Was this the template for Mary Bledsoe's story?

I talked to the above subject by phone and he stated that he thinks that the subject who is in custody on the murder of the president rode the same bus with him to Oak Cliff about 10 minutes after the parade was over. He saw the piture on T.V. of Lee Oswald. He rode the Bishop bus which he caught near H.L. Greens. He said the man got on somewhere near Poydras St. and said " The president has been shot and the governor has been killed". He then sat down and didn't say anything else. He said the subject was wearing a dark felt hat and a dark coat. He said the subject got off before the bus got to Bishop St. but he doesn't know exactly where.

I told the complainant that we would call him if we needed him any further.

http://www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/viewer/showDoc.do?mode=searchResult&absPageId=141293

I just noticed Lee was on to this over a year ago...

http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=18372

Greg,

You probably saw this when I posted it over at the EF. I didn't find it until after the Lancer presentation but for me it is the point at which Bledsoe stopped being the woman who confused a laughing Roy Milton Jones for a Presidential assassin over on Marsalis Avenue and instead became Lee Oswald's former landlady who saw the accused assassin board the bus on Elm Street:

On November 26, 1963, two days after Henry Wade's press conference where he mentions the laughing Oswald being seen by a female passenger and five days after the assassination, Hugh Aynesworth in the Dallas Morning News wrote the following under the headline Evidence Mounting On Oswald:

"The source also said a woman who Oswald allegedly told about the President being shot knew the accused, who was slain Sunday morning in the basement of City Hall. The woman reportedly lives in the same neighborhood where Oswald rented a room."

So we are talking about week commencing 25th that the Bledsoe story began taking shape. I think on the Sunday they knew they were fucked and needed to pull a rabbit out of the hat. My opinion is that the woman who Whaley's passenger allegedly offered the cab to was written into Whaley's affidavit by
L. D. Montgomery at the behest of SA Edmond Hardin and Bill Alexander who were part of the Whaley interview team. Anybody with one eye that works can see that Whaley's handwritten affidavit is in Detective Montgomery's handwriting and the reason there are two quite different handwritten Whaley affidavits, both in Montgomery's handwriting, leads me to believe that the "extras" such as the woman asking for the cab were put in as an opportunity for a "witness" to come forward and ID the suspect should they need it at a later date. As it happens they didn't need it, but better to have it and not use it, than to need it and it not be there. IMO, the short handwritten affidavit was put together with Whaley, the second longer one was put together in his absence and it was the second one that was typed up and that he signed because, in his own words, "they said that is what I said."

I also mentioned something else in my Lancer presentation and that was the fact that Bledsoe was blanketed with complete anonymity right up until and long after her Warren Commission appearance. Not one newspaper printed her name. Can you name one other witness that this happened to?

In answer to your own question about the other reported sighting on the aptly named " Bishop" bus, I don't know whether it prompted them to go down the avenue they went down.

Personally, I think they thought they had it covered once they had McWatters in their clutches but the guy was simply too honest for them. Although they lied about it, McWatters did not ID Oswald and Whaley threw up more problems than he did solutions. They needed someone who knew Oswald to ID him and when they didn't have anybody who actually knew him they instead asked a woman of low moral scruples to pretend that she did.

Case closed.

Did I recount the Buddy Hough story to you?

In 1964 Buddy Hough opened up his Tragedy in U.S. History Museum in Florida. He would begin to fill his museum with some quite macabre objects such as the car that actress Jayne Mansfield was killed in.

At the end of 1964 he contacted Mary Bledsoe and ended up buying from her some "authentic" Lee Oswald "murderabilia"

He purchased all of the furnishings from Oswald's alleged former rooming house including the bed, the sheets and pillow. The wardrobe. His actual comb. His razor. A pair of Oswald's glasses. And the piece-de-resistance, a framed oil painting of JFK that Oswald, according to Bledsoe, hung on his Marsalis room wall for the 5 days he stayed there.

