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StanDane- Posts : 3645
Join date : 2013-09-03
Age : 71 
Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part A
Thu 11 Aug 2016, 6:23 pm
First topic message reminder :
This is full rebuild of the hugely popular thread created by Mick Purdy at the Webs forum in February 2015. – Stan
Mick Purdy
I believe Buell Wesley Frazier lied about seeing Lee Oswald with a package, a package two feet long on the morning of Friday November 22nd 1963.
I believe Linnie Mae Randle lied about seeing Oswald with a package, a package 27 inches long on the Morning of 22nd Nov 1963.
I believe both Linnie Mae Randle and Buell Wesley Frazier fabricated the curtain rod story.
I think there is ample evidence in their WC testimonies, affidavits and FBI interviews to support each of these contentions.
I have also come to the conclusion (after having a closer look at the testimonies and the various reports), that Buell Wesley Frazier lied about another crucially important matter that day. In my opinion the totality of the evidence suggests Frazier lied with regards to driving Lee Harvey Oswald to work that fateful morning.
Take a moment to reflect upon the importance of that drive to the case against Oswald before reading on.
The story was very likely fabricated not merely to have Oswald appear to carry a sack into work – but also to create the illusion of Oswald carrying a rifle. This conclusion is drawn from a study of the WC testimonies of both Randle and Frazier regarding Oswald, the package and his alleged arrival at the Randle residence that morning. Ten or more neighbours considered to be best placed to spot pedestrian movement in the vicinity were interviewed by the FBI as to whether they saw Oswald carrying a package from the Paine’s home to the Randle home. To a person, they stated they had not seen Oswald that morning – with or without any suspicious package which the police on more than one occasion, described as being similar in size and shape to a rifle case.
Frazier’s WC and Shaw trial testimony regarding the journey into work with Oswald appears rehearsed. Any questions relating to the “sack” or what was said in the car on the way in is met with what sounds very much like scripted answers that have become Frazier’s Lore. The sack, the curtain rods, the weather, and my favourite, Oswald’s kids, are IMO all part of the charade. Away from the small talk and banter about kids, he constantly flip flopped on testimony in a manner redolent with patterns of deceit.
Frazier’s WC testimony with regard to his arrival at work is at complete odds with the HSCA interview of Edward Shields. Though it could be argued Shields, unlike Frazier, was not under oath, and therefore is a witness of lesser value, the fact is that Shields was as close as you can get to a disinterested party merely reporting for the first what he had heard. Sadly, it took well over a decade for him to receive any relevant questions. In any event, it is highly unlikely he ever realized the import of his information.
From the HSCA interview of Shields
To summarize what we have so far… no one claimed to see Lee Harvey Oswald walk to the Frazier residence that morning. No one claimed to see Lee Harvey Oswald in Frazier’s car that morning – except Frazier himself. No one saw Lee Harvey Oswald that morning with any package except Wes and Linnie Mae.
Frazier also testified that he let Oswald get well ahead on the walk from the car park to the loading dock entrance. But in the form of Edward Shields, we have a potential reason for Frazier to construct that story.
In the above two short paragraphs alone, we have three “firsts” – firsts that are needed for the official story to hold. Oswald had never walked to the Randle residence for his lift before. He was always picked up at the Paine house. Oswald had never taken a long package to work before. Oswald had never neglected to take a packed lunch before. Oswald had never even needed a lift on a Friday morning before. Frazier had never let Oswald walk ahead of him from the car park before. They had always walked in together. That is a lot of “firsts” – all reliant on a very tight little knit of witnesses outside of which, no corroboration exists. Nobody else, not one person can verify Frazier’s version of events in Irving except for his sister. At the other end of the journey at the TSBD parking lot, we rely solely on Frazier. It beggars belief that there are no other witnesses. That walk was at least 2 and 1/2 blocks long. Shields and Givens smash his fairy-tale apart.
This “story” IMO has the same stench wafting around it, like the rest of the days fables contain.
