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reinventing the wheel

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reinventing the wheel

Post by greg parker on Sun 29 Jan 2017, 9:45 pm

To his credit Sandy Larsen at the EF has concluded there is something fishy about Bookhout's report and Fritz's notes and he has worked out what it is - the insertion of the 2nd floor lunch encounter.

What Sandy has either forgotten, or missed reading is that Sean Murphy already had this all sorted.

Bookhout's solo report, as Sandy thought, was on the same interrogation as the joint report he did with Hosty. It was done for the sole purpose of inserting the 2nd floor bullshit into Oswald's mouth. I don't think they gave a shit that it made a mockery of the timeline by having Oswald eating lunch AFTER the assassination. They simply didn't think anyone would ever question it. This was a period when the word of law officers and government officials were rarely, if ever, questioned when it came to criminal suspects.

Now we come to Fritz's notes. Though I disagreed with Sean on this initially, he sold me on it, as he did with the majority of what he put forth. The "it" I was sold on here was that Fritz had the problem of not having kept any notes and now needing to put together a report and having to give evidence to a commission. So he cribbed a rough timeline and what was said from Bookhout. Pure and simple. That is why they are the only 2 who end up with the shit they ended up with.

For, Sandy, should he read this, let me also point out something I have pointed to a few times in the past, which shows IMO, that Fritz knew full well the whole thing was a fabrication.

The only place he stumbles in his testimony is on the question of Oswald's lunch-time alibi:

Mr. BALL. Did you ask him what happened that day; where he had been? 
Mr. FRITZ. Yes, sir. 
Mr. BALL. What did he say? 
Mr. FRITZ. Well he told me that he was eating lunch with some of the employees when this happened, and that he saw all the excitement and he didn't think--I also asked him why he left the building. He said there was so much excitement there then that "I didn't think there would be any work done that afternoon and we don't punch a clock and they don't keep very close time on our work and I just left." 
Mr. BALL. At that time didn't you know that one of your officers, Baker, had seen Oswald on the second floor? 
Mr. FRITZ. They told me about that down at the bookstore; I believe Mr. Truly or someone told me about it, told me they had met him--I think he told me, person who told me about, I believe told me that they met him on the stairway, but our investigation shows that he actually saw him in a lunchroom, a little lunchroom where they were eating, and he held his gun on this man and Mr. Truly told him that he worked there, and the officer let him go. 
Mr. BALL. Did you question Oswald about that? 
Mr. FRITZ. Yes, sir; I asked him about that and he knew that the officer stopped him all right. 
Mr. BALL. Did you ask him what he was doing in the lunchroom? 
Mr. FRITZ. He said he was having his lunch. He had a cheese sandwich and a Coca-Cola. 
Mr. BALL. Did he tell you he was up there to get a Coca-Cola? 
Mr. FRITZ. He said he had a Coca-Cola. 



"they told me about that" I believe Truly or somebody told me about that" "told me they had met him-I think told me" "person who told me about" I believe told me". What would a voice stress analysis have told us about this section of his testimony, I wonder? Fritz is staggering worse than a drunken sailor.

They had "met him on the stairwell". Of course, that was not Oswald. That was Mr 3rd or 4th Floor Man.  "Our investigation"??? Sounds impressive doesn't it? A cop makes a report about an encounter on the 3rd or 4th stairwell, but "our investigation" proves it happened in the 2nd floor lunch room. And Baker is locked in. 

But the insertion of the second floor is not the only clue that Fritz cribbed from Bookhout because Bookhout also changed something else from the joint report. He changed Oswald seeing two black workers re-entering the building to Oswald actually have lunch with those workers - a fact they could and did easily refute since it never happened. Bang goes the alibi. The only other person to claim Oswald said he had lunch with others? Fritz.


