"Prayer Man" on the Education Forum

[ianlloyd]

First topic message reminder :

As I am not a member of the EF, I cannot post there but there is an interesting discussion going on there at the moment regarding a figure in the TSBD doorway generally referred to as "Prayer Man" due to the apparent position of his hands, seemingly clasped in front of his chest as if in prayer.
 
http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=20354
 
I recall this person being discussed somewhere many years ago and was referred to as "Prayer Man" pretty much from the outset but I cannot recall where it originated, maybe on Lancer?
 
Anyway, the reason for this post is that, upon looking closely at the various photographs and movie clips presented as part of the discussion, it struck me that his hands don't seem to move from the "prayer" position for what seems to be quite some time. Was he holding something, I wonder? If so, it seems an odd way to hold whatever it was.

[dwdunn(akaDan)]

When I first read Baker's testimony (years ago) I took it as a straightforward account from an honest police officer doing his duty. For instance, he said he thought the shots had been fired from either atop the TSBD or the adjoining building and rushed to the TSBD first. But what I read of his account of Truly's behavior gave me similar impressions to what Greg's mentioned. Basically, I had 2 large questions:

1) Truly put himself forward as the building manager (nothing as such suspicious about that, typical of such people and their sense of self-importance), but he took Baker to the elevatr and, finding it wasn't available, Truly yelled up the elevator shaft for someone to send the elevator down. It occurred to me that this could theoretically be a way of warning someone "up there."

2) It didn't take long for Baker to say (paraphrasing), "The hell with it, let's take the stairs." But as Greg's mentioned, it was Truly in the lead! Running up the stairs, facing a potential confrontation with an assassin, with a police officer behind..... that didn't make a bit of sense to me.

I could rationalize much of this as odd behavior in the heat of the moment, but it occurred to me that it could mean Truly was taking advantage of the heat of the moment, and definitely seemed to be "taking the lead" at almost every point. So I've always been suspicous of Truly ever since, for whatever that's worth.

Hey Dan, sorry to hear about your computer hard drive dying on Oct. 16th (RIP); you sure do have great luck. But at least now that you have a used but refurbished model with Windows 7, you can finally understand why so many of the wags over at the RKC Forum seemed to be operating at a phenomenal speed (it wasn't just drug use after all you see). And while you had no computer for 2 weeks, you also found your old notebook from when you were just getting started in the grand world of Conspiracy Research. Totally forgot about the notes you made while reading Roy Truly's WC testimony, for whatever it might or might not be worth:

Roy Truly    Vol III WCH


-- & what was your sister's boyfriend n 5th grade

-- workd @ NortAmerican Aviation, Arlington (14 mos, @ night, PT)

-- a membr o TSBD board o dirctrs, superintendent snce 1944

-- c. Oct 15 1963 first heard LHO name, received phone call from lady n Irving who said her name was Mrs. Paine

"words to this effect" RPaine: "Mr. Truly, you don't know who I am but I have a neighbor whose brother works for you. I don't know what his name is. But he tells his sister that you are very busy. And I am just wondering if you can use another man," or words to that effect.  p. 213

220 details/221 "a rifle of some kind"/227 why not keep going on the stairs - quicker than an elevator ride? (I find that strikingly suspicious - "Hey, we finally got an elevator!"), called up (2x) & rang bell (2x), bypassed 6th floor & went straight to 7th from 5th (Truly was coordinating the search party)
evidently Baker had reason to look on the roof; if arranged properly, elevator on 5th floor is convenient for someone's escape from the building in this scenario
230, singled out Oswald

One comment on the following page is evidently after reading Baker's WC testimony:

Baker - repeatedly references Dal-Tex building but WC don't pursue it

[greg_parkerAdmin]

forgot to underline "Truly" as in original note)

Go and stand in the corner.

I've always been suspicous of Truly ever since, for whatever that's worth.

While you're standing over there, contemplate that however suspicious you are of Truly - it isn't enough. He is the last link in the chain and it stretches way back...

[GuestGuest]

One of the two men in the film being put forward as Lovelady and Shelley, does seem to match the guy getting into the cop car with to others. And that matches the statements of the two cops who said they took Shelley and two others...

Yes -- Shelley and Lovelady are all over the place in their statements... but other evidence (such as the above) has been used to straighten it out.

greg,
Something I forgot to mention re: Shelley and the footage of him being transported to give a statement.

