Hyde My Paine

It has been said that RP met MO in Feb 1963.

This seems to point to a correspondence from Minsk prior this.

Looks like you've done it again Barto. This is up there with the p. parade. Where did she get the address? What was said? Seems there was a tidy welcoming committee waiting for them in Dallas before they ever left Russia? Not just a chance meeting, but set up in advance. I thought DeM was supposed to have introduced them at a party in Dallas after they got there.

How does this kind of thing just sit around going unnoticed until someone like you comes along? Whomever might have seen it before you did didn't want to make waves I guess.

Great find, Barto.

Thanks, but this document ought to be ordered from NARA as there is nothing of this doc available online. And we can actually see what was being written.

Who will do this? I am a lil' too occupied with scanning and what not.

https://eservices.archives.gov/orderonline/start.swe?SWECmd=Start&SWEHo=eservices.archives.gov

I've put a request into NARA Bart.

Is this the document you're looking for? It appears to be a mislabeling for a letter from Pavel Golovachov in Minsk addressed to "Mrs. Ruth Paine (for Mrs. M. Oswald)", i.e. "for" (not "from") Mrs. M. Oswald

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=95768#relPageId=1 (item 2, "ltr from Minsk addressed to Ruth Paine from Marina")

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=95768#relPageId=3 (two pages later, explanation of the item, "for Mrs. M. Oswald")

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=95768#relPageId=5 (two pages later, explanation repeated)

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=95768#relPageId=13 (eight pages later, photograph of the envelope in question)

Greg_Doudna wrote:Is this the document you're looking for? It appears to be a mislabeling for a letter from Pavel Golovachov in Minsk addressed to "Mrs. Ruth Paine (for Mrs. M. Oswald)", i.e. "for" (not "from") Mrs. M. Oswald

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=95768#relPageId=1 (item 2, "ltr from Minsk addressed to Ruth Paine from Marina")

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=95768#relPageId=3 (two pages later, explanation of the item, "for Mrs. M. Oswald")

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=95768#relPageId=5 (two pages later, explanation repeated)

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=95768#relPageId=13 (eight pages later, photograph of the envelope in question)

Greg, that would be it.  

You got lucky this time.

But St Peter is waiting.

https://www.youtube.com/clip/UgkxRCgMKarqps7YwsNql_MDcAcZHvTk3jdq

greg_parker wrote:

Greg_Doudna wrote:Is this the document you're looking for? It appears to be a mislabeling for a letter from Pavel Golovachov in Minsk addressed to "Mrs. Ruth Paine (for Mrs. M. Oswald)", i.e. "for" (not "from") Mrs. M. Oswald

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=95768#relPageId=1 (item 2, "ltr from Minsk addressed to Ruth Paine from Marina")

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=95768#relPageId=3 (two pages later, explanation of the item, "for Mrs. M. Oswald")

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=95768#relPageId=5 (two pages later, explanation repeated)

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=95768#relPageId=13 (eight pages later, photograph of the envelope in question)

Greg, that would be it.  

You got lucky this time.

But St Peter is waiting.

https://www.youtube.com/clip/UgkxRCgMKarqps7YwsNql_MDcAcZHvTk3jdq

Confirming these are the documents which are attached to the cover page Barto posted.

I've received a response from NARA ; If you wish me to proceed let me know.

Thank you for contacting the National Personnel Records Center. The records needed to complete your inquiry were not located in our center. Please submit the SF-180 to the following agency:
   NARA DC: 1-866-272-6272    
You can download the SF-180 from the link below.
https://www.archives.gov/files/research/order/standard-form-180.pdf
If you are still in need of assistance, please call customer service at 314.801.0800.

Thank you Greg this looks to be correct.

It is quite telling that MFF has this doc whereas NARA does not.

Liars oft live a long life, afraid to meet their maker... you know the one she cant mislead.
Alesi is a tool. Wouldnt know he's been lied to by Ruth and likely doesnt care. Rotten Ruth is a saint in his blurred vision.
JFK, Tippit and Oswald murdered and he says bless Ruth Paine. Thats rich. I'd sacrifice a billion Ruth's to have any one of the three back.. God bless them all.

She will be visiting Dealey Plaza next year for the 60th anniversary. Will be giving a speech.

https://ramblernewspapers.com/2019/10/ruth-paine-remembers-lee-harvey-oswald/


Paine delivered a heartfelt story that put many questions to rest.
“Before I get into things, I need to explain how it was Michael Paine, my ex-husband, and I first came to Texas,” Paine said. “I was active with a group called the Young Friends Committee of North America, a group of high-school and college kids, or Quakers, and this was during the Cold War era. We were trying to see what we could do to make people be nicer to each other.