Last edited by greg parker on Mon 30 Jan 2017, 8:33 am; edited 3 times in total

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Re: reinventing the wheel

Post by Jake Sykes on Mon 30 Jan 2017, 1:37 am

It's good to see Sandy picking up the torch for the bogus 2nd floor encounter, and I did read him give credit to "the good folks at ROKC", but Greg's right, it's reinventing the wheel. It has ALL been covered already, but again, progress on the issue is encouraging as others begin to really see evidence for what it has already shown us.

In the same spirit of giving credit (and I don't claim to have figured out the bogus 2nd floor stuff either by the way, that's Sean, Greg, Barto, and others not me all the way) I do mark Sandy with bending Baker's run away from the door and up Elm toward Houston. That was quite the spectacular revelation.
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Re: reinventing the wheel

Post by Jake Sykes on Mon 30 Jan 2017, 5:42 am

I will add that if we are ready to reinvent the wheel, then we should also be ready to adapt our lexicon. 

The body of indicators assembled for the WC that are specific to demonstrating an alleged meeting of Baker and Oswald in a lunchroom on the second floor of the TSBD have become generally known as referencing "Oswald's 2nd Floor Encounter".

Similarly, it is my opinion that the body of indicators assembled through citizen investigations of the assassination of JFK that are specific to demonstrating Oswald's physical presence on the First Floor of the TSBD at the time of the assassination do now qualify as and so should now become generally known as referencing "Oswald's First Floor Alibi".

As such, this category encompasses the totality of the evidence including but not limited to the Prayer Man imagery, the various news media reports, the evolution of the statements given by the primary players in the entire episode, and all else known and yet to be discovered in support of OFFA.
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Re: reinventing the wheel

Post by greg parker on Thu 02 Feb 2017, 9:19 am

The debate between Larsen and Briggs is interesting but continues to go over old ground that would not need to be gone over again if they read the whole thread (understandably a daunting task).

In my opinion, the mistakes they are making include

1. As above. Not understanding that Fritz's notes (and therefore much of his testimony on the interrogations) was cribbed from Bookhout's fallacious report written specifically to counter the joint report with Host and thereby change Oswald's alibi to something that could be refuted.

2. Placing almost total reliance on testimony over first day statements. If for example, someone stated on day one that they did "abc", but then told the Warren Commission they did "abz" (or "ayz" or "xyz"), given that first statements are generally regarded as the most reliable, and given what we know about the WC, I just do not understand why first day statements are ignored by so many.

Brigg's main bone of contention is on it's face quite reasonable. The record seems to indicate that Oswald said he was inside at the time of the shooting (whether it be the domino room, or 2nd floor lunchroom).

But here is what Holmes testified to:

Mr. HOLMES. He said when lunchtime came he was working in one of the upper floors with a Negro.
The Negro said, "Come on and let's eat lunch together."
Apparently both of them having a sack lunch. And he said, "You go ahead, send the elevator back up to me and I will come down just as soon as I am finished."
And he didn't say what he was doing. There was a commotion outside, which he later rushed downstairs to go out to see what was going on. He didn't say whether he took the stairs down. He didn't say whether he took the elevator down.
But he went downstairs, and as he went out the front, it seems as though he did have a coke with him, or he stopped at the coke machine, or somebody else was trying to get a coke, but there was a coke involved.
He mentioned something about a coke. But a police officer asked him who he was, and just as he started to identify himself, his superintendent came up and said, "He is one of our men." And the policeman said, "Well, you step aside for a little bit."
Then another man rushed in past him as he started out the door, in this vestibule part of it, and flashed some kind of credential and he said, "Where is your telephone, where is your telephone, and said I am so and so, where is your telephone."


We'll put aside the fact that the officer referred to here was not Baker but Kaminski. To me, it is clearly stating that he went outside prior to the entry of any officers. The "commotion" therefore that drew him out was pre-assassination noise as the motorcade was nearing. 