The bus trip, the cab ride, the sack, the run, the walk, the ducking, the escape, the 2nd floor, the first floor, the sixth floor, the lunch bag, the rifle case, the back seat, the front seat, the white jacket the grey jacket, the gun, the revolver ……………
An alternative scenario
Postal Inspectors interviewed Mr and Mrs CP Schneider at 2707 West Fifth St in the early evening of November 22. Mr Schneider confirmed he had seen Lee Oswald in front of the 2515 residence at approximately 6:00pm of the previous evening. He also stated that a neighbour, Mrs Ed Roberts of 2519 West Fifth St had told him that Willie Randle, 2439 West Fifth St, had driven Oswald to work on the morning of November 22, and that Oswald was carrying a package large enough to have contained a rifle. (CD 296)
What sort of investigation is it that receives hearsay evidence such as the above and fails to follow up to confirm or refute it with the parties involved? WE are indeed, expected to believe that no follow up was done, because there is no evidence any follow up was done. Yet, there is actually circumstantial evidence that the authorities did believe that Randle was the man who gave the lift because that same night, the FBI was attempting to trace the origins of the scope in the names of Lee Oswald OR Willie Randall [sic]. (CD 87) It is virtually impossible to believe that the FBI would act on hearsay alone, when a few houses from where the hearsay was received, lived the person who had passed on that hearsay. You would almost have to believe that this “Willie Randle” lead was followed up and that it checked out given the ease with which such a lead could be checked out. To further complicate matters, the DPD already had Oswald’s alleged driver in custody. If Frazier truly was the driver, there would no reason at all to be checking on “Willy Randle/Randall” as a co-conspirator!
Randle had arrived in Austin at about 7:00pm on what was said to be work-related business in company with co-worker named Berry Caster. (FBI 105-82555 Oswald HQ File, Section 32, p44) It is between a 3 and 4 hour drive from Irving to Austin, so it is far from impossible that “Willie” drove Lee to work that morning on the basis that Frazier had already left.
Because of the holes in the official investigation, some conjecture is needed if we are to try understand the mess we have been left. What follows is some of my conjecture.
Frazier left that morning on his own – with the throwdown M-C rifle. The call from Givens of “where’s your rider?” was code giving Frazier the all clear to bring “the package” in, or was code for simply it’s clear to come inside.
Since Lee had missed his ride, Willie Randle offered to give him one, but needed to borrow Ruth’s car since his own was full of work gear for the trip to Austin later on. This leads to Oswald’s statement in front of Roger Craig concerning Craig’s description of a certain station wagon that "That station wagon belongs to Mrs. Paine. Don't try to tie her into this. She had nothing to do with it."
Doesn’t that sound like someone talking about a car that was being driven by someone else?
I’d like to thank Greg Parker for his enormous support and encouragement.
This is full rebuild of the hugely popular thread created by Mick Purdy at the Webs forum in February 2015. – Stan
Mick Purdy
I believe Buell Wesley Frazier lied about seeing Lee Oswald with a package, a package two feet long on the morning of Friday November 22nd 1963.
I believe Linnie Mae Randle lied about seeing Oswald with a package, a package 27 inches long on the Morning of 22nd Nov 1963.
I believe both Linnie Mae Randle and Buell Wesley Frazier fabricated the curtain rod story.
I think there is ample evidence in their WC testimonies, affidavits and FBI interviews to support each of these contentions.
I have also come to the conclusion (after having a closer look at the testimonies and the various reports), that Buell Wesley Frazier lied about another crucially important matter that day. In my opinion the totality of the evidence suggests Frazier lied with regards to driving Lee Harvey Oswald to work that fateful morning.
Take a moment to reflect upon the importance of that drive to the case against Oswald before reading on.
The story was very likely fabricated not merely to have Oswald appear to carry a sack into work – but also to create the illusion of Oswald carrying a rifle. This conclusion is drawn from a study of the WC testimonies of both Randle and Frazier regarding Oswald, the package and his alleged arrival at the Randle residence that morning. Ten or more neighbours considered to be best placed to spot pedestrian movement in the vicinity were interviewed by the FBI as to whether they saw Oswald carrying a package from the Paine’s home to the Randle home. To a person, they stated they had not seen Oswald that morning – with or without any suspicious package which the police on more than one occasion, described as being similar in size and shape to a rifle case.
Frazier’s WC and Shaw trial testimony regarding the journey into work with Oswald appears rehearsed. Any questions relating to the “sack” or what was said in the car on the way in is met with what sounds very much like scripted answers that have become Frazier’s Lore. The sack, the curtain rods, the weather, and my favourite, Oswald’s kids, are IMO all part of the charade. Away from the small talk and banter about kids, he constantly flip flopped on testimony in a manner redolent with patterns of deceit.
Frazier’s WC testimony with regard to his arrival at work is at complete odds with the HSCA interview of Edward Shields. Though it could be argued Shields, unlike Frazier, was not under oath, and therefore is a witness of lesser value, the fact is that Shields was as close as you can get to a disinterested party merely reporting for the first what he had heard. Sadly, it took well over a decade for him to receive any relevant questions. In any event, it is highly unlikely he ever realized the import of his information.
From the HSCA interview of Shields
SHIELDS: I think Charles Givens hollered out there and asked Frazier where was his rider and he told him: "I dropped him off at the building." Yeah, that was it...Well, I was down on the floor when they hollered out and said and the answer he gave them, I don't know, I think he said: "I dropped him off at the building." Now, whoever it was hollering asked him, I don't know.
