and one blasted partridge in the stinkin' pear tree. Merry freakin' Christmas, what?

#1 above was not a political coup d'etat. It was small and personal. In the history of coups, there is a lot more that changes other than just the head of state. The massive "takeover" of the government that supporters of this theory imagine did not seem to occur in any real sense. Sure the country has gone down the toilet since Kennedy but it has been a very gradual descent into the abyss. Not what one imagines as the outcome of a violent coup.

That said, the shadow government (i.e. the confluence of State/Cia [the Dulles/Dulles creation]), is known for its opportunism. They did not take an active part in killing JFK but they were certainly not going to let any moss grow on their backsides when such a marvelous chance was given them.

The chance? Not to take over the government - with the sort of power they wield, the reins of power and the stifling architecture of due process would have been an immense bother - but the increase the level of fear in the populace. Many writers seem to think that they want the people to become demoralized zombies. Not so. They want them on edge in fear. People in fear are set and ready to move when directed; zombies are slow and cannot be put into action quickly. What action, you wonder? Panic, most likely. That is the natural result of instilling fear in a large mass of people. Why? Hey, I don't know everything! I'm mostly filling in the blanks as I go.

You may notice I did not mention Tippit or Ruby.

Tippit, it seems to me, was a throw-away. Either he was already on someone's short-list or the killing occurred coincidentally with the other activity. Fortune does sometime shine brightly for the bad guys. Whether it was kismet or planned, Oswald was set-up for killing Tippit. Once arrested by the DPD the framing of him for the killing of JFK was put into motion. There does not seem to be a lot of interest in Oswald before this time and it seems to me that most of the case to frame him for JFK began to take shape after he was framed for Tippit. Someone began this process of shifting the case to Oswald.

It appears the DPD was content to frame him for Tippit alone until someone else started feeding them material to include the killing of the President.

Ruby was working with the guys at the TSBD and their friends on the force. When the government began looking into the case, they realized looking too deeply was going to reveal more than they wanted. Ruby was sent to finish off the patsy. And he really thought he was going to get off rather easily for saving the country the trouble of a trial. (Or so he said. He probably thought his friends at the DPD were going to help spirit him away.)

Of course, Ruby could have been doing the deed at the behest of the FBI, the CIA, the Mafia, the Vienna Boys Choir, or his great-aunt Gertrude. It makes more sense that the locals put him up to it rather than the national organizations, or agencies. I think Hoover really thought they could fix the trial well enough - probably by talking to Oswald about some sort of deal or something of that sort. Of course, I could be wrong and Hoover ordered the hit. It just feels wrong to me, though.

Looking at it in sectionalized portions like this (not as one giant plot) it takes on a whole new shape. It does not look anything like the case we're used to looking at and I think that's a start. We cannot keep going over the same ground expecting the eureka moment. We have to step outside the box a little to do that.

Anyway, that's all I got at my end.

Feel free to add, detract, or correct any of my thinking.

I'm sure we have not broken through the wall of fictions completely.
Terry,

just some off the cuff observations and comments. Your approach is imo, the right one to take.


  • At least one person was necessarily needed to be involved in the trip planning and arrangements.
  • Not entirely convinced Oswald was anyone's undercover operative, but if he wasn't, he more than likely thought he was.
  • I long ago harbored suspicion that the TSBD was shipping stolen weapons in those crates. Could it be meaningful that the TSBD serviced the exact same 5 states that the 112th MIG covered, and that the MIG was working with other agencies on the weapons walking out the doors of various bases? 
  • A successful coup d'tat is not uncovered. If you very suddenly found yourself living under Fascism post 11/22/63, I think that is a bit too obvious. It works that way in the third world only. We see the first signs of the emerging Neocons in the LBJ administration, and Vietnam fall into full scale war. As you point out, it's been pretty much downhill since. I think both Ruby and the so-called Oxnard caller both gave clues as to the direction the country was going to head.
  • Groups/individuals most likely involved (without, as Lee says, necessarily knowing the extent of what they were involved in): Roy Truly, the Paines, Lowery and associates, members of the LBJ inner circle, White Russians (and similar emigre groups from Europe and supporters of same), DPD. Pulling the strings of some of these people were of course, the FBI and/or CIA and/or MIG


  Some of the best, but missed clues until now have been,


  • The importance of Lowery in this story
  • Various relationships between key people (to come)
  • The carbon copy similarities between 2 key events in the life of Lee Oswald to events in the life of Julius Rosenberg, and the connective tissue between the Rosenbergs, Youth House, the Paines, and CIA officers
  • The importance of the CIA Redskin Program and a number of US/Soviet exchange programs
  • The real reason the Soviets were hard to deal with at the summits
  • The fact that a close relative of Michael Paine worked on biological weapons during WWII (to come)
  • The Odio incident and the two individuals who really need scrutiny - Colonel Castorr and Mrs Connell.
  • The testimony of Marina and Marguerite concerning a certain photo
  • Timing! It's everywhere from jobs appearing at the right time and place for an assassination back to starting to order Soviet publications just after a new law came into being regarding same, and all the way back to the defection and the urgent need not to wait the few weeks he had left to give the Marines - and also the timing surrounding his initial intention to return to the US coinciding with the end of two CIA anti-Soviet programs.  


Cuba. I think Cubans were involved only as potential false sponsors. 
   