His written report states:

"When asked as to his whereabouts at the time of the shooting, he stated that when lunch time came, and he didn't say which floor he was on, he said one of the Negro employees invited him to eat lunch with him and he stated "You go on down and send the elevator back up and I will join you in a few minutes." Before he could finish whatever he was doing, he stated, the commotion surrounding the assassination took place and when he went down stairs, a policeman questioned him as to his identification and his boss stated that "he is one of our employees" whereupon the policeman had him step aside momentarily. Following this, he simply walked out the front door of the building. I don't recall that anyone asked why he left or where or how he went. I just presumed that this had been covered in an earlier questioning.

Normally I put put more weight on the report, but the report is clearly in error. It has Oswald rushing down because of the commotion of the assassination and being stopped by a cop and vouched for by Truly straight away. This could not be Baker because Baker would not ask him to step aside for a minute. It has to be the cop later stationed at the door taking names - Kaminski.  

Holmes is confused and is compressing time and conflating some elements in his memory.

But what Oswald told him was about a coke for his lunch, hearing the commotion outside - stepping out in time to witness the assassination and then going back in before being stopped from leaving by Kaminski until he shows ID and is given the all-clear by Truly. 

In short, Oswald was not outside initially for much more time than we see in the PM clips - otherwise he was as he said - on the first floor eating lunch except for a quick trip upstairs to grab a coke. 

The conversation about sending the elevator back up happened at about 10 to 12 according to Givens - when the crew broke for lunch, All of the crew initially  recalled Oswald as being on the 5th floor at the time he hollered, but all changed it to the 6th for the WC. In any case, it's irrelevant. Between then and the assassination, Oswald was in the domino room eating. 
-----------------------
Briggs left Larsen with this quote:


 I will leave you with a quote from David K Johnson in his book The Big Questions of Philosophy
  Quote
We should never forget that our reasoning process can go wrong. This is why you always want to check your careful reasoning for flaws. Make sure thatno fallacious, instincitve reasoning slipped in. Try to find errors, even look for evidence that you're wrong. After all, how hard is it to confirm your beliefs if that's all you're trying to do?  Anyone can find some evidence for anything! If you want to prove yourself right — try to prove yourself wrong. Because if you try to prove yourself wrong — and can't? Then it's a really good indication that you're right. Want to be even more assured? Invite others to prove you wrong. And remember — admit it when you are wrong.

Which is funny, because when Sean M first contacted me, he was very clear on that being his exact approach. For example, he said he had spent a lot of time digging into various claims and theories that he came across and had been able to refute them all. He said the one claim he he had been unable to dismantle was the debunking of the 2nd floor encounter. Later, with his own PM claims, he rejected the offer to lay it out here in friendly territory, preferring to test it among lone nutters and cynics. 


I called this thread "reinventing the wheel". Perhaps I should have called it something else because a better comparison would have them putting together a jigsaw puzzle with only some of the pieces and wondering why they can't make it work.


Last edited by greg parker on Thu 02 Feb 2017, 10:29 am; edited 2 times in total

_________________
Mixing Pop and Politics he asks me what the use is
I offer him embarrassment and my usual excuses
While looking down the corridor
Out to where the van is waiting
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             Lachie Hulme            
-----------------------------
The Cold War ran on bullshit.
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“God favors drunks, small children, and the cataclysmically stoned...” Steve King
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Re: reinventing the wheel

Post by Paul Francisco Paso on Thu 02 Feb 2017, 10:21 am

The 2FE seemed fishy to me before Sean brought up Prayer Man. After he brought up Prayer Man and the evidence, fishy for me became bullshit. All these 2nd floor nutters are no better than LNs.
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Re: reinventing the wheel

Post by greg parker on Thu 02 Feb 2017, 10:45 am

Paul Francisco Paso wrote:The 2FE seemed fishy to me before Sean brought up Prayer Man. After he brought up Prayer Man and the evidence, fishy for me became bullshit. All these 2nd floor nutters are no better than LNs.
It's very frustrating. To me, it is clear that an encounter happened LATER between Oswald and a cop on the first floor. Because that was part of an entire lunchtime alibi that exonerated Oswald, they took elements of his description of his whereabouts (vestibule, two doors) and used that to relocate the incident to a floor where it became at least theoretically possible for him to have been the 6th floor assassin. The 2nd floor lunchroom fit the bill. Thereafter, the area outside the lunchroom would be referred to by one and all as a vestibule while the real vestibule located on the 1st floor was never again mentioned by that name - except by Holmes quoting Oswald.