DAY: This is the morning of the assassination?
SHIELDS: Mm-hmm.
DAY: Somebody hollered out the window and say: "Where is your rider?" And to your recollection, Frazier says, "I dropped him off at the building."
SHIELDS: Yes.
DAY: Alright. The day of the assassination, did you see Oswald come to work with Frazier?
SHIELDS: No I didn’t.
To summarize what we have so far… no one claimed to see Lee Harvey Oswald walk to the Frazier residence that morning. No one claimed to see Lee Harvey Oswald in Frazier’s car that morning – except Frazier himself. No one saw Lee Harvey Oswald that morning with any package except Wes and Linnie Mae.
Frazier also testified that he let Oswald get well ahead on the walk from the car park to the loading dock entrance. But in the form of Edward Shields, we have a potential reason for Frazier to construct that story.
In the above two short paragraphs alone, we have three “firsts” – firsts that are needed for the official story to hold. Oswald had never walked to the Randle residence for his lift before. He was always picked up at the Paine house. Oswald had never taken a long package to work before. Oswald had never neglected to take a packed lunch before. Oswald had never even needed a lift on a Friday morning before. Frazier had never let Oswald walk ahead of him from the car park before. They had always walked in together. That is a lot of “firsts” – all reliant on a very tight little knit of witnesses outside of which, no corroboration exists. Nobody else, not one person can verify Frazier’s version of events in Irving except for his sister. At the other end of the journey at the TSBD parking lot, we rely solely on Frazier. It beggars belief that there are no other witnesses. That walk was at least 2 and 1/2 blocks long. Shields and Givens smash his fairy-tale apart.
This “story” IMO has the same stench wafting around it, like the rest of the days fables contain.
The bus trip, the cab ride, the sack, the run, the walk, the ducking, the escape, the 2nd floor, the first floor, the sixth floor, the lunch bag, the rifle case, the back seat, the front seat, the white jacket the grey jacket, the gun, the revolver ……………
An alternative scenario
Postal Inspectors interviewed Mr and Mrs CP Schneider at 2707 West Fifth St in the early evening of November 22. Mr Schneider confirmed he had seen Lee Oswald in front of the 2515 residence at approximately 6:00pm of the previous evening. He also stated that a neighbour, Mrs Ed Roberts of 2519 West Fifth St had told him that Willie Randle, 2439 West Fifth St, had driven Oswald to work on the morning of November 22, and that Oswald was carrying a package large enough to have contained a rifle. (CD 296)
What sort of investigation is it that receives hearsay evidence such as the above and fails to follow up to confirm or refute it with the parties involved? WE are indeed, expected to believe that no follow up was done, because there is no evidence any follow up was done. Yet, there is actually circumstantial evidence that the authorities did believe that Randle was the man who gave the lift because that same night, the FBI was attempting to trace the origins of the scope in the names of Lee Oswald OR Willie Randall [sic]. (CD 87) It is virtually impossible to believe that the FBI would act on hearsay alone, when a few houses from where the hearsay was received, lived the person who had passed on that hearsay. You would almost have to believe that this “Willie Randle” lead was followed up and that it checked out given the ease with which such a lead could be checked out. To further complicate matters, the DPD already had Oswald’s alleged driver in custody. If Frazier truly was the driver, there would no reason at all to be checking on “Willy Randle/Randall” as a co-conspirator!
Randle had arrived in Austin at about 7:00pm on what was said to be work-related business in company with co-worker named Berry Caster. (FBI 105-82555 Oswald HQ File, Section 32, p44) It is between a 3 and 4 hour drive from Irving to Austin, so it is far from impossible that “Willie” drove Lee to work that morning on the basis that Frazier had already left.
Because of the holes in the official investigation, some conjecture is needed if we are to try understand the mess we have been left. What follows is some of my conjecture.
Frazier left that morning on his own – with the throwdown M-C rifle. The call from Givens of “where’s your rider?” was code giving Frazier the all clear to bring “the package” in, or was code for simply it’s clear to come inside.
Since Lee had missed his ride, Willie Randle offered to give him one, but needed to borrow Ruth’s car since his own was full of work gear for the trip to Austin later on. This leads to Oswald’s statement in front of Roger Craig concerning Craig’s description of a certain station wagon that "That station wagon belongs to Mrs. Paine. Don't try to tie her into this. She had nothing to do with it."
Doesn’t that sound like someone talking about a car that was being driven by someone else?
I’d like to thank Greg Parker for his enormous support and encouragement.