All items came with a signed certificate of authenticity from Mary E. Bledsoe. Hough has never confirmed the full amount that he paid her form them although part of the deal was that Hough had to have Mary's roof fixed on the porch of her house on Marsalis Avenue.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_NX2C0KvznXo/RarYYSO_ByI/AAAAAAAAAAs/MpbfNQ71tt8/s1600-h/Mrs+Bledso.jpg

That's the type of character Mary Bledsoe was. David Lifton, and other supporters of the bus-taxi story, are basically defending a complete and utter liar who would even stoop so low as to palm off a pile of shit as Oswald's personal belongings onto somebody who knew no better and as well as getting a pile of cash off Buddy Hough, the little shitbag made him fix her damn roof!!

Thanks Lee! Freakin' amazing.

Why would he question her? She had the imprimatur of the federal government.

At least we know now where Porter got it from.

And speaking of Porter...

Can you refresh my memory. I've just done a cursory check of MFF and the DPD files without finding any documents concerning Porter's alleged phone call tipping the cops about his mother.

Mary wasn't interviewed by Graves until 11/23 - same day that Odell was interviewed by the Sheriff's Office. I'm guessing Mary's interview came after Odell's, if you get my drift

Except for the clothing description, the stories are very similar. Too similar not to set off some bells - especially if the only evidence for a phone call from Porter is Mary's say-so.

This has been very impressive research, Lee. I enjoyed watching it develop from your old Ed Forum threads about "Oswald and Cab 36 William Whaley's 'story' in tatters" and "Oswald and Bus 1213 McWatters' and Bledsoe's 'story' in tatters"- which I did download parts of. I couldn't at the time, for lack of free time, keep up with all the minutiae developed by you & Greg & Duke, especially about Bledsoe. But I have to admit I'm thoroughly convinced that Oswald left the TSBD, waited around somewhere (near pergola?) and got in a Rambler.

There are occasions, rare blue moons, when I wander off to mourn the passing of the famous afternoon ride on Bus 1213. But I shouldn't feel so melancholy about something that never happened.

greg parker wrote:Thanks Lee! Freakin' amazing.

Why would he question her? She had the imprimatur of the federal government.

At least we know now where Porter got it from.

And speaking of Porter...

Can you refresh my memory. I've just done a cursory check of MFF and the DPD files without finding any documents concerning Porter's alleged phone call tipping the cops about his mother.

Mary wasn't interviewed by Graves until 11/23 - same day that Odell was interviewed by the Sheriff's Office. I'm guessing Mary's interview came after Odell's, if you get my drift

Except for the clothing description, the stories are very similar. Too similar not to set off some bells - especially if the only evidence for a phone call from Porter is Mary's say-so.

There aren't any records, Greg. We do have to make a series of assumptions that the Porter Bledsoe phone call took place.

If it didn't happen then I guess I'd be left scratching my head as to why the DPD went and dragged Cecil McWatters off his bus at 6:00pm the evening of the assassination. I don't believe they just randomly picked a bus and driver and if it was the FBI and DPD making the story up I'm sure they'd have chosen the Beckley bus as Oswald's getaway vehicle rather than the Marsalis bus. Remember the Beckley bus was due at the Elm Street bus stops at roughly the same time as the Marsalis bus.

McWatters affidavit has the "assassin's" altercation with the woman included in it and the reason they focused in on that aspect of the story that evening was because that was relayed to them over the phone by Porter. I'm 100% certain the woman was Bledsoe. I'd sincerely bet my house on it. The simple fact of the matter is this, on Friday night they didn't need Mary Bledsoe because I'm sure they were convinced they could thumb screw McWatters into an ID. When they didn't get it they got the next best thing; the punched transfer. Mary was then dragged into it on the Saturday at the same time they're working out the taxi fairy tale.

IMHO, a Porter Bledsoe phone call to the DPD detailing his mother being told by a boy about the assassination before the boy went into a fit of giggles fits the rest of the story perfectly.

What you say makes sense.

Possibly the only nit left to pick is - if the DPD acted on Porter telling them about "laughing boy", why is that part of the story absent from Mary's statement taken by Graves?

Or did they find out in the interim that this was Milton Jones?