All I can add is that I have all these components and other bric-a-brac floating around in my head and that it all fits together and makes internal sense. We all get where we are going through a combination of design and coincidence. What I've done is gathered all the data that got Oswald to Dallas and where design was involved, who was behind that design.

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Thu 19 Jun 2014, 11:09 pm
greg parker wrote:
All I can add is that I have all these components and other bric-a-brac floating around in my head and that it all fits together and makes internal sense. We all get where we are going through a combination of design and coincidence. What I've done is gathered all the data that got Oswald to Dallas and where design was involved, who was behind that design.

Thanks for the additional information... and all that other stuff that is "to come". Which makes the other volumes of your Lee Harvey Oswald set so important. **hint, hint**

And we have to help the wider research community start to look at the case differently; stop following the "lead" of the WC and all their fictitious evidence and re-construct the case from ground zero.

I think we're making a decent start.

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Wed 25 Jun 2014, 3:07 am
Maybe what we really need to do - since the MSM won't touch this stuff - is to retain a Public Relations Firm.

Anyone know somebody who'll work cheap? (or for free because it is such a great cause?)

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Sun 29 Jun 2014, 1:34 pm
This might be a bit off topic, but what was the name of the man who Truly called to give him Oswald's TSBD file, from memory starts with A, Im having trouble tracking him down online. Would be nice to know what time this file was requested by Truly...to hand over to DPD

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Gilbride - The Lunchroom Incident Revisited - Page 22 Byp_211
greg_parker
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Sun 29 Jun 2014, 3:32 pm
Mick Purdy wrote:This might be a bit off topic, but what was the name of the man who Truly called to give him Oswald's TSBD file, from memory starts with A, Im having trouble tracking him down online. Would be nice to know what time this file was requested by Truly...to hand over to DPD
Mick, His name was Aiken... but I'm not sure he was ever asked...

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Wed 30 Jul 2014, 9:30 pm
Another nail in the lunchroom encounter. Mrs Reid's story falls apart when Geneva Hine's testimony is analysed.

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Tue 27 Feb 2018, 7:39 pm
Almost 4 years since this great thread was posted in, time for a well deserved bump. If only for Gilbride's dated delusions being utterly destroyed!

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Tue 27 Feb 2018, 8:02 pm
barto wrote:Almost 4 years since this great thread was posted in, time for a well deserved bump. If only for Gilbride's dated delusions being utterly destroyed!
And keep in mind that this thread has been heavily sanitized to protect, women, children, and substance abusers.
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Wed 28 Feb 2018, 2:52 am
A Gilbride rerun. 

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Wed 28 Feb 2018, 10:26 am
I shall attempt to watch this again but will do so only when any and all random food stuffs are unavailable for shooting out my nose.

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Wed 28 Feb 2018, 10:41 am
Ditto.

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Thu 01 Mar 2018, 12:21 pm
http://www.prayer-man.com/the-death-of-richard-gilbrides-deluded-fantasies/

Putting a sword in the man's drivel and lies.


Last edited by barto on Thu 01 Mar 2018, 6:56 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Thu 01 Mar 2018, 1:39 pm
Go for it!
barto wrote:http://www.prayer-man.com/the-death-of-richard-gilbrides-deluded-fantasies/

Putting a sword in the man's drivel and lies.

_________________
Australians don't mind criminals: It's successful bullshit artists we despise. 
              Lachie Hulme            
-----------------------------
The Cold War ran on bullshit.
              Me


"So what’s an independent-minded populist like me to do? I’ve had to grovel in promoting myself on social media, even begging for Amazon reviews and Goodreads ratings, to no avail." 
Don Jeffries

"I've been aware of Greg Parker's work for years, and strongly recommend it." Peter Dale Scott

https://gregrparker.com
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Thu 01 Mar 2018, 2:36 pm
barto wrote:http://www.prayer-man.com/the-death-of-richard-gilbrides-deluded-fantasies/

Putting a sword in the man's drivel and lies.
Damn, forgot a lot of that stuff. Great work!
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Thu 01 Mar 2018, 6:51 pm
barto wrote:http://www.prayer-man.com/the-death-of-richard-gilbrides-deluded-fantasies/

Putting a sword in the man's drivel and lies.
Did it really take him 90 pages to say "I hate hoaxers"?
No wonder he doesn't get paid.

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Checkmate.

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Thu 01 Mar 2018, 6:59 pm
http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/topic/22564-one-last-thing-before-xmas-eve-2nd-floor-lunch-room-encounter/?page=22

Posted it Bart!
Hope Graves enjoys it or has a witty retort, his dull replies are comic bronze
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Thu 21 Mar 2019, 10:19 pm
More delusions from the lonely twat....

The Murphyites attained popularity through a Bolshevik politicization of the truth- censoring the opposition, ostracizing dissent, and relentlessly propagandizing a sophomoric analysis that confabulates the evidentiary record to fit it to a predetermined conclusion.

And despite every Bolshevik privilege accorded them, the Murphyites have displayed a miserable inability to show how Marvin Johnson's after-action report correlates with their lunchroom hoax hypothesis. 

Johnson's report is one of the major pieces of Baker evidence, and not one person can incorporate it into the hoax scenario. The Murphyites' only recourse is to ignore it. And marginalize their skeptics. And raise their pitchforks and torches in delusional grandiosity.

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