The relocation as a bonus, also disposed of Baker's encounter on the 3rd or 4th floor. All they had to do was never mention his first day statement and get on board the 2nd floor express. If no one mentions his first day statement, they could pretend it didn't exist.

"Of course it happened on the second floor, Comrade. It has always happened on the second floor, and always will! We have never been at war with the first, third or fourth floors. Thy are our allies!"

_________________
Mixing Pop and Politics he asks me what the use is
I offer him embarrassment and my usual excuses
While looking down the corridor
Out to where the van is waiting
I'm looking for the Great Leap Forward

            Billy Bragg
-----------------------------
 Australians don't mind criminals: It's successful bullshit artists we despise. 
             Lachie Hulme            
-----------------------------
The Cold War ran on bullshit.
              Me

“God favors drunks, small children, and the cataclysmically stoned...” Steve King
"The worst thing about some men is that when they are not drunk they are sober." Billy Yeats
"You're not drunk if you can lie on the floor without holding on." Dino Martin



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Re: reinventing the wheel

Post by Goban Saor on Thu 02 Feb 2017, 10:16 pm

“Reinventing the wheel” is right, though that might be too kind. It’s more like obfuscating the fact that the wheel has already been invented.

The “Prayer Man thread” in the so-called Education Forum has now reached page 203. Sean Murphy’s final post on the thread on 22nd November 2013 was on page 83. I’m not aware of anything new of any significance on the thread since then. Further deconstruction of the 2nd floor encounter might be the only addition, but the main work on that had already been done by ROKCers elsewhere.

So, there’ve been 120 pages of mostly nonsense on the thread since Sean Murphy left. If anyone can show me that I’m wrong in that assessment and identify any progress made in those 120 pages, I would be most grateful.

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Re: reinventing the wheel

Post by Terry W. Martin on Fri 03 Feb 2017, 12:54 am

Goban Saor wrote:“Reinventing the wheel” is right, though that might be too kind. It’s more like obfuscating the fact that the wheel has already been invented.

The “Prayer Man thread” in the so-called Education Forum has now reached page 203. Sean Murphy’s final post on the thread on 22nd November 2013 was on page 83. I’m not aware of anything new of any significance on the thread since then. Further deconstruction of the 2nd floor encounter might be the only addition, but the main work on that had already been done by ROKCers elsewhere.

So, there’ve been 120 pages of mostly nonsense on the thread since Sean Murphy left. If anyone can show me that I’m wrong in that assessment and identify any progress made in those 120 pages, I would be most grateful.

Goban, I believe your assessment is correct.

All that is there is rehashing the groundwork already laid and the blustering of people who appear to be too lazy to have actually read the thread they are posting on.
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Re: reinventing the wheel

Post by Goban Saor on Fri 03 Feb 2017, 6:08 am

Thanks for that Terry. Too much exposure to specious verbiage can sometimes erode confidence in ones objectivity.

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Re: reinventing the wheel

Post by Ed. Ledoux on Fri 03 Feb 2017, 6:58 am

Over 3 Years and 120 pages, mostly trying square or rectangular hoops.

Nicely pointed out Goban, they are not satisfied with circular except in reasoning.
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Re: reinventing the wheel

Post by barto on Sat 04 Feb 2017, 11:05 pm

Add on this from auntie Martha Stroud (posted by Robin Unger at his site)

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Re: reinventing the wheel

Post by Stan Dane on Sun 05 Feb 2017, 4:38 am

Maybe I woke up on the wrong side of the bed this morning, but reading this makes me repeatedly want to chant the F-word.
 