In this thread at the EF: educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?s=9c988a1bf9269c70c3a6468f98eab6fa&showtopic=19178

I think Mr. Lee Farley had it right at the beginning of the thread when he stated that William Shelley didn't ride in the group with Det. Brown and Senkel. Williams claimed Shelley went with Lovelady's group. I'm trying to find a statement from whoever took Lovelady down.

There is a youtube clip showing the man in the tie on the rear driver side of the auto. If Det. Brown is the gentleman getting into the passenger side front...where is Senkel? The car is driven by a uniformed patrolman not a detective.

Unless...when Senkel says in his typed statement that officer Brown said he had a vehicle and would drive me down to the station, office brown was referring to the patrol officer driving the car.

But there is another of Gerda's GIFs showing who she thinks is Brown in the basement and his statement is that he was helping move cars when Oswald was shot.

If Brown is actually the Detective that got into the passenger front in the clip showing the group leaving with Williams, then Senkel is in the rear or had to have gone in a different car.

[greg_parkerAdmin]

One of the two men in the film being put forward as Lovelady and Shelley, does seem to match the guy getting into the cop car with to others. And that matches the statements of the two cops who said they took Shelley and two others...

Yes -- Shelley and Lovelady are all over the place in their statements... but other evidence (such as the above) has been used to straighten it out.

greg,
Something I forgot to mention re: Shelley and the footage of him being transported to give a statement.

In this thread at the EF: educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?s=9c988a1bf9269c70c3a6468f98eab6fa&showtopic=19178

I think Mr. Lee Farley had it right at the beginning of the thread when he stated that William Shelley didn't ride in the group with Det. Brown and Senkel. Williams claimed Shelley went with Lovelady's group. I'm trying to find a statement from whoever took Lovelady down.

There is a youtube clip showing the man in the tie on the rear driver side of the auto. If Det. Brown is the gentleman getting into the passenger side front...where is Senkel? The car is driven by a uniformed patrolman not a detective.

Unless...when Senkel says in his typed statement that officer Brown said he had a vehicle and would drive me down to the station, office brown was referring to the patrol officer driving the car.

But there is another of Gerda's GIFs showing who she thinks is Brown in the basement and his statement is that he was helping move cars when Oswald was shot.

If Brown is actually the Detective that got into the passenger front in the clip showing the group leaving with Williams, then Senkel is in the rear or had to have gone in a different car.

Okay, thanks. I'll check this out when I get a chance.

[GuestGuest]

One of the two men in the film being put forward as Lovelady and Shelley, does seem to match the guy getting into the cop car with to others. And that matches the statements of the two cops who said they took Shelley and two others...

Yes -- Shelley and Lovelady are all over the place in their statements... but other evidence (such as the above) has been used to straighten it out.

greg,
Something I forgot to mention re: Shelley and the footage of him being transported to give a statement.

In this thread at the EF: educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?s=9c988a1bf9269c70c3a6468f98eab6fa&showtopic=19178

I think Mr. Lee Farley had it right at the beginning of the thread when he stated that William Shelley didn't ride in the group with Det. Brown and Senkel. Williams claimed Shelley went with Lovelady's group. I'm trying to find a statement from whoever took Lovelady down.

There is a youtube clip showing the man in the tie on the rear driver side of the auto. If Det. Brown is the gentleman getting into the passenger side front...where is Senkel? The car is driven by a uniformed patrolman not a detective.

Unless...when Senkel says in his typed statement that officer Brown said he had a vehicle and would drive me down to the station, office brown was referring to the patrol officer driving the car.

But there is another of Gerda's GIFs showing who she thinks is Brown in the basement and his statement is that he was helping move cars when Oswald was shot.

If Brown is actually the Detective that got into the passenger front in the clip showing the group leaving with Williams, then Senkel is in the rear or had to have gone in a different car.

I hope somebody does finally gets to the bottom of the Shelley-Senkel question.

I have never agreed with the consensus view that Bill Shelley is the guy wearing the black suit and tie who is seen opening the patrol car doors for Bonnie Ray Williams and Danny Arce.  Especially when we have an unidentified male stood behind Williams and Arce.  Now, this guy (below) looks more like somebody who is being taken down to the station for questioning. I've never understood the logic behind the Shelley ID.