“We wanted to do an exchange of young Quakers. Young people from here to go to Russia, and we wanted Russians to come to the states. I met Michael through this program at an international folk-dance. We both loved folk-dancing, and he taught me about choir singing. We got together with a group of people who were also into singing, and this was our community that we had in the Philadelphia area where we lived at the time. A couple of years went by, and we got married, and settled down.
“The hardest part about telling this story is the tremendous amount of grief it brings. I really admired President Kennedy. It was so sad to see him killed. I was also very close friends with Marina, Lee’s wife.

“Many people ask me why Marina was at my house during this time. At that point, Michael and I had separated, because the marriage just wasn’t working out. It was a very sad time for me. The two losses kind of intertwined in my spirit, and my feelings about the loss of the dream of a marriage and the loss of the dream of President Kennedy. Kennedy dreamed for us so beautifully, what with the Peace Corps, and he was also the one who made it possible for us to go to the moon and come back. We’ve been seeing a lot about that on television recently. That’s why Marina, my friend, was at my house. She was there to support me.
“Of course, Marina also taught me a lot of the Russian language,” Paine said. “You can’t beat living with somebody who is a native speaker. That was wonderful for me. I first met Lee and Marina in February of ’63.

“There was a party in Dallas, and Michael and I were invited. He had a cold and didn’t go. That night, I met Lee, who entertained people in the kitchen. I spent most of my time with Marina in the bedroom. She had a little baby, and I got her address and asked whether or not I could write her. I wrote to her and eventually arranged to actually go and visit her at their place in Dallas. The first time I went to go visit her, I discovered she was expecting another baby. She lost that baby, and Lee tried encouraging her to go back to the Soviet Union. I knew she didn’t want to go, and so I wrote her a letter telling her she could come and stay at my house.

“Something I didn’t know at the time was that on March 20, Lee had gotten his rifle,” Paine said. “On April 10, Oswald had shot at a man named Edwin Walker. He actually left a note for Marina on what to do if he was sent to prison, which I’ve read, and I think it really gives a lot of insight as to what was going on in Lee’s mind at the time.
“At first, I didn’t know about all of this, but Marina did. She found the note that evening when Lee hadn’t come home when he was expected to. She had gotten nervous, wondering where he was and found the note on his desk.

“On April 24, I went over to their home to visit, and Lee was all packed up to go somewhere. All of his things were packed up, and he asked if I could give him a ride to the bus station. He was planning to go to New Orleans to see if he could get a job there. Looking back, I probably suspected that Marina wanted to get him out of town.

“The police were still looking for Edwin Walker’s shooter. They didn’t know it was him, yet. Marina was so terrified about what could possibly happen. I agreed to take him to the bus station. He wanted Marina to eventually join him in New Orleans with the children, but I suggested she stay at my house for a few days. I had a phone, so he could call Marina anytime he wanted, and I could drive her and the baby down to New Orleans. He agreed to that, and so that is what we did.
“I later went to visit the family down in New Orleans. When I was down there, I noticed a toxicity in Marina and Lee’s relationship. I never saw him hit her, but I later learned that he did. When I got there, Lee was fixing to go somewhere, and I was very concerned that he was not in a position where he could really provide for his family. So, I suggested that Marina and the children come back to live with me, and he felt good about that.
“At that point, Marina was eight months pregnant and hadn’t received any medical attention, because they couldn’t afford it. However, since they had lived long enough in Dallas County, I could get her free care in regards to seeing how the pregnancy was going. Also, for when the baby came, I could get her into the hospital. I think Lee was grateful for that.
“He packed up our car,” Paine said. “Looking back, I realize one of the really tall, Marine Corps duffel backs he packed in the car probably had the rifle in it. Again, at this point, I didn’t know he had a rifle.

“When Marina, the children, and I, got back to Irving, we put all of their things in the garage. After about a week or so, Lee came to Dallas. Lee didn’t have a car, and I myself had just had a baby, so I wasn’t able to come get him. He hitch-hiked, which worked well for him. He was small and tidy. The guy who picked him up brought him the whole way.
“Lee eventually got a job working at the Texas schoolbook depository,” Paine said. “Marina and I had a neighbor with family who worked at the business, and so we were able to get him a job through that. Lee went to the interview and got the job. I later found out he lied on the interview, which doesn’t surprise me. Even though I only let Oswald visit our house on the weekends, I think this was a very relaxed setting for him. He enjoyed spending the weekends visiting his wife and children. He was grateful.

