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Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part B

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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part B

Post by greg parker on Sun 25 Jun 2017, 3:01 am

Ed,

some truly astute observations.

And great catch on the Johnson snafu.

As you'd know, Givens gave about 5 statements over a period of time without mentioning the most important fact - seeing Oswald up on the 6th when he returned for his smokes.

And the "send the elevator back up" story seems to have first surfaced with the published story of the "porter" escorting Oswald up to the 6th... but I believe that person was really Dougherty not LHO.

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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part B

Post by Stan Dane on Sun 25 Jun 2017, 4:17 am

What Greg said.

An alternative explanation for Frazier’s "being an old Texas boy" comment:  I think he may have been referring to himself here. I have many relatives in Texas and some of them talk this way, variations of "I’m just a good ole boy from Texas," etc. Texas people tend to be proud of being from Texas and they work it in their conversation at times.

Frazier might have said it this way:

"You know, President Kennedy was supposed to come by during our lunch hour, and good old Texas boys like me don’t get very many chances to see a president because they don’t come down here very much so I went out to see him just like everybody else."

Again just an alternative explanation.
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part B

Post by Ed. Ledoux on Sun 25 Jun 2017, 6:48 am

Its an odd saying.
I know lots of Texas gibberish an colloquiums and this ain't one.

I mean google has it as two pages and half the first page is Buell's usage.
https://www.google.com/search?q=old+Texas+boy&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8#q=%22being+an+old+Texas+boy%22

The rest are of recent uses, 
and not by young punk kids wet behind the ears.

Buell could be credited with originating the phrase.

Now what I equate him to be saying is what most of us in America
would imagine he is saying:
Noun1.good ol' boy - a white male Southerner with an unpretentious convivial manner and conservative or intolerant attitudes and a strong sense of fellowship with and loyalty to other members of his peer group
good old boy, good ole boy

"Being an Old Texas Boy" is a Buellism
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part B

Post by Ed. Ledoux on Sun 25 Jun 2017, 7:07 am

Strange that the "an old Texas Boy" brings up six pages and those two are the only old uses and that is from a couple journals from 1910 and 1913
A typographical with that entry from Dallas (imagine that!)
and that Ag Bulletin where its used as a term for Native Texan
"an old Texas boy that's made good"

Maybe we can get Buell to translate?
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part B

Post by greg parker on Sun 25 Jun 2017, 9:37 am

UP until now, anyone reading it has probably assumed he was talking about himself - and he may have been - but if so, it's poorly expressed and does sound more like he is talking about "the president". On the other hand, could Johnson be accused of not coming to Texas very much, or was that Buell recognizing his snafu and rescuing himself? 

I note that the two examples of "an old Texas boy" found are both in reference to a third party, if that means anything.

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“God favors drunks, small children, and the cataclysmically stoned...” Steve King
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part B

Post by Ed. Ledoux on Tue 27 Jun 2017, 6:09 am

That is how I would expect its useage,
in reference to another,

'he is an old Texas Boy, '

At the time Buell was testfying LBJ was president of course
And LBJ lived in Virginia.
He had since 1943.
Lived two doors down from J Edgar Hoover for 19 years on 30th Place in VA.
Lbj moves once VP. to another neighborhood in Spring Valley.

So he did not get down to Texas much.
I think he is slipping and refers to seeing LBJ aka the president.
Nothing sinister perhaps just an oddity

Cheers, Ed

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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part B

Post by Ed. Ledoux on Tue 27 Jun 2017, 6:41 am

Also a block away on Main was the previous visit of LBJ and JFK.

http://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local/Forgotten-Photos-Show-Happier-JFK-Visit-to-DFW-226514131.html

I guess this would mean nothing to an Dallasite or Old Texas Boy ;-)
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part B

Post by Ed. Ledoux on Tue 27 Jun 2017, 10:47 am

Good to see Buell agrees that only way to know the motorcade was coming past the depository was Jarman's paper he reads on the bus on Jarman's way to work.
Buell then is inspired to ask Shelley for crew to let off early 11:45 to get washed, eat out front waiting for the president. Yes?
FRAZIER - That was sometime between 8 and 10 o'clock. I say it was the early part of the morning
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part B

Post by Vinny on Tue 27 Jun 2017, 8:59 pm

If only he would admit who PM is.