I've wavered and flip-flopped on where I think Shelley is on the steps and after mulling over Sean's work over the last few weeks I have come full circle.  Shelley, IMO, is probably the guy wearing the tie, top half of his face in shadow, one or two steps up from where Lovelady stands in Altgens.  

 


And if I'm right then Shelley certainly isn't Prayer Man.  But if I'm wrong and Shelley is the guy that I think is Senkel then he's also not Prayer Man. 


EDIT: Should have read the additions to my EF thread you linked to before writing the above.  Didn't get around to it until just now.  Interesting development.  Got to say that I have to agree and the footage of the two men walking away from the TSBD certainly begins to shore things up.

[dwdunn(akaDan)]

forgot to underline "Truly" as in original note)

Go and stand in the corner.

I've always been suspicous of Truly ever since, for whatever that's worth.

While you're standing over there, contemplate that however suspicious you are of Truly - it isn't enough. He is the last link in the chain and it stretches way back...

Ok dad I give up.

Good luck to good people.

[Hasan Yusuf]

I believe the information on page 4 of the following Baylor file will be of interest; as I think it is relevant to this discussion (and the name Warren Caster should spring into mind when you read it):

http://digitalcollections.baylor.edu/cdm/ref/collection/po-arm/id/25543

I'll admit that Sam Pate comes across as a fruitcake, but I don't think he is necessarily wrong about Charlie Brown.

[GuestGuest]

I hope somebody does finally gets to the bottom of the Shelley-Senkel question.

I have never agreed with the consensus view that Bill Shelley is the guy wearing the black suit and tie who is seen opening the patrol car doors for Bonnie Ray Williams and Danny Arce.  Especially when we have an unidentified male stood behind Williams and Arce.  Now, this guy (below) looks more like somebody who is being taken down to the station for questioning. I've never understood the logic behind the Shelley ID.

The man above is Det. Brown as confirmed by his partner's affidavit describing the activities in the basement when Oswald was shot.I was concerned that when Senkel said that Officer Brown had a car, that Brown might be a uniform cop.

jfk.ci.dallas.tx.us/09/0920-002.gif

Det. Brown rode in the ambulance and stayed with Oswald's body until it hit the morgue.

Here's another photo of Det. brown. He's second from your left.
(I can't post links so just back out the spaces between the w's)

w w w.allposters.com/-sp/Dying-Assassin-Lee-Harvey-Oswald-in-Ambulance-after-Shot-by-Jack-Ruby-Dallas-Police-Station-Posters_i9360809_.htm

Page 13 of this thread has Gerda's GIF showing Brown.

educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=19178&page=13

Page 12 of the same thread has a link to this vid.

w w w.youtube.com/watch?v=6kaVM2-9f3Q

At 54 seconds, it shows the guy in the black suit in the rear driver side.

If Det. Brown is the guy in the front, and the driver is certainly a patrolman, Senkel is in the back with Williams and Arce.

[Faroe Islander]

Isn´t this Shelley ?
http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=19178&page=12  reply #174
I seem to remember the only witness seeing the shooter said he was wearing a white shirt or t-shirt ?
I am also convinced that BWF is looking at PM and can identify him or at least tell us who it is not !!
I just read that Lee Farley said: BWF would not would not id him self on the stairs ? I was shure it is BWF the first time I saw the photo there is no doubt in my mind that the man standing on top of the stairs is BWF.

[greg_parkerAdmin]

forgot to underline "Truly" as in original note)

Go and stand in the corner.

I've always been suspicous of Truly ever since, for whatever that's worth.

While you're standing over there, contemplate that however suspicious you are of Truly - it isn't enough. He is the last link in the chain and it stretches way back...

Ok dad I give up.

Good luck to good people.

Dan,

Your suspicion of Truly is well-founded. And if your suspicion was based in just gut instinct, then you have good instincts, compadre. 

Sorry about my late night attempt at humor.

I see part of your value here as keeping us all honest and on our toes. And occasionally scratching our heads or smiling at/with your undercurrents... so don't go disappearing anywhere, okay?

[GuestGuest]

I hope somebody does finally gets to the bottom of the Shelley-Senkel question.

I have never agreed with the consensus view that Bill Shelley is the guy wearing the black suit and tie who is seen opening the patrol car doors for Bonnie Ray Williams and Danny Arce.  Especially when we have an unidentified male stood behind Williams and Arce.  Now, this guy (below) looks more like somebody who is being taken down to the station for questioning. I've never understood the logic behind the Shelley ID.