FFS, any sane, critically thinking person who seeks the truth should immediately pick up on the problems with the fake second floor lunchroom encounter. The hell with a litmus test, it's an IQ test. No special credit to those claiming to be researchers for seeing the obvious. The evidence for the encounter happening down front is overwhelming. Just say it.
 
I was a Bill Kelly 2FrLrE guy in 2013. That all changed after Sean Murphy presented his facts over a period of weeks. Why? I have a brain, that's why. I can think for myself. That's why I'm here and not "there."
 
I recently went on the JFK Assassination Forum 12-Point Program:
 
"My name is Stan and I haven't visited a mainstream JFK forum in 6 days."

One day at a time.
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Re: reinventing the wheel

Post by Jake Sykes on Sun 05 Feb 2017, 6:55 am

I know what you mean Stan. I was all geared up to post a screen shot of discussion at EF that clearly shows that intelligence equals an  awareness of the bogus nature of the 2FE, but it's just so f'ing obvious that nobody needs me to show anybody at this point. So to hell with it. Everybody already knows, whether they choose to admit it or not.
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Re: reinventing the wheel

Post by Paul Francisco Paso on Sun 05 Feb 2017, 7:23 am

The 2FE is bogus. I don't know why it is sacred. This is what happens after 53 years of stagnation I guess. It becomes folklore. We all took it for granted but the real danger was to take it seriously. Before I came to ROKC I was a conservative type when it came to this case. After PM and the bus story deconstruction I threw everything I thought I knew out the window and started from scratch. It was the only way to get rid of the cobwebs.
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Re: reinventing the wheel

Post by Stan Dane on Sun 05 Feb 2017, 8:23 am

And never forget, Greg Parker did the heavy lifting on demolishing the second floor encounter. Sean Murphy stood on his shoulders with Prayer Man.
 
And one more thing: Greg is still in the arena. He's still here.
 
:: hoisting a cold one ::

Here's to you, Greg!
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Re: reinventing the wheel

Post by greg parker on Sun 05 Feb 2017, 9:18 am

Stan Dane wrote:And never forget, Greg Parker did the heavy lifting on demolishing the second floor encounter. Sean Murphy stood on his shoulders with Prayer Man.
 
And one more thing: Greg is still in the arena. He's still here.
 
:: hoisting a cold one ::

Here's to you, Greg!
Sunday morning here Stan and I'm just waiting for Aussie boxer Renold Quinlan to defend his Mickey Mouse IBO super middleweight title against Chris Eubank, Jr. Eubank is a raging hot favorite and Renold has received zero respect from the British media. A breakfast beer sounds good. I hope Quinlan sticks to all his critics.

Call Gerald Posner a plagiarist and everyone applauds. Make the same call against a CTer and you are just being an egotist. 

http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?/topic/22081-why-does-dvp-rattle-cages-here/&page=15
http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?/topic/22125-plagiarism-and-the-kennedy-assassination/&page

_________________
Mixing Pop and Politics he asks me what the use is
I offer him embarrassment and my usual excuses
While looking down the corridor
Out to where the van is waiting
I'm looking for the Great Leap Forward

            Billy Bragg
-----------------------------
 Australians don't mind criminals: It's successful bullshit artists we despise. 
             Lachie Hulme            
-----------------------------
The Cold War ran on bullshit.
              Me

“God favors drunks, small children, and the cataclysmically stoned...” Steve King
"The worst thing about some men is that when they are not drunk they are sober." Billy Yeats
"You're not drunk if you can lie on the floor without holding on." Dino Martin



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Re: reinventing the wheel

Post by greg parker on Sun 05 Feb 2017, 11:14 am

Sunday morning here Stan and I'm just waiting for Aussie boxer Renold Quinlan to defend his Mickey Mouse IBO super middleweight title against Chris Eubank, Jr. Eubank is a raging hot favorite and Renold has received zero respect from the British media. A breakfast beer sounds good. I hope Quinlan sticks to all his critics.
Ref stopped it in the 10th for Eubank, but Quinlan did defy the critics, most of whom claimed he wouldn't make it past 3 rounds. He not only made it past that, he won the first round but from then on, took punches that would have put Graziano's lights out and never even hit the deck once. 