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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part B

Post by Colin Crow on Tue 27 Jun 2017, 9:31 pm

Ed. Ledoux wrote:Good to see Buell agrees that only way to know the motorcade was coming past the depository was Jarman's paper he reads on the bus on Jarman's way to work.
Buell then is inspired to ask Shelley for crew to let off early 11:45 to get washed, eat out front waiting for the president. Yes?
FRAZIER - That was sometime between 8 and 10 o'clock. I say it was the early part of the morning
Does this mean Frazier (and Shelly) were unaware that the parade was due to pass at about 12.25? "Normal" lunch was between noon and 12.45. No reason for Frazier's request and Shelly's approval. Others in the TSBD did not take position until 12.10-12.20.
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part B

Post by Ed. Ledoux on Wed 28 Jun 2017, 3:02 am

Colin Crow wrote:
Ed. Ledoux wrote:Good to see Buell agrees that only way to know the motorcade was coming past the depository was Jarman's paper he reads on the bus on Jarman's way to work.
Buell then is inspired to ask Shelley for crew to let off early 11:45 to get washed, eat out front waiting for the president. Yes?
FRAZIER - That was sometime between 8 and 10 o'clock. I say it was the early part of the morning
Does this mean Frazier (and Shelly) were unaware that the parade was due to pass at about 12.25? "Normal" lunch was between noon and 12.45. No reason for Frazier's request and Shelly's approval. Others in the TSBD did not take position until 12.10-12.20.

Colin are you sure you want to open Pandora's box,... its really a clock.

That is Buell's claim Colin.

Buell supposedly asked Shelley based on Jarman's paper about knocking off at 11:45 to see the noonish parade
If they knew otherwise as to a later time why the 11:45 claim to knock off to watch it.

Shelley says he is on the first floor at 11:50 and eating half of his lunch.
This would mean he did leave the sixth floor at 11:45.
Shelley in his March 18 1963 FBI statement said he went out at 12:15 to watch the President.
What did he do for the other 15 minutes? Chew half a sandwich?

If they knew 12:15-12:30 would be the parades new time why not work till noon as usual, wash, eat, then step out for the parade and go back to work at the normal time.

So at 11:50 does Shelley know the parade will be delayed?
If not why wait till 12:15 to step outside?

"Junior Jarman, Oswald’s direct supervisor, told the FBI that he saw Oswald leave the first floor, boarding one of the freight elevators with his order pad in hand, presumably to fill an order for books, at approximately 11:30 (CD 5, p. 334). Charles Givens was part of a four (not six) man work crew that was laying plywood flooring on the sixth floor that morning. The crew broke for lunch early because the President’s motorcade was expected to pass the building during the noon hour. Although the four varied widely in their guesstimates as to the actual time that they broke for lunch, all four men recounted seeing Oswald on the fifth floor on their way down in the freight elevators, some recalling that Oswald had shouted to them to send one of the elevators back up. This was the last undisputed sighting of Oswald prior to the assassination. The estimated time of this event differed among the work crew from close to 11:30 to close to 12:00, but all agreed that it was before noon. Junior Jarman recalled that the four man crew arrived on the first floor for lunch at 11:45 (police report reprinted in Bonner, p. 286). Bugliosi estimates 11:50."

And what about Frazier.