The man above is Det. Brown as confirmed by his partner's affidavit describing the activities in the basement when Oswald was shot.I was concerned that when Senkel said that Officer Brown had a car, that Brown might be a uniform cop.

jfk.ci.dallas.tx.us/09/0920-002.gif

Det. Brown rode in the ambulance and stayed with Oswald's body until it hit the morgue.

Here's another photo of Det. brown. He's second from your left.
(I can't post links so just back out the spaces between the w's)

w w w.allposters.com/-sp/Dying-Assassin-Lee-Harvey-Oswald-in-Ambulance-after-Shot-by-Jack-Ruby-Dallas-Police-Station-Posters_i9360809_.htm

Page 13 of this thread has Gerda's GIF showing Brown.

educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=19178&page=13

Page 12 of the same thread has a link to this vid.

w w w.youtube.com/watch?v=6kaVM2-9f3Q

At 54 seconds, it shows the guy in the black suit in the rear driver side.

If Det. Brown is the guy in the front, and the driver is certainly a patrolman, Senkel is in the back with Williams and Arce.

That's a pretty good summation and if correct it leaves us back where we started - - no Shelley.  It opens up the question again as to when and with whom Shelley rode to the station.

I'm always wary of there being no photographs of key assassination witnesses.  Mary Bledsoe and Jack E. Dougherty being the prime examples.  Bledsoe requested, and received, anonymity up to and way past her Warren Commission testimony.

[ianlloyd]

Looking at the photograph of Arce & BRW getting into the cop car, behind BRW is cop jockey and there's a guy standing behind him - is there another angle showing this guy?

Also, in the same photograph is a guy standing by the tree in the background - could this be the same guy that was standing behind Lovelady (Oswald?) In Altgens where you can see his shirt & tie?

[GuestGuest]

Looking at the photograph of Arce & BRW getting into the cop car, behind BRW is cop jockey and there's a guy standing behind him - is there another angle showing this guy?

Also, in the same photograph is a guy standing by the tree in the background - could this be the same guy that was standing behind Lovelady (Oswald?) In Altgens where you can see his shirt & tie?

Here's a copy of the Allen photo from Robin Unger's site...it has a caption mentioning Arce and Williams being transported but doesn't mention Shelley...

w w w.jfkassassinationgallery.com/displayimage.php?pid=5825&fullsize=1

[GuestGuest]

I hope somebody does finally gets to the bottom of the Shelley-Senkel question.

I have never agreed with the consensus view that Bill Shelley is the guy wearing the black suit and tie who is seen opening the patrol car doors for Bonnie Ray Williams and Danny Arce.  Especially when we have an unidentified male stood behind Williams and Arce.  Now, this guy (below) looks more like somebody who is being taken down to the station for questioning. I've never understood the logic behind the Shelley ID.

The man above is Det. Brown as confirmed by his partner's affidavit describing the activities in the basement when Oswald was shot.I was concerned that when Senkel said that Officer Brown had a car, that Brown might be a uniform cop.

jfk.ci.dallas.tx.us/09/0920-002.gif

Det. Brown rode in the ambulance and stayed with Oswald's body until it hit the morgue.

Here's another photo of Det. brown. He's second from your left.
(I can't post links so just back out the spaces between the w's)

w w w.allposters.com/-sp/Dying-Assassin-Lee-Harvey-Oswald-in-Ambulance-after-Shot-by-Jack-Ruby-Dallas-Police-Station-Posters_i9360809_.htm

Page 13 of this thread has Gerda's GIF showing Brown.

educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=19178&page=13

Page 12 of the same thread has a link to this vid.

w w w.youtube.com/watch?v=6kaVM2-9f3Q

At 54 seconds, it shows the guy in the black suit in the rear driver side.

If Det. Brown is the guy in the front, and the driver is certainly a patrolman, Senkel is in the back with Williams and Arce.

That's a pretty good summation and if correct it leaves us back where we started - - no Shelley.  It opens up the question again as to when and with whom Shelley rode to the station.

I'm always wary of there being no photographs of key assassination witnesses.  Mary Bledsoe and Jack E. Dougherty being the prime examples.  Bledsoe requested, and received, anonymity up to and way past her Warren Commission testimony.

Lee, trust me.... I am getting pretty good at this....