- StanDane
- Posts : 3645
Join date : 2013-09-03
Age : 71
Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part A
Sat 20 Aug 2016, 4:26 am
Steely Dan
Ruth phones the police and drops the dime on where Lee is......"We've been expecting you"
Ruth phones the police and drops the dime on where Lee is......"We've been expecting you"
- StanDane
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part A
Sat 20 Aug 2016, 4:26 am
Greg Parker
IIRC Wes was not listed on Revills list. If he was in the basement, he couldn't leave without being pulled up by the cops. On that basis, he may well have been out on that dock.
IIRC Wes was not listed on Revills list. If he was in the basement, he couldn't leave without being pulled up by the cops. On that basis, he may well have been out on that dock.
- StanDane
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part A
Sat 20 Aug 2016, 4:27 am
Hasan Yusuf
And now there seems to be some confusion about how Lee got to the theater. Not the bus - taxi - Beckley scenario but the ride with either Craig's dark-complected driver or in Frazier's sedan. I thought this had been addressed earlier (and I think Craig witnessed Crafard or someone else ??) but I cannot locate it.
Terry,
This is something which I addressed in my essay on Larry Crafard. I believe it was Crafard whom Craig witnessed getting into the rambler station wagon, with Lawrence Howard behind the wheel.
And now there seems to be some confusion about how Lee got to the theater. Not the bus - taxi - Beckley scenario but the ride with either Craig's dark-complected driver or in Frazier's sedan. I thought this had been addressed earlier (and I think Craig witnessed Crafard or someone else ??) but I cannot locate it.
Terry,
This is something which I addressed in my essay on Larry Crafard. I believe it was Crafard whom Craig witnessed getting into the rambler station wagon, with Lawrence Howard behind the wheel.
- StanDane
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part A
Sat 20 Aug 2016, 4:28 am
Ed Ledoux
Larry and Lawrence....
Two Larry's!
The duos never cease
Larry and Lawrence....
Two Larry's!
The duos never cease
- StanDane
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part A
Sat 20 Aug 2016, 4:29 am
Stan Dane wrote:Ed Ledoux
Larry and Lawrence....
Two Larry's!
The duos never cease
Hasan Yusuf
LOL Except in this case, the duos looked nothing alike.
- StanDane
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part A
Sat 20 Aug 2016, 4:30 am
Stan Dane wrote:Hasan Yusuf
And now there seems to be some confusion about how Lee got to the theater. Not the bus - taxi - Beckley scenario but the ride with either Craig's dark-complected driver or in Frazier's sedan. I thought this had been addressed earlier (and I think Craig witnessed Crafard or someone else ??) but I cannot locate it.
Terry,
This is something which I addressed in my essay on Larry Crafard. I believe it was Crafard whom Craig witnessed getting into the rambler station wagon, with Lawrence Howard behind the wheel.
Terry Martin
Thanks for the memory job, Hasan.
I knew I had seen it somewhere.
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part A
Sat 20 Aug 2016, 4:32 am
Mick Purdy
You guys are absolutely brilliant.
Steely great work mate, if we keep scratching, I'm convinced we will arrive at the conclusion of Frazier driving Lee to the TT. And if by chance their was a camera involved it was in Wes's car and handed back to Ruth.
I had read Hasan's piece on Crafard so that all ties in nicely. I can't yet put my finger on it but I'm convinced more than ever Wes took Lee to the theatre.
A little more digging is required, with regards to Postal, Burroughs and whomever else was witness to the theatre fiasco.
You guys are absolutely brilliant.
Steely great work mate, if we keep scratching, I'm convinced we will arrive at the conclusion of Frazier driving Lee to the TT. And if by chance their was a camera involved it was in Wes's car and handed back to Ruth.
I had read Hasan's piece on Crafard so that all ties in nicely. I can't yet put my finger on it but I'm convinced more than ever Wes took Lee to the theatre.
A little more digging is required, with regards to Postal, Burroughs and whomever else was witness to the theatre fiasco.
- StanDane
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part A
Sat 20 Aug 2016, 4:32 am
Stan Dane wrote:Greg Parker
IIRC Wes was not listed on Revills list. If he was in the basement, he couldn't leave without being pulled up by the cops. On that basis, he may well have been out on that dock.
Mick Purdy
Absolutely 100% agreed, Greg.
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part A
Sat 20 Aug 2016, 4:34 am
Stan Dane wrote:Stan Dane wrote:Terry Martin
Two ticket stubs become one bus transfer. Brilliant, Steely!
Now if we can only apply this sort of logic to the remainder of the case, we mind be able to remove those other items that "seem" to come in pairs... doppelgangers and all.