Mr. FRAZIER - To be frank with you, I don't know whether he brought his lunch because I will tell you one way, some guys bring their lunch there and some guys buy it there because we have a caterer service, you see, comes around about 10 o'clock the man comes around and several of the boys they go out there and buy their lunch from the catering service.
Mr. BALL - Then later on at 11:45?
Mr. FRAZIER - 12 o'clock is when we always eat lunch.
Mr. BALL - 12 to 12:45?
Mr. FRAZIER - Right.


and this

Mr. BALL - Now, you knew that the President was going to pass that building sometime that morning, didn't you?
Mr. FRAZIER - Well, I heard he would.
Mr. BALL - Did you talk to some of the men around there about it?
Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir; I didn't.
Mr. BALL - Did you ever talk to Oswald about that?
Mr. FRAZIER - No, sir; I didn't.
Mr. BALL - What time did you knock off for lunch?
Mr. FRAZIER - 12.


Ball is fishing for the 11:45 time to rear its ugly head!

Now Shelley said he did not talk to Lee.
So how would Lee know that Buell and Shelley had decided to knock off early to watch the parade....?
Buell did not talk to Lee.
So how does Lee supposedly know the plot if no one speaks to him???? Hmmmm

I find the whole mess a bunch a crap.
There was no COKE.
Lee drank Dr Pepper.
The bottle on the steps is a DP.
There were DP's left in the machine as Sawyer is drinking one out front!

I find the lunch break story also a bunch of hooey.
No elevator race leaving Lee up on six. More myths.

Why when Shelley is knocked off at 11:50 and eating in front of Lee on the first floor...
When the crew races down to see Lee downstairs...oops, er they mean upstairs.
Who is Eddie Pipper talking to at about Noon on the first floor, Oswald's ghost?
And why would he be going UP to eat, OUT maybe. Eddie and the rest of the crew flip flop more than a Hawaiian sandal store.

How is Danny Arce helping an old man to the bathroom 45 minutes before the president arrived if he is still working?
 
Don Thomas notes;
"At about 11:45 a.m. all of the employees who were working on the 6th floor came downstairs and we were all out on the street at about 12:00 o'clock noon. These employees were: Bill Shelley, Charles Givens, Billy Lovelady, Bonnie Ray (last name not known) and a Spanish boy (his name I cannot remember)."
James Jarman police report reprinted in Bonner, p. 286

11:45 needed explained so Buell takes the hit.


From memory I recall a conversation Shelley and/or Truly had with someone was to the effect that he, Shelley or Truly, had to check with the boss upstairs before letting the boys knock off early. Can someone nail this down?
I recall asking whom he would ask upstairs Cason or Campbell? I don't believe I ever got an answer to this question.
And would imply whomever asked did so on the first floor, not upstairs...

Cheers, Ed
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part B

Post by Ed. Ledoux on Wed 28 Jun 2017, 5:07 am

Implication was they were going to take EXTRA time off for lunch break.
A full hour.
This needed supervisory approval and was I assume okayed trough Campbell-Truly-Shelley.
It was a Friday after all, and not sure as to the Saturday crew as far as flooring, but seemed like a 'start fresh on Monday' was Shelley's plan.


Sometime during the morning, Oswald stopped co-worker James Jarman, Jr., known
as Junior, by a first floor window, and asked why people were beginning to
congregate in front of the Depository. Jarman told him the President's parade
would be passing by. Oswald asked Jarman if he knew which way the parade was
coming. Jarman said it probably would be headed west on Main, turn north on
Houston, then make a left turn in front of the Depository to head west on Elm.
Oswald replied, "Oh, I see" (3 H 201).




Side note, I'll drop this here and in the Roll Call Remedy thread:

Piper was the porter.
So would be packing books or doing his Porter-ly duties
emptying waste baskets shining shoes or whatever it was he was kept on to do.