This was only his 12th or 13th career fight, and  I think what he showed will lead to more opportunities. He would have learned a lot from it.

_________________
Mixing Pop and Politics he asks me what the use is
I offer him embarrassment and my usual excuses
While looking down the corridor
Out to where the van is waiting
I'm looking for the Great Leap Forward

            Billy Bragg
-----------------------------
 Australians don't mind criminals: It's successful bullshit artists we despise. 
             Lachie Hulme            
-----------------------------
The Cold War ran on bullshit.
              Me

“God favors drunks, small children, and the cataclysmically stoned...” Steve King
"The worst thing about some men is that when they are not drunk they are sober." Billy Yeats
"You're not drunk if you can lie on the floor without holding on." Dino Martin



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Re: reinventing the wheel

Post by greg parker on Sun 05 Feb 2017, 12:25 pm

The Fez, about 6 hours ago at the Ed Forum

I've been posting that the Baker/Truly/Oswald 2nd floor lunchroom scene never happened for many years.


I will be back with the results of my search for evidence of this.

_________________
Mixing Pop and Politics he asks me what the use is
I offer him embarrassment and my usual excuses
While looking down the corridor
Out to where the van is waiting
I'm looking for the Great Leap Forward

            Billy Bragg
-----------------------------
 Australians don't mind criminals: It's successful bullshit artists we despise. 
             Lachie Hulme            
-----------------------------
The Cold War ran on bullshit.
              Me

“God favors drunks, small children, and the cataclysmically stoned...” Steve King
"The worst thing about some men is that when they are not drunk they are sober." Billy Yeats
"You're not drunk if you can lie on the floor without holding on." Dino Martin



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Re: reinventing the wheel

Post by Jake Sykes on Sun 05 Feb 2017, 1:08 pm

Greg, JFK community ingrates do not obviate the truth and the truth is Sean Murphy credits you for your WORK. That is credit nobody else gets nor will they ever.  Others may have "questioned" the 2FE, but you, Sean, and others at ROKC are the driving forces behind advancing these CRITICAL issues. Know that it is true and, by the way, thanks for letting me ride along. I'm way above my pay grade here, so thanks. It is something of an honor.
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Re: reinventing the wheel

Post by steely dan on Sun 05 Feb 2017, 1:38 pm

Larry Tosspot wants us do drop everything and identify a hag in a scarf.
Brian is a full on maniac.
Billy Ray Mullet is a man with a dodgy haircut.
Dame Barbara Trejo is...........Dame Barbara Trejo.
The Fez is just a late arrival to the fucking nuthouse.
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Re: reinventing the wheel

Post by Stan Dane on Sun 05 Feb 2017, 1:54 pm

steely dan wrote:Larry Tosspot wants us do drop everything and identify a hag in a scarf.
Brian is a full on maniac.
Billy Ray Mullet is a man with a dodgy haircut.
Dame Barbara Trejo is...........Dame Barbara Trejo.
The Fez is just a late arrival to the fucking nuthouse.
Careful steely. I've been on the wagon six days and here you are tempting me with five great meme possibilities.  Very Happy

PS: I usually don't last more than a week.


Last edited by Stan Dane on Sun 05 Feb 2017, 1:57 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : I can't type for shit)
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Re: reinventing the wheel

Post by greg parker on Sun 05 Feb 2017, 1:54 pm

greg parker wrote:The Fez, about 6 hours ago at the Ed Forum

I've been posting that the Baker/Truly/Oswald 2nd floor lunchroom scene never happened for many years.