Richard Gilbride wrote:This has been very impressive research, Lee. I enjoyed watching it develop from your old Ed Forum threads about "Oswald and Cab 36 William Whaley's 'story' in tatters" and "Oswald and Bus 1213 McWatters' and Bledsoe's 'story' in tatters"- which I did download parts of. I couldn't at the time, for lack of free time, keep up with all the minutiae developed by you & Greg & Duke, especially about Bledsoe. But I have to admit I'm thoroughly convinced that Oswald left the TSBD, waited around somewhere (near pergola?) and got in a Rambler.

There are occasions, rare blue moons, when I wander off to mourn the passing of the famous afternoon ride on Bus 1213. But I shouldn't feel so melancholy about something that never happened.

Richard,

I've been very vocal about how these particular threads that a handful of us managed to develop was one of the main outcomes I wished for when I joined the Education Forum. I had seen how Greg had created these types of threads in the years long before I joined and although I had a bit of a rocky introduction when I first became a member there I really wanted to create some collaborative research topics.

The end result is that we are in a different place concerning our understanding of the bus/taxi journey compared to the place where we started.

It's a shame these types of collaborations don't take place over there any longer. I know that Greg and Duke had a tendency to push each others buttons every now and again but I really fed off the intellectual tension that their sparring personalities created. Their intermittent clashes sometimes resulted in me suddenly seeing a point from an angle I hadn't thought of previously.

Greg will probably think I've gone nuts when I say this next bit but I actually thanked David Lifton (in his absence) at the end of my presentation at Lancer. His anaphylactic reaction to the theory made me work harder than I've ever worked before in understanding the content, studying with a microscope the testimony, and building the best possible arguments. Sometimes you need someone around who is trying to jab you to death for the motivation to bubble up.

greg parker wrote:What you say makes sense.

Possibly the only nit left to pick is - if the DPD acted on Porter telling them about "laughing boy", why is that part of the story absent from Mary's statement taken by Graves?

Or did they find out in the interim that this was Milton Jones?

Short, gut instinct response for now because it's getting late here and I'm up at 5:00am to catch a train to London; I think it dawned on them late Saturday/early Sunday that Bledsoe couldn't have seen Oswald over on Marsalis Avenue and I suspect, given McWatters testimony, that while he was at City Hall for the six hours they kept him I believe he knew, and was vocal about, exactly who the "boy" was and exactly where he let him off (Brownlee).

I think it quickly dawned on them the problems that laughing boy gave them and they were quick to swerve it away from this hence the change in story that Aynesworth published on Tuesday 26th.


Let me have a proper think and get back to you with a more detailed answer tomorrow night, Greg.

Greg,

Here is where I currently sit on the Bledsoe affidavit.

Bledsoe claims she was at City Hall on Saturday night speaking to law enforcement officials. The official story maintains she had a relationship with Oswald insofar as he lived with her for a week. If this was true then the DPD and the FBI showed no interest in her or her story other than it prompting them to search for the driver of the bus.

They weren’t at all interested in getting Mary Bledsoe to City Hall on Friday or Saturday morning/afternoon even though she’s allegedly claiming she knew the guy and she saw him on the bus.

No. Instead they fix their sights on and pick up Cecil McWatters who didn’t know him.

So we can reasonably guess that the reason why they weren’t interested in Mary on Friday/Saturday was because she didn’t know him either. She instead had seen Roy Milton Jones on the Marsalis bus, thought Jones was Lee Oswald when Oswald’s picture appears on TV and her son calls the cops to tell them. They now have the bus number and time she was on it. They contact the Dallas City Transit offices and they get McWatters’ current bus route. They drag him off the bus and they work him best way they can to ID Lee Oswald in the line-up.

McWatters affidavit specifically mentions the lady being told about the President being shot and “the boy”, who is supposed to be Oswald, starts laughing. McWatters IMO knew who the boy was and knew where he let him off. Once the DPD have McWatters affidavit on Friday night and they start reviewing it on Saturday morning I think it quickly dawned on them that it was pretty much useless in creating the type of lone-nut narrative they required. 90% of McWatters’ affidavit describes the altercation between the “boy” and the woman who took exception at the “boys” grinning. There is a reason for this fixation and IMO it was because they already knew about it from Porter’s phone call and that it why McWatters’ affidavit is primarily about it.

Now, I probably need you to help me out here, Greg. When and why does the story have