But here we see him going home before any lineup or it seems word that there is no more work that day Shocked Shocked


Mr. BALL. Did you at anytime after the shooting miss Lee Oswald---did you notice he wasn't around?
Mr. PIPER. No, sir; I didn't notice it until the lineup. You know, I just figured all the people was there.
Mr. BALL. You did notice it at the lineup, did you?
Mr. PIPER. Yes.
Mr. BALL. Tell us about that.
Mr. PIPER. I did notice it in the lineup.
Mr. BALL. What do you mean by the lineup?
Mr. PIPER. I mean, when they lined us all up and told us to give our name and address and just to go home.
Mr. BALL. You say "they"; who do you mean?
Mr. PIPER. The detective---whoever it was.
Mr. BALL. The police?
Mr. PIPER. Yes; they had the building all surrounded. They went to locking the doors back and front and told us to all come up and then go home, and I told him, I says, "I've got to go down in the basement and get my clothes," and he said, "You can go down and get your clothes and come on back up here, but give me your identification and your name and tell us where you are staying," and everybody heard me say that, I guess, and he let us out of the building, one by one, and I went on out the front door.

Mr. PIPER. No, sir; I didn't mention it but I knows he wasn't in the lineup, and Charles---I don't know whether he was, but he went out for lunch.
Mr. BALL. Was Charles Givens there?
Mr. PIPER. I couldn't remember seeing him. He went out for lunch and I don't remember whether he come out from the building again or not because I was getting dressed to get out of there myself.
Mr. BALL. That's all.
Mr. PIPER. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.


BOOM! Why was Eddie getting dressed to go home, in the basement, and not aware of any lineup?

Oh man Ball cut him off after he said he was "GETTING DRESSED TO GET OUT OF THERE MYSELF."

Who else was there in the basement?
Buell was in the basement with his, lunch, clothes, etc. too.... well well


Eddie contradicts himself on this point:

"It was about 1:00 PM when the police made us vacate the building and as we were being checked out, I noticed that "Lee" wasn't with us and I mentioned to some of the employees there checking out that Lee wasn't there and somebody said, he must have already gone out."

and here

Mr. BALL. Did you say something to anybody about not seeing Oswald there?
Mr. PIPER. No, sir; I didn't say it, but I just saw he wasn't in the lineup--I didn't tell anyone because I didn't see him.
Mr. BALL. Just tell us what did you notice?
Mr. PIPER. I noticed he was not in the lineup.
Mr. BALL. You noticed that he was not in the lineup?
Mr. PIPER. Yes.
Mr. BALL. But you didn't mention it to anybody?
389


Mr. PIPER. No, sir; I didn't mention it but I knows he wasn't in the lineup, and Charles---I don't know whether he was, but he went out for lunch.

Eddie is not good at lying.

In his Sheriff dept. Affidavit of 11/23 he states:
"This man Lee has never talked much to anyone and hardly said anything to me.
He kept pretty much to himself and hardly even answer when I would say "Good morning"."

Yet a couple lines before is this he tells us:
Yesterday at about 12:00 Noon, this fellow Lee says to me, "I'm going up to eat"


So have I impugned all the TSBD employees yet? Or merely shown they needed perjurer added to their resumes.

Cheers, Ed
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part B

Post by Ed. Ledoux on Wed 28 Jun 2017, 1:13 pm

Buell in the basement alone?
If Buell is in the basement could he open the gate to the freight elevator and hold the elevator hostage?
Would he not notice when he goes to the quiet basement if the freight elevators are moving?

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=10408&relPageId=301&search=depository_basement%20-ruby


Whereabouts of Oswald ? In the basement of TSBD?!?! WTH???
Would Buell or a officer in the basement be a Material Witness if there is nothing in the basement to witness?
[list=lr_dct_sf_sens]
[*]a witness whose evidence is likely to be sufficiently important to influence the outcome of a trial.
[/list]
Two locations are subject of memo, the House of Paine/Randle's, Irving and TSBD, Dallas for these whereabouts? When was Oswald in the basement?
https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=62308&relPageId=141&search=depository_basement%20-ruby


Search of basement,

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=9914&relPageId=19&search=depository_basement%20-ruby



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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part B

Post by Stan Dane on Thu 29 Jun 2017, 3:12 am

Ed. Ledoux wrote:I find the whole mess a bunch a crap.
There was no COKE.
Lee drank Dr Pepper.
The bottle on the steps is a DP.
There were DP's left in the machine as Sawyer is drinking one out front!