I will be back with the results of my search for evidence of this.
He seems to have gotten on board in 2012 with threads started by Sean and myself. 

http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?/topic/19425-was-oswald-stopped-by-sawyer-near-the-tsbd-front-entrance/#comment-258780

http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?/topic/18048-the-evolution-of-the-2nd-floor-lunchroom-story/#comment-258775

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Mixing Pop and Politics he asks me what the use is
I offer him embarrassment and my usual excuses
While looking down the corridor
Out to where the van is waiting
I'm looking for the Great Leap Forward

            Billy Bragg
-----------------------------
 Australians don't mind criminals: It's successful bullshit artists we despise. 
             Lachie Hulme            
-----------------------------
The Cold War ran on bullshit.
              Me

“God favors drunks, small children, and the cataclysmically stoned...” Steve King
"The worst thing about some men is that when they are not drunk they are sober." Billy Yeats
"You're not drunk if you can lie on the floor without holding on." Dino Martin



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Re: reinventing the wheel

Post by Stan Dane on Sun 05 Feb 2017, 1:55 pm

greg parker wrote:
greg parker wrote:The Fez, about 6 hours ago at the Ed Forum

I've been posting that the Baker/Truly/Oswald 2nd floor lunchroom scene never happened for many years.


I will be back with the results of my search for evidence of this.
He seems to have gotten on board in 2012 with threads started by Sean and myself. 

http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?/topic/19425-was-oswald-stopped-by-sawyer-near-the-tsbd-front-entrance/#comment-258780

http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?/topic/18048-the-evolution-of-the-2nd-floor-lunchroom-story/#comment-258775
I'd make a "Me Too" fez meme right now but I'm too lazy.
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Re: reinventing the wheel

Post by greg parker on Sun 05 Feb 2017, 2:14 pm

Jake Sykes wrote:Greg, JFK community ingrates do not obviate the truth and the truth is Sean Murphy credits you for your WORK. That is credit nobody else gets nor will they ever.  Others may have "questioned" the 2FE, but you, Sean, and others at ROKC are the driving forces behind advancing these CRITICAL issues. Know that it is true and, by the way, thanks for letting me ride along. I'm way above my pay grade here, so thanks. It is something of an honor.
Jake, I'm aware that the more I bring the issue up, the more it looks like ego. I just get the shits when I see people saying things like "oh yeah, I knew it was bullshit. I've been saying so for years."  It's their own egos that drive them to stretch that truth. I mean, in some cases, it's true and it's not true. It's true in the sense that they questioned the timing aspects - but in the end, none of 'em questioned that a 2nd floor encounter happened.

I don't mind people taking my work and using it. Some of that has happened without attribution, which sucks, but not because I want the attribution, but because it is not the proper way to produce a serious work. 
 
A poster named Don Willis who was I think the first person I ever engaged with about this, used to copyright his posts. To be fair, Don probably came to the same conclusion I did, indendant of me. Here's one of his posts from 2003 showing the copyright. The exchange also shows how my own thinking has flipped-flopped over the years. 
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.assassination.jfk/20CvyyQwi3g

_________________
Mixing Pop and Politics he asks me what the use is
I offer him embarrassment and my usual excuses
While looking down the corridor
Out to where the van is waiting
I'm looking for the Great Leap Forward

            Billy Bragg
-----------------------------
 Australians don't mind criminals: It's successful bullshit artists we despise. 
             Lachie Hulme            
-----------------------------
The Cold War ran on bullshit.
              Me

“God favors drunks, small children, and the cataclysmically stoned...” Steve King
"The worst thing about some men is that when they are not drunk they are sober." Billy Yeats
"You're not drunk if you can lie on the floor without holding on." Dino Martin



https://www.thenewdisease.space
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Re: reinventing the wheel

Post by Ed. Ledoux on Sun 05 Feb 2017, 2:18 pm

Problem is Fez's theory involves a Harvey.

Was he ever really "on board" ?
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Re: reinventing the wheel

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