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The FBI and the TSBD

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The FBI and the TSBD

Post by greg parker on Tue 20 May 2014, 9:38 am

There is a lot more of interest in the testimonies of West and Piper. A lot. But that all belongs on Lee's thread "An Alternative Lunchroom Encounter Scenario"

Right now, I just want to highlight the fact that they both mention FBI. How is it that these two seem so familiar with how an FBI agent looks? I believe it is because FBI agents were not exactly strangers to that building...

Mr. BELIN. Who was the first person or persons that you saw coming through there while you were eating your lunch?
 Mr. WEST. Well, that was police.
 Mr. BELIN. A police officer? 
 Mr. WEST. Yes, sir.
 Mr. BELIN. Anyone else?
 Mr. WEST. I guess it was a bunch of them, I guess, FBI men, and just a crowd of them coming in there. 
 Mr. BELIN. Did you see Roy Truly coming in at all that time? Do you know Mr. Truly?
 Mr. WEST. Yes, sir; that is the boss, the superintendent.
 Mr. BELIN. Did you ever see him, do you remember, while you were eating your lunch, come in the building?
 Mr. WEST. Yes, sir; I think he came in with the police.
 Mr. BELIN. Was he one of the first people in, or did other people come ahead of him, if you remember?
 Mr. WEST. Really, I just don't know.

Mr. BALL. You mentioned you saw Truly?
Mr. PIPER. I don't know whether it was a policeman or FBI or who it was, but another fellow was with him.
Mr. BALL And where were you?
Mr. PIPER. Standing right there where they make coffee.
Mr. BALL. What did they do?
Mr. PIPER. He ran in and yelled, "Where is the elevator?" And I said, "I don't know, sir, Mr. Truly."
They taken off and went on up the stairway and that's all I know about that.
Mr. BALL. Did you at any time go above the fourth floor on that date? 
Mr. PIPER. No, sir.
Mr. BALL. Did you at any time go that day up above the fourth floor? 
Mr. PIPER. No--no, sir.
Mr. BALL. You never did---either before or after the shots? 
Mr. PIPER. No, sir.
Mr. BALL. Now, that day, you went over to the sheriff's office and made a statement, didn't you?
Mr. PIPER. Yes, sir---no, sir; not that day. 
Mr. BALL. Did you the next day?             
Mr. PIPER. Saturday.

Piper's second appearance. All mention of FBI disappears.

Mr. BALL. You told us that after the shooting you came out onto the floor? 
Mr. PIPER. That's right.
Mr. BALL. And the first people that you saw on the floor after the shooting was who?
Mr. PIPER. Mr. Truly and some fellow---I really don't know who it was; like I say, it was some fellow that was with Mr. Truly.
Mr. BALL. Some fellow; how was he dressed?
Mr. PIPER. Oh, I don't know.
Mr. BALL. Was he an officer?
Mr. PIPER. Yes; I believe he was an officer.
Mr. BALL. A police officer?
Mr. PIPER. Yes; a police officer.
Mr. BALL. Did he have a white helmet on?
Mr. PIPER. No; I don't think so. I didn't pay any attention to it. I was already excited over the shooting or something when he came running into the building.
Mr. BALL. And what did Truly and this--some fellow do?
Mr. PIPER. Well, Mr. Truly and this fellow run up the steps. He just hollered for the elevator and I said, "I don't know where it is at," and I'm still standing over there by that table and he ran up on up the steps with this police officer--him and another fellow and I was standing there and the people began swarming out and around--different ones coming in, but it was where nobody could come out.
Mr. BALL. They were the first ones to go up the steps?
Mr. PIPER. That's right.
Mr. BALL. Had anybody come down the steps before they went up the steps?
Mr. PIPER. No, sir.
Mr. BALL. They weren't the first ones to come down?
Mr. PIPER. Yes; and when the elevators come down---I really don't know who brought the elevators down, but I know nobody ever come down the steps.
Mr. BALL. Did you ever see Vicki Adams come down the steps?
Mr. PIPER. No, sir; I don't know about that, if she said she did, it was after I got over here and walked over to the back door.
Mr. BALL. Did Vicki Adams come down before Truly and the man went up the steps?
Mr. PIPER. No, sir, no, sir; she didn't do it.
Mr. BALL. Did you at anytime after the shooting miss Lee Oswald---did you notice he wasn't around?
Mr. PIPER. No, sir; I didn't notice it until the lineup. You know, I just figured all the people was there.
Mr. BALL. You did notice it at the lineup, did you?
Mr. PIPER. Yes.