We know the second floor lunchroom encounter is bullshit. Overwhelming direct and circumstantial evidence that it never happened. Beyond any reasonable doubt. Period.
 
With this established, what is the one thing, the one term, you always hear in discussions involving Oswald's movements in the 3 minutes following the assassination?
 
A Coke.
 
It is doctrine for both lone nutter and conspiracy theorists alike.
 
If your beverage of choice is Dr. Pepper—and it is available on the first floor—why go to the second floor to get a Coke?
 
The Coke fetish that most have is simply a supporting piece of the fiction—the preponderance of phony evidence—to show Oswald was in the second floor lunchroom 90 seconds after the shooting.
 
There was an empty Dr. Pepper bottle close to where Prayer Man was standing as seen in a photo following the assassination. Prayer Man seems to be holding something in his hand(s) in Wiegman. (Who else was seen drinking a soda pop during this time?)
 
When one lies, everything they say must be questioned. I question the Coke.
 
I agree, Ed. There was no Coke. How do I know this? Because most everybody talks about it, and as with the second floor lunchroom encounter, most everybody is wrong.
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part B

Post by The Prodigal Son on Thu 29 Jun 2017, 5:29 am

Stan Dane wrote:
Ed. Ledoux wrote:I find the whole mess a bunch a crap.
There was no COKE.
Lee drank Dr Pepper.
The bottle on the steps is a DP.
There were DP's left in the machine as Sawyer is drinking one out front!

We know the second floor lunchroom encounter is bullshit. Overwhelming direct and circumstantial evidence that it never happened. Beyond any reasonable doubt. Period.
 
With this established, what is the one thing, the one term, you always hear in discussions involving Oswald's movements in the 3 minutes following the assassination?
 
A Coke.
 
It is doctrine for both lone nutter and conspiracy theorists alike.
 
If your beverage of choice is Dr. Pepper—and it is available on the first floor—why go to the second floor to get a Coke?
 
The Coke fetish that most have is simply a supporting piece of the fiction—the preponderance of phony evidence—to show Oswald was in the second floor lunchroom 90 seconds after the shooting.
 
There was an empty Dr. Pepper bottle close to where Prayer Man was standing as seen in a photo following the assassination. Prayer Man seems to be holding something in his hand(s) in Wiegman. (Who else was seen drinking a soda pop during this time?)
 
When one lies, everything they say must be questioned. I question the Coke.
 
I agree, Ed. There was no Coke. How do I know this? Because most everybody talks about it, and as with the second floor lunchroom encounter, most everybody is wrong

It is this type of post, this type of thinking, this type of conclusion - - that proves the best JFK research site on the internet is this one - - period.
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part B

Post by Ed. Ledoux on Thu 29 Jun 2017, 7:21 am

It is No Ka Oi!

Buell here changes where he discussed the Ride For Rods.
Now its over at the wrapping table,,, how convenient for the WC

Mr. FRAZIER - Well, I say, we were standing like I said at the four-headed table about half as large as this, not, quite half as large, but anyway I was standing there getting the orders in and he said, "Could I ride home with you this afternoon?"
And I said, "Sure. You know, like I told you, you can go home with me any time you want to, like I say anytime you want to go see your wife that is all right with me."
So automatically I knew it wasn't Friday, I come to think it wasn't Friday and I said, "Why are you going home today?"
And he says, "I am going home to get some curtain rods." He said, "You know, put in an apartment."
He wanted to hang up some curtains and I said, "Very well." And I never thought more about it and I had some invoices in my hands for some orders and I walked on off and started filling the orders.


Buell had said by the basement stairs was where Lee asks before noon on 11/21...