“Soon, Marina gave birth to another baby, named Rachael, and Lee had given us the phone number of a place to call in case the baby came, so we could let him know. Supposedly, this was the place where he was staying. However, we didn’t use it, because the baby came on a Sunday, and Lee was actually at the house. That worked out perfectly, because it was the evening, and the kids were in bed. I needed to take Marina to the hospital, and he could stay home and babysit the kids, which is what we did.
“That Veteran’s Day weekend was a three-day weekend, and Marina asked him not to come out to the house that weekend. She felt he had overstayed his welcome the weekend before when my daughter had a birthday party. She did miss him, though, and she asked me to dial that number he had given us to reach him at earlier.

“When I dialed the number, the woman on the other end said that there was no Lee Oswald there. I hung up in confusion. That Monday afternoon, he called Marina after work, and she asked him about this. He became furious, said he had been going under a different name, and that she shouldn’t have tried to reach him. They had a very hot argument on the phone. That was the week before the assassination.

“Aside from the phone incident, the week went pretty normal,” Paine said. “We were excited to see President Kennedy. Very excited. We hadn’t had TV for very long, but I watched the TV as the President and his wife were due for a breakfast in Fort Worth that morning. The breakfast caused the President and his wife to be a little late for their arrival in Dallas. On TV, the news reporter was trying to fill the time, and he mentioned the assassination of President McKinley. How is it that was so much in the air in Dallas? People were worried about President Kennedy’s safety, and it speaks to the fact that the air was filled with worry.
“That morning, I had to take my kid to a dental appointment. I left the TV on, because I knew when Marina got up, she would want to see what was going on. After I got back with my kid from the dentist, we all sat there, watching.
Paine paused for a moment.

“Then, we heard that President Kennedy had been shot,” Paine said. “One of the news-people reporting on the event said he saw a pink cloud rise from President Kennedy’s head. At that point, I knew it was fatal. It was about an hour later when we learned that he had, in fact, died. It was mid-afternoon when six police officers arrived at our door, saying they had Oswald in custody for shooting an officer. I knew this was not good.
“Eventually, the police were able to prove that Lee was the one who had shot President Kennedy. Sometime later, Lee actually called me, and asked if I could help him get a lawyer. I had very mixed feelings about that. He had a right to a lawyer and to a hearing, but I didn’t appreciate his asking anything of me at that point.
“At this point, Marina was not living with me, but I had started getting the mail for Marina. Americans were very generous, wanting to send letters and money to help out this young mother who was in a terrible spot. If they sent cash, I would write a check for that amount and send it to Marina. She would also ask for clothes, and I would send her those as well. Also, hooray for the Irving Police Department. They had stationed an officer in front of my house, and I would take the packages of whatever I wanted to send to Marina out to the officer, and he would make sure she got them.

“The fact Oswald had shot someone before he shot the President should have been a sign,” Paine said. “I do think it’s possible, though, that he wasn’t actually planning to shoot President Kennedy. I knew his personality, and if he had decided earlier that Thursday morning, as he went to work, he was going to shoot the President, he would have taken his pistol with him.

“After he shot President Kennedy, he went back to where he was staying, got his pistol, and shot Officer Tippet. Then, he was caught at the Texas Theatre. The arresting officer had been trying to grab the gun from him, but he wasn’t shot. Those are the stories I have about my acquaintance with Lee. Every time I tell this story, I get so many different questions. However, there is always one question I can never seem to answer, and that is, why.”

A new interview with Ruth.

https://www.dallasnews.com/arts-entertainment/2022/11/17/ruth-paine-who-lent-a-helping-hand-to-lee-and-marina-oswald-looks-back-at-nov-22-1963/

Another slow day in News in Dallas. The bloody Arts reporter on the case. FFS's

ARTS WRITER

[size=46]Michael Granberry
Covers: Arts and feature writing[/size]

Mick_Purdy wrote:Another slow day in News in Dallas. The bloody Arts reporter on the case. FFS's

ARTS WRITER

[size=46]Michael Granberry
Covers: Arts and feature writing[/size]

He has a had a few cracks at thhe case... from the Arts and Entertainment perspective of course. Including one Spanish language artucle.

https://www.dallasnews.com/author/michael-granberry/

In the back John Adamcik. Marina and Marguerite are obscured by the camera. And of course Mike Paine.
https://texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth184905/m1/1/

https://www.thesanfranciscoexperiencepodcast.com/blog/ruth-paine-one-of-the-few-surviving-warren-commission-witnesses-to-appear-on-tsfep-1/

barto wrote:https://www.thesanfranciscoexperiencepodcast.com/blog/ruth-paine-one-of-the-few-surviving-warren-commission-witnesses-to-appear-on-tsfep-1/

 Wonder whether she will be asked any tough questions?

Ruth is upset with Max.