_________________
Mixing Pop and Politics he asks me what the use is
I offer him embarrassment and my usual excuses
While looking down the corridor
Out to where the van is waiting
I'm looking for the Great Leap Forward

            Billy Bragg
-----------------------------
 Australians don't mind criminals: It's successful bullshit artists we despise. 
             Lachie Hulme            
-----------------------------
The Cold War ran on bullshit.
              Me

greg parker
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Re: The FBI and the TSBD

Post by beowulf on Tue 20 May 2014, 11:35 am

Mr. PIPER. I don't know whether it was a policeman or FBI or who it was, but another fellow was with him

In the US, local policemen are usually in uniform but FBI agents are always in coat and tie. Local detectives are in plainclothes and could easily be confused with Feds but there's no way anyone would confuse a uniformed motorcycle cop with a Fed.

I'd note also that the US has an absurd number of federal law enforcement agencies. Its common to badge civilians with "federal agent" instead of explaining to people that, say, NCIS isn't just on a TV show. Its also common for civilians to then think they just met an FBI agent.

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Re: The FBI and the TSBD

Post by Stan Dane on Tue 20 May 2014, 12:23 pm

greg parker wrote:Mr. BALL. You mentioned you saw Truly?
Mr. PIPER. I don't know whether it was a policeman or FBI or who it was, but another fellow was with him.
Mr. BALL And where were you?
Mr. PIPER. Standing right there where they make coffee.
Mr. BALL. What did they do?
Mr. PIPER. He ran in and yelled, "Where is the elevator?" And I said, "I don't know, sir, Mr. Truly."
They taken off and went on up the stairway and that's all I know about that.
Was Piper referring to being on the first floor when he made these comments? Because, officially, the tag team of Truly and Baker caromed their way across the first floor to the NW stairs and on up to the second floor lunchroom. Seems to me, if anyone says they saw Truly, how could they miss the distinctive visage of Marion "RoboClod" Baker? Were there any other people with Truly during the initial charge to confuse things?
 
Piper undoubtedly received numerous "subliminal messages" before his second appearance, but still wasn't too sure of himself.

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Re: The FBI and the TSBD

Post by greg parker on Tue 20 May 2014, 12:36 pm

beowulf wrote:Mr. PIPER. I don't know whether it was a policeman or FBI or who it was, but another fellow was with him

In the US, local policemen are usually in uniform but FBI agents are always in coat and tie. Local detectives are in plainclothes and could easily be confused with Feds but there's no way anyone would confuse a uniformed motorcycle cop with a Fed.

I'd note also that the US has an absurd number of federal law enforcement agencies. Its common to badge civilians with "federal agent" instead of explaining to people that, say, NCIS isn't just on a TV show. Its also common for civilians to then think they just met an FBI agent.
Thanks,

here though... we have them rushing through. Neither West nor Piper said they were flashed badges or even just told verbally they were FBI. 

I don't think Piper was there to ID anyone at the time claimed. It's possible both are recalling the "second wave". West has a number passing through and can't recall exactly when he saw Truly. Piper has himself interacting with them about the elevators - which seems to be pure fabrication given that neither Truly nor Baker recalls seeing EITHER man. 

The point is,  it comes across to me like they were very familiar with the style of men likely to be with the FBI and maybe Piper guessed "FBI" because he was used to seeing those guys in the building? 

I base that on this 

Jack Cason had been a former Commander of the American Legion, Post #53 in Dallas. 
 

The American Legion Contact Program was uncovered by the Church Committee. It ran from 1940 to 1954. This program used Legion members as confidential sources on subversive matters. Even though the program officially ceased in 1954, FBI Field Offices were instructed to maintain contact with American Legion officials in their areas.
http://www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/viewer/showDoc.do?mode=searchResult&absPageId=149537 

_________________
Mixing Pop and Politics he asks me what the use is
I offer him embarrassment and my usual excuses
While looking down the corridor
Out to where the van is waiting
I'm looking for the Great Leap Forward

            Billy Bragg
-----------------------------
 Australians don't mind criminals: It's successful bullshit artists we despise. 
             Lachie Hulme            
-----------------------------
The Cold War ran on bullshit.
              Me

greg parker
Admin

Posts : 3448
Join date : 2009-08-21
Age : 58
Location : Orange, NSW, Australia

View user profile http:// http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00IXOA5ZK/ref=s9_simh_

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Re: The FBI and the TSBD

Post by Guest on Tue 20 May 2014, 6:07 pm

Interesting. These changes are consistent with many of the subtle alterations and suppression that appear in repeated versions of testimony. The pattern is not just confined as many know to JFK. A similar series of unfortunate events seems to cloud the assassinations of MLK and RFK. Each occurs in just over 5 years under many the same involved government leaders. The balance of probability defies mere coincidence and just consistent incompetence being responsible in my view.


Last edited by Carmine Savastano on Tue 20 May 2014, 6:08 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : added the word versions)

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Re: The FBI and the TSBD

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