Cheers, Ed
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part B

Post by Stan Dane on Thu 29 Jun 2017, 7:59 am

You are a freakin' machine, Ed. You can post faster than I can think. This basement business has given me new things to think about. I can barely keep up. You are amazing!
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part B

Post by greg parker on Thu 29 Jun 2017, 8:40 am

Stan Dane wrote:You are a freakin' machine, Ed. You can post faster than I can think. This basement business has given me new things to think about. I can barely keep up. You are amazing!
I'm not convinced there is just one "Ed". Strange things happen on tropical islands. What the? 

The curtain rod story never made sense to me.  

Who was supplying the curtains to put on the rods?

What was the urgency that he had to have the rods that night? Are we to believe he wasn't going back to the Paine's for the weekend? If he was, then the rods could have waited till Monday. If he wasn't, why not? And if he wasn't staying and really did need rods, it could only be for some other place other than the room at N Beckley which didn't need them. And what sort of apartment or boarding house advertises rooms or apartments without window coverings, or that need them replaced anyway?

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Mixing Pop and Politics he asks me what the use is
I offer him embarrassment and my usual excuses
While looking down the corridor
Out to where the van is waiting
I'm looking for the Great Leap Forward

            Billy Bragg
-----------------------------
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             Lachie Hulme            
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The Cold War ran on bullshit.
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part B

Post by Ed. Ledoux on Thu 29 Jun 2017, 8:50 am

No worries Stan,
I think I have a gland that absorbs lies,
when its full all the crap I've heard, seen or read comes flying out.
Sometimes its cogent.
Sometimes regurgitated crap.
Its been well fed lately.

Like this on the 11:45 knock off time Buell says he asked for,
Bug deflects any such as very early and unusual.
Here is how he handles it:



I think Bug misreads Seeing Lee while Shelley is eating his lunch at 11:50
for Shelley coming down and then seeing Lee.
I think Shelley is saying where and when he LAST saw Lee.

While he was on the first floor eating his lunch, in his office and noticed Lee over near the telephone.
Characterization is that Lee was still working at 11:50 ... Yes?
Cheers, Ed
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part B

Post by Stan Dane on Thu 29 Jun 2017, 9:15 am

Ed. Ledoux wrote:I think Bug misreads Seeing Lee while Shelley is eating his lunch at 11:50
for Shelley coming down and then seeing Lee.
I think Shelley is saying where and when he LAST saw Lee.

While he was on the first floor eating his lunch, in his office and noticed Lee over near the telephone.
Characterization is that Lee was still working at 11:50 ... Yes?
Cheers, Ed

As Mark Knopfler said, "Sometimes you're the windshield. Sometimes you're the bug." 

Unless, of course, you're Bugliosi. Then you're always the bug. 

"Splat!"
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part B

Post by greg parker on Thu 29 Jun 2017, 9:22 am

We all know now the type of information the likes of Norman, Jarman and Shield had because of their HSCA interviews.

But it looks very much like Norman at least, may have given that same info to the WC -- but it was taken "off the record"

Mr. McCLOY. You testified that you had not seen Oswald except this one occasion in the morning. Did you hear any of your friends or coworkers say whether they had seen Oswald on that morning? 
Mr. NORMAN. Not until after 
Mr. McCLOY. After the assassination? 
Mr. NORMAN. Yes, sir; that is the only time. 
Mr. BALL. Off the record. 
(Discussion off the record.) 
The CHAIRMAN. Did you see Brennan down there when you came downstairs? Did you come out the front door? 


What did Norman say  about Oswald's movements that we weren't allowed to hear?


Last edited by greg parker on Thu 29 Jun 2017, 9:33 am; edited 1 time in total

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“God favors drunks, small children, and the cataclysmically stoned...” Steve King
"The worst thing about some men is that when they are not drunk they are sober." Billy Yeats
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part B

Post by greg parker on Thu 29 Jun 2017, 9:33 am

greg parker wrote:We all know now the type of information the likes of Norman, Jarman and Shield had because of their HSCA interviews.