And now there seems to be some confusion about how Lee got to the theater. Not the bus - taxi - Beckley scenario but the ride with either Craig's dark-complected driver or in Frazier's sedan. I thought this had been addressed earlier (and I think Craig witnessed Crafard or someone else ??) but I cannot locate it.
Since it would appear that Oswald left the rear of the TSBD, he probably continued that same direction... to Frazier's car. Buell taking him to the theater seems to make more sense IMO.
Ed Ledoux
Excellent! Yes good show Steely!
The theater tickets would of course have to vanish.
Can't have any evidence contradicting Brewer.
Lee exits rear of TSBD goes and waits for BWF by the car.
Or Lee exits rear of TSBD, Wes was outside on the dock etc watching the action in the train track area, and he was not in the fucking basement, alone.
He only says he went to the basement so he wouldn't have to say where he really was, driving Lee to Oak Cliff and the TT.
BWF drops off Lee. Lee was going to meet up with Marina and Ruth at the shoe store after work so he goes in to the movie to kill time.
Perhaps he phoned and spoke to Ruth. Ruth phones the police and drops the dime on where Lee is.
IDK.
Cops break up the movie show, Wes slips out or wasn't in the TT yet when its raided.
Does BWF go back to the TSBD where he winds up on the second page of the roll call list, not on the page with the other warehousemen.
What ID did BWF show? A Huntsville addressed drivers license?
Speculation, yes, but possibilities need explored.
Mick Purdy
Terry: I think so too, to my mind it always has. Every other theory of how he got to the TT (disregarding the WC version of course) seems to rely on others knowing where he was exactly, and at what time. We don't seem to have anything by way of evidence that Lee had arranged transport or someone else had done this for him to get to the theatre...... It makes a whole lot of sense that Wes, offered that lift and suggested the movies for the afternoon.
Ed: I think this makes sense and sometimes that's important, it actually makes the most sense almost logical.
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part A
Sat 20 Aug 2016, 4:35 am
Stan Dane wrote:Stan Dane
As well as Oswald leaving his Imperial Reflex in the back seat of Buell's Chevy.
Mick Purdy
Agreed.
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part A
Sat 20 Aug 2016, 4:40 am
Steely Dan
Why did Lee go to the Paine's on Thursday night?. Was he staying there all along?....Did he go back to get a camera?.....Did he go back to raid Ruth's fridge for a bottle of pop (sorry Barto)...we can rule out curtain rods and rifles so there is a reason we have to figure out.
Why did Lee go to the Paine's on Thursday night?. Was he staying there all along?....Did he go back to get a camera?.....Did he go back to raid Ruth's fridge for a bottle of pop (sorry Barto)...we can rule out curtain rods and rifles so there is a reason we have to figure out.
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part A
Sat 20 Aug 2016, 4:40 am
Terry Martin
Yes, Steely - at least I believe he was staying there all along since he didn't live at Beckley and no other address makes since. After all, his wife had just recently given birth to daughter number two.
And if he was planning on meeting his wife and Ruth at the shoe store next to the theater after he and Wes finished with the movie, perhaps there WAS more in his constant refrain of getting new shoes for Baby Junie.
Yes, Steely - at least I believe he was staying there all along since he didn't live at Beckley and no other address makes since. After all, his wife had just recently given birth to daughter number two.
And if he was planning on meeting his wife and Ruth at the shoe store next to the theater after he and Wes finished with the movie, perhaps there WAS more in his constant refrain of getting new shoes for Baby Junie.
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part A
Sat 20 Aug 2016, 4:41 am
Paul Francisco Paso
If Frazier drove Oswald to the TT then he is in a lot more shit than I first imagined. Not only did he supposedly drive Oswald and the rifle to the TSBD, watch the motorcade with Oswald when the shots were fired and also dropped him off at the TT where he was swarmed by cops. This is a lot to take in. I may need some time to think this over. If true Frazier is in up to his neck with this whether he is part of the plan or not. I must admit I believe Roger Craig on this matter and I also believe Oswald went to the TT to meet up with someone.
If Frazier drove Oswald to the TT then he is in a lot more shit than I first imagined. Not only did he supposedly drive Oswald and the rifle to the TSBD, watch the motorcade with Oswald when the shots were fired and also dropped him off at the TT where he was swarmed by cops. This is a lot to take in. I may need some time to think this over. If true Frazier is in up to his neck with this whether he is part of the plan or not. I must admit I believe Roger Craig on this matter and I also believe Oswald went to the TT to meet up with someone.
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part A
Sat 20 Aug 2016, 4:42 am
Ed Ledoux
Enjoying your comments across the the various threads Paul.