Supporting observations.:

Fort Worth Star-Telegram: OBITUARIES
‎
$2.95 -
Fort Worth Star-Telegram - May 6, 1991
James Schuyler Shelley Jr., Building contractor MANSFIELD - James Schuyler ... of Greenville; brother, William Hoyt Shelley of Irving; and six grandchildren.

Their father's stone reads "Schuyler," but 1930 and 1940 US census describes them as James S. Shelley and wife Susie. The ages on the findagrave.com entries match the census ages info,
http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GSln=shelley&GSiman=1&GScid=175060&GRid=6531140&
and I'm liking the signature comparisons, except for the "S" and the "y". See affadavit signature, "William H. Shelley"
http://jfk.ci.dallas.tx.us/04/0492-001.gif

1930 Census: Home in 1930: Precinct 5, Grayson, Texas

[th]Household Members:[/th][th][/th]

[th]Name[/th][th]Age[/th] James S Shelley 45 Susie M Shelley 38 Clara M Shelley 19 Jimmie G Shelley 18 Alma I Shelley 16 Dorothy L Shelley 14 Jamie L Shelley 12 J S Shelley 5 William H Shelley 3 Mary D Shelley 2 [2 1/12]

View
Original
Record



View original image


1940 Census: Home in 1940: Grayson, Texas
Household Members:
[th]Name[/th][th]Age[/th]

J S Shelley	55
Susie M Shelley	49
J S Shelley	15
Hoyt Shelley	13
Mary Dell Shelley	12
Samuel Bozarth	74

My confidence level is above 90 percent, or I would have waited until I had more before I posted.

[Mark A. O'Blazney]

Best 'googler' this side of the Kuiper Belt.  Results to see !  Thank you, Tom.

[GuestGuest]

[Robert Charles-Dunne]

If the Shelley whom Tom has located is identical (and I think he is, bravo Tom) to the TSBD enigma, how could he have worked in a US defense plant during the war (December '41 to '45 for the Yanks) if he was 13 - per the census - in 1940?  At war's end, he's 18 and recruited into CIA at 20?

All seems rather unlikely, if the census data are accurate.   

Also puzzling to me is the cragginess of his face in '63, when he would only have been 36 years old.  I assume some heavy smoking and drinking in the interim to explain how the bright-eyed young cherub on the left above turned into the grizzled end product on the right.

Finally, one notes in the 1930 census results, the children are listed in descending chronological order, yet beneath William at age two is Mary, age 2 1/2.  How do the same parents have two children six months apart?

Was William adopted?

[GuestGuest]

Excellent find Tom !

So this mean we can certainly cross Shelley off this list for potential PM.
It also means that Shelley is a good candidate for the gentleman in the black tie seen behind Lovelady in Altgens 6.

Now I question why Williams would say the following in his testimony:"Well, at the time I don't think Norman and Jarman came down right then. They brought Bill Shelley and Bill Lovelady, a fellow by the name of Jack Dougherty, and Charles Givens later on, they brought them right behind us."...especially considering (based on the video) he was sitting right next to who we now think is Shelley.

There's something squirrely about Shelley. There's something squirrely about the whole "down to the tracks" story. There's something squirrely about having to get him away from the front door and yet having to slow down his arrival at the rear area which conflicts with Victoria Adams testimony.
And if Oswald was PM, Shelley wasn't much more than an arms length away from him and yet...never said a word.

[GuestGuest]

Can someone tell Richard Hocking at EF that Det. Levelle took Lovelady's and Given's statements.

[GuestGuest]

.......Social Security Admin. Record from Ancestry.etc

Name:	William H. Shelley
Birth:	12 Apr 1926
Death:	6 Sep 1996 - Irving, Dallas, Texas, USA
Civil:	Texas

(1940 Census page displaying JS Shelley Family, Grayson County, TX was enumerated on April 2 through 3, 1940. Hoyt Shelley's age
is accurately recorded as 13 years, nine days before his 14th birthday.)

Shelley told the WC he worked at defense plants before October, 1945 employment at TSBD. Roy Milton Jones graduated from Crozier Tech. in 1964 and there was background of Jones attending morning classes and working at a grocery store in the afternoon. Shelley may have worked at a defense plant while still attending Crozier, or he may have only worked full time after graduating in late May until the surrender of Japan triggered production halts in defense plants starting no later than September, 1945.