But it looks very much like Norman at least, may have given that same info to the WC -- but it was taken "off the record"

Mr. McCLOY. You testified that you had not seen Oswald except this one occasion in the morning. Did you hear any of your friends or coworkers say whether they had seen Oswald on that morning? 
Mr. NORMAN. Not until after 
Mr. McCLOY. After the assassination? 
Mr. NORMAN. Yes, sir; that is the only time. 
Mr. BALL. Off the record. 
(Discussion off the record.) 
The CHAIRMAN. Did you see Brennan down there when you came downstairs? Did you come out the front door? 


What did Norman say  about Oswald's movements that we weren't allowed to hear?
I think Warren gives us a major clue as to what was being discussed. They went from talking about Oswald sightings that morning before going off the record to discussing seeing Brennan outside post-assassination. That is a major hint that this was about Oswald leaving the building.

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Mixing Pop and Politics he asks me what the use is
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             Lachie Hulme            
-----------------------------
The Cold War ran on bullshit.
              Me

“God favors drunks, small children, and the cataclysmically stoned...” Steve King
"The worst thing about some men is that when they are not drunk they are sober." Billy Yeats
"You're not drunk if you can lie on the floor without holding on." Dino Martin



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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part B

Post by Ed. Ledoux on Thu 29 Jun 2017, 9:39 am

greg parker wrote:
Stan Dane wrote:You are a freakin' machine, Ed. You can post faster than I can think. This basement business has given me new things to think about. I can barely keep up. You are amazing!
I'm not convinced there is just one "Ed". Strange things happen on tropical islands. What the? 

The curtain rod story never made sense to me.  
There is your first clue
Who was supplying the curtains to put on the rods?
The Curtain Fairy, whom else?
Supposedly Marina and Buell tried to pass this stone along


What was the urgency that he had to have the rods that night?
Full moon?
Are we to believe he wasn't going back to the Paine's for the weekend?
I'd have to check Ruth's calendar.
If he was, then the rods could have waited till Monday. If he wasn't, why not? And if he wasn't staying and really did need rods, it could only be for some other place other than the room at N Beckley which didn't need them. And what sort of apartment or boarding house advertises rooms or apartments without window coverings, or that need them replaced anyway?
Neely Street, and Waldo George, and only if you can believe the meter reader could peek inside (of course this was physically impossible)


From the HSCA transcript, posted earlier in the thread.

BUELL WESLEY FRAZIER: THEY FOUND OUT THAT THE PRESIDENTIAL PARADE WAS GOING TO BE COMING BY THE TEXAS SCHOOL BOOK DEPOSITORY, AND A LOT OF PEOPLE WERE VERY EXCITED ABOUT THAT. THEY SAID GOSH, WE GOT A CHANCE TO SEE THE PRESIDENT, AND AS THEY WERE TALKING THEN THEY ALL REALIZED THAT HE MAY COME BACK AFTER LUNCH BREAK OR AFTER LUNCH BREAK AND THERE'S A POSSIBILITY THAT WE WOULDN'T GET A CHANCE TO SEE THE PARADE. SO SOMEONE HAD GONE TO MR. SHELLY AND ASKED, ARE WE GOING TO GET TO SEE THE PRESIDENTIAL PARADE? AND THERE WAS -- I GUESS HE CHECKED WITH MR. TRULY AND MR. TRULY CHECKED WITH HIS BOSSES WHO WERE UP ON THE SECOND FLOOR AND THEY HAD COME BACK WITH THE REPLY THAT, YES, WE WOULD STOP AND EVERYONE COULD SEE THE PRESIDENTIAL PARADE. SO WE CONTINUED TO WORK AND THEN AT A CERTAIN TIME WE STOPPED AND EVERYONE GOT READY TO WATCH THE PARADE.


Wait a cotton picking second!?
Who asked Shelley?
I thought Buell said he had.

Cheers, Ed
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part B

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