Mick has shown Wes to be wishy-washy with the facts, or intentionally misrepresenting them. The TT list would be disappeared due to Wes's name, or the 'contacts' name being on it is a possibility. Wes with the recent revelation of an angry Fritz trying to get him to sign a confession as if by afterthought only adds fuel to the fire that Wes is stretching the truth or using poetic license to keep him as a hot commodity for public appearances.
Enjoying your comments across the the various threads Paul.
Mick has shown Wes to be wishy-washy with the facts, or intentionally misrepresenting them. The TT list would be disappeared due to Wes's name, or the 'contacts' name being on it is a possibility. Wes with the recent revelation of an angry Fritz trying to get him to sign a confession as if by afterthought only adds fuel to the fire that Wes is stretching the truth or using poetic license to keep him as a hot commodity for public appearances.
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part A
Sat 20 Aug 2016, 4:43 am
Stan Dane wrote:Ed Ledoux
Enjoying your comments across the the various threads Paul.
Mick has shown Wes to be wishy-washy with the facts, or intentionally misrepresenting them. The TT list would be disappeared due to Wes's name, or the 'contacts' name being on it is a possibility. Wes with the recent revelation of an angry Fritz trying to get him to sign a confession as if by afterthought only adds fuel to the fire that Wes is stretching the truth or using poetic license to keep him as a hot commodity for public appearances.
Paul Francisco Paso
Thanks Ed. I always enjoy your stuff. I see what you mean. Frazier is talking shit. So much shit that its hard to keep up. I hope one day he slips up real bad during one of his public appearances. The Craig story for me has always rung true. I don't believe Craig would make up such a specific lie. What he told us about Oswald was a very detailed account. I believe Oswald was picked up and taken to the theatre to meet with someone. That someone may also be on the list of patrons, that disappeared.
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part A
Sat 20 Aug 2016, 8:21 am
Ed Ledoux
Great choice of words!
"...Craig would make up such a specific lie"
Right on!
Unspecific lies would be easily dismissed, where as Craig's statements have continued to be shown as more factual than the fantasy the WC and Sheriffs dept would have us believe.
Great choice of words!
"...Craig would make up such a specific lie"
Right on!
Unspecific lies would be easily dismissed, where as Craig's statements have continued to be shown as more factual than the fantasy the WC and Sheriffs dept would have us believe.
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part A
Sat 20 Aug 2016, 8:23 am
RevPink89
I think it is Field of Dreams time. I say, ease his pain.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yDygWU6kink
I think this clip shows that BWF is getting ready to get something off his chest here in his later years. In the interests of reopenning the case, I think he needs to be embraced, understood and taken into the fold.
Get him a book deal, total immunity and whatever else he needs. Forgive him and although he may not ever tell the whole story, he could clear up a lot of issues. I still don't think he woke up one day and decided to destroy a man's life for shits and giggles. I say help him.
I think it is possible that BWF drove LHO to the TT. I tend to think it was someone else, ala Craig, but not a huge issue for me. My question is, why go to the TT at all?
Let's assume that LHO is PM. (Great work on that here at ROKC, unbelievable stuff! Top Notch!) Is there anyone in TSBD more politically wired than LHO? OK, maybe he never knew Danny Ferry, Guy Bannister, ETC>,,,Maybe, Jim Garrison's research in NO was over-cooked. Maybe there isn't a direct connection between NO and Dallas. But, what there is is a young ex-marine who moved to Russia and returned to the US and passed out pro-Cuba flyers in the summer heat, says he is a Marxist on TV, goes on a radio program to promote his Political views etc...Then right before his eyes as he stands/leans on the porch of the TSBD, camera in hand, this young ex-marine hears boom boom and however many booms and the President of the United States is assassinated before his very eyes and this young man who is ensconced in political theory, whose life is one long political rigmarole, suddenly says, "Wow, well I got 30 minutes to go catch a flick at the TT, better hustle!"???
If BWF drove LHO to the TT, I think there is quite a bit more to their relationship going both ways.
I think it is Field of Dreams time. I say, ease his pain.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yDygWU6kink
I think this clip shows that BWF is getting ready to get something off his chest here in his later years. In the interests of reopenning the case, I think he needs to be embraced, understood and taken into the fold.
Get him a book deal, total immunity and whatever else he needs. Forgive him and although he may not ever tell the whole story, he could clear up a lot of issues. I still don't think he woke up one day and decided to destroy a man's life for shits and giggles. I say help him.
I think it is possible that BWF drove LHO to the TT. I tend to think it was someone else, ala Craig, but not a huge issue for me. My question is, why go to the TT at all?
Let's assume that LHO is PM. (Great work on that here at ROKC, unbelievable stuff! Top Notch!) Is there anyone in TSBD more politically wired than LHO? OK, maybe he never knew Danny Ferry, Guy Bannister, ETC>,,,Maybe, Jim Garrison's research in NO was over-cooked. Maybe there isn't a direct connection between NO and Dallas. But, what there is is a young ex-marine who moved to Russia and returned to the US and passed out pro-Cuba flyers in the summer heat, says he is a Marxist on TV, goes on a radio program to promote his Political views etc...Then right before his eyes as he stands/leans on the porch of the TSBD, camera in hand, this young ex-marine hears boom boom and however many booms and the President of the United States is assassinated before his very eyes and this young man who is ensconced in political theory, whose life is one long political rigmarole, suddenly says, "Wow, well I got 30 minutes to go catch a flick at the TT, better hustle!"???
If BWF drove LHO to the TT, I think there is quite a bit more to their relationship going both ways.
- StanDane
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part A
Sat 20 Aug 2016, 8:27 am
Ed Ledoux
We need to get to him first. And he has watchers and handlers to deal with. FFS even Gale won't ask the hard freaking questions so we can get a dialogue going. Everyone allows him too much room.
We need to get to him first. And he has watchers and handlers to deal with. FFS even Gale won't ask the hard freaking questions so we can get a dialogue going. Everyone allows him too much room.
- StanDane
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part A
Sat 20 Aug 2016, 8:28 am
Stan Dane wrote:RevPink89
I think it is Field of Dreams time. I say, ease his pain.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yDygWU6kink
I think this clip shows that BWF is getting ready to get something off his chest here in his later years. In the interests of reopenning the case, I think he needs to be embraced, understood and taken into the fold.
Get him a book deal, total immunity and whatever else he needs. Forgive him and although he may not ever tell the whole story, he could clear up a lot of issues. I still don't think he woke up one day and decided to destroy a man's life for shits and giggles. I say help him.
I think it is possible that BWF drove LHO to the TT. I tend to think it was someone else, ala Craig, but not a huge issue for me. My question is, why go to the TT at all?
Let's assume that LHO is PM. (Great work on that here at ROKC, unbelievable stuff! Top Notch!) Is there anyone in TSBD more politically wired than LHO? OK, maybe he never knew Danny Ferry, Guy Bannister, ETC>,,,Maybe, Jim Garrison's research in NO was over-cooked. Maybe there isn't a direct connection between NO and Dallas. But, what there is is a young ex-marine who moved to Russia and returned to the US and passed out pro-Cuba flyers in the summer heat, says he is a Marxist on TV, goes on a radio program to promote his Political views etc...Then right before his eyes as he stands/leans on the porch of the TSBD, camera in hand, this young ex-marine hears boom boom and however many booms and the President of the United States is assassinated before his very eyes and this young man who is ensconced in political theory, whose life is one long political rigmarole, suddenly says, "Wow, well I got 30 minutes to go catch a flick at the TT, better hustle!"???
If BWF drove LHO to the TT, I think there is quite a bit more to their relationship going both ways.
Terry Martin
As for WHY he went to the TT, I believe Lee or Greg (or someone else) mentioned that Lee was concerned about getting shoes for his daughter, June - he made frequent mention of this to several people while incarcerated at DPD HQ - and could very well have been going to meet Ruth and Marina at the shoe store adjacent to the TT.
He had a couple of hours to kill and probably wanted to digest what he had witnessed. I don't know about others but I will occasionally do something like watch a film while I ponder deep questions.
Anyway, that's a possible reason they went to the TT.
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part A
Sat 20 Aug 2016, 8:31 am
Stan Dane wrote:Ed Ledoux
We need to get to him first. And he has watchers and handlers to deal with. FFS even Gale won't ask the hard freaking questions so we can get a dialogue going. Everyone allows him too much room.
Mick Purdy
Ed,
we do need to talk to Wes before he leaves this earth with some serious questions. I believe he has some answers too.
He should not be allowed to hide behind his version of events any longer. It's time!
I know I bang on about Wes probably way too much but I have researched him to death and his story doesn't stack up no way no how. As much as its a hard pill to swallow, I still don't believe Wes drove Lee to work that morning. But he certainly could've driven Lee to the theater.
We do need to get him on his own.
Thanks Ed for continuing to contribute to this thread I appreciate it enormously your contributions are always first class.
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part A
Sat 20 Aug 2016, 8:39 am
Ed Ledoux
Awesome Mick!
You have pushed the boundary of what was know. Much applause!!!
Perhaps we can't get to Wes directly.
He does have a weakness, I think I can exploit it.
I'll discuss privately with you.
And no its not extraordinary rendition...
Awesome Mick!
You have pushed the boundary of what was know. Much applause!!!
Perhaps we can't get to Wes directly.
He does have a weakness, I think I can exploit it.
I'll discuss privately with you.
And no its not extraordinary rendition...
- StanDane
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part A
Sat 20 Aug 2016, 8:40 am
Stan Dane
:: Stan thinking to himself ::
I'm hoping this is another Albert/Brian Doyle "project."
Hehehe.
:: Stan thinking to himself ::
I'm hoping this is another Albert/Brian Doyle "project."
Hehehe.
- StanDane
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part A
Sat 20 Aug 2016, 8:41 am
Stan Dane wrote:Stan Dane
:: Stan thinking to himself ::
I'm hoping this is another Albert/Brian Doyle "project."
Hehehe.
Shhhhhhhh- StanDane
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part A
Sat 20 Aug 2016, 8:41 am
Beowulf
"If Frazier drove Oswald to the TT then he is in a lot more shit than I first imagined. Not only did he supposedly drive Oswald and the rifle to the TSBD, watch the motorcade with Oswald when the shots were fired and also dropped him off at the TT where he was swarmed by cops. This is a lot to take in. I may need some time to think this over. If true Frazier is in up to his neck with this whether he is part of the plan or not."
No kidding, the worst part is by the time Fritz gets his hands on Frazier that night the cops already had witnesses lined up for every step of the way except for Oswald taking rifle into building. Think of how Fritz reacted to a witness disproving prior witnesses who identified (kind of) LHO as 6th floor shooter, saw him on 2nd floor as he was headed downstairs, saw him on the bus, then the cab, in his apartment, shooting Tippit and then fleeing to TT on foot. Frazier's testimony contradicts the entire case! And if he showed up with corroborating evidence (a ticket stub? Oswald's camera?)... its a miracle Fritz didn't stroke out then and there. Presumably, Frazier was given the choice of cooperate or die. Like any sane man would, he chose to play ball and amended his story so it neatly filled in the one gap left in official story (apparently Fritz didn't know that Ralph Yates was already set up to explain how the rifle got to the TSBD).
"If Frazier drove Oswald to the TT then he is in a lot more shit than I first imagined. Not only did he supposedly drive Oswald and the rifle to the TSBD, watch the motorcade with Oswald when the shots were fired and also dropped him off at the TT where he was swarmed by cops. This is a lot to take in. I may need some time to think this over. If true Frazier is in up to his neck with this whether he is part of the plan or not."
No kidding, the worst part is by the time Fritz gets his hands on Frazier that night the cops already had witnesses lined up for every step of the way except for Oswald taking rifle into building. Think of how Fritz reacted to a witness disproving prior witnesses who identified (kind of) LHO as 6th floor shooter, saw him on 2nd floor as he was headed downstairs, saw him on the bus, then the cab, in his apartment, shooting Tippit and then fleeing to TT on foot. Frazier's testimony contradicts the entire case! And if he showed up with corroborating evidence (a ticket stub? Oswald's camera?)... its a miracle Fritz didn't stroke out then and there. Presumably, Frazier was given the choice of cooperate or die. Like any sane man would, he chose to play ball and amended his story so it neatly filled in the one gap left in official story (apparently Fritz didn't know that Ralph Yates was already set up to explain how the rifle got to the TSBD).
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Re: Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part A
Sat 20 Aug 2016, 8:43 am
Mick Purdy
Paul and Stan,
Your incredible posts in the Bakers Run thread have convinced me, beyond any reasonable doubt, Wes needs to be asked questions, serious questions about his involvement in the frame of LHO. I was staring at Paul's post about Bakers run, gun drawn, pushing through the crowd, up the steps, by his own admission confronting someone at the top of the steps, with Truly just having waved him forward. Ask yourselves, how is it possible that Wes missed this, remember he can't recall this happening, but we know Lee had. Its beyond my comprehension how Frazier cannot remember a gun toting uniformed motorcycle cop pushing past him and probably yelling where are the stairs or some such immediately after the shots.......
He has to remember doesn't he??
Paul and Stan,
Your incredible posts in the Bakers Run thread have convinced me, beyond any reasonable doubt, Wes needs to be asked questions, serious questions about his involvement in the frame of LHO. I was staring at Paul's post about Bakers run, gun drawn, pushing through the crowd, up the steps, by his own admission confronting someone at the top of the steps, with Truly just having waved him forward. Ask yourselves, how is it possible that Wes missed this, remember he can't recall this happening, but we know Lee had. Its beyond my comprehension how Frazier cannot remember a gun toting uniformed motorcycle cop pushing past him and probably yelling where are the stairs or some such immediately after the shots.......
He has to remember doesn't he??
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