.........I was spared by an accident of birth from living in the southern USA and attending a militarized high school. I was unfamiliar with this form of youth indoctrination until becoming involved in JFK assassination research. Even in May, 1970, there was strong, irrational support for the Ohio national guardsmen shooting unarmed students on their own Kent State Univ. campus in Ohio.: http://www.may4archive.org/aftermath.shtml 


Cropped "Company B" photo. Lt. Hoyt Shelley Crozier Technical High School 1945 Yearbook:

[greg_parkerAdmin]

If the Shelley whom Tom has located is identical (and I think he is, bravo Tom) to the TSBD enigma, how could he have worked in a US defense plant during the war (December '41 to '45 for the Yanks) if he was 13 - per the census - in 1940?  At war's end, he's 18 and recruited into CIA at 20?

All seems rather unlikely, if the census data are accurate.   

Also puzzling to me is the cragginess of his face in '63, when he would only have been 36 years old.  I assume some heavy smoking and drinking in the interim to explain how the bright-eyed young cherub on the left above turned into the grizzled end product on the right.

Finally, one notes in the 1930 census results, the children are listed in descending chronological order, yet beneath William at age two is Mary, age 2 1/2.  How do the same parents have two children six months apart?

Was William adopted?

He was born in April '36 which makes him 14 in April 1940, but in all likelihood he didn't start work until the US entered the war in Dec 1941 making him 15. I was in the workforce at 14 - in peacetime  during last years of Vietnam War - and full-time.

Roy Truly worked at a defense plant at night - still keeping his day job - and I think that's what Shelley did - worked at the plant after school.

Teenagers[edit]
With the war’s ever increasing need for able bodied men consuming America’s labor force in the early 1940s, industry turned to teen-aged boys and girls to fill in as replacements.[17] Consequently, many states had to change their child-labor laws to allow these teenagers to work. The lures of patriotism, adulthood and money led many youth to drop out of school and take a defense job. Between 1940 and 1944, the number of teenage workers increased by 1.9 million, and the number of students in public high schools dropped from 6.6 million in 1940 to 5.6 million in 1944, as a million students—and many teachers—took jobs.[18]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_home_front_during_World_War_II

[Goban_Saor]

Superlative sleuthing by Tom Scully.

[greg_parkerAdmin]

At war's end, he's 18 and recruited into CIA at 20?

See my previous response to this. He also claimed to be an intelligence officer during the war. At best, he is an exaggerator, at worst, an outright confabulator.  I'll go with the former. The army, navy and FBI all had informants working in defense plants. He could easily have been such an informant. CIA after the war? Total BS. Continuing informant role at TSBD? Why not? If he was an informant, it's just a matter of who for... army, navy, FBI...

Finally, one notes in the 1930 census results, the children are listed in descending chronological order, yet beneath William at age two is Mary, age 2 1/2.  How do the same parents have two children six months apart?

Was William adopted?

Possibly, but why couldn't Mary be adopted? For that matter, why couldn't a bracketed 2 1/2 actually indicate months instead of years?

[GuestGuest]

This is a real gem, Tom- congratulations   A significant piece of information is that Shelley was a lieutenant in the ROTC while at Crozier Tech in 1945. Had to be just about the highest ranking member of his class. I don't think they gave out ranks higher than that, other than captain on a very rare occasion. Seems to me that would streamline his entry into intelligence work at the tail end of WWII- perhaps he even did this in a military capacity, as a member or reservist in the US Army during approx. 1944-5.

And he starts work at the TSBD at age 19. By the time he's 23 (1949) he's approached for CIA work. Quite plausible, given his track record.

[greg_parkerAdmin]

This is a real gem, Tom- congratulations   A significant piece of information is that Shelley was a lieutenant in the ROTC while at Crozier Tech in 1945. Had to be just about the highest ranking member of his class. I don't think they gave out ranks higher than that, other than captain on a very rare occasion. Seems to me that would streamline his entry into intelligence work at the tail end of WWII- perhaps he even did this in a military capacity, as a member or reservist in the US Army during approx. 1944-5.

And he starts work at the TSBD at age 19. By the time he's 23 (1949) he's approached for CIA work. Quite plausible, given his track record.

Richard, CIA does not place officers/agents in a domestic schoolbook warehouse. Nor do real CIA officers/agents "out" themselves to amateur conspiracy sleuths or nosey reporters. If he was anything, he was an informant. I do grant that if he was a reservist in the army as you suggest, it may also be possible he was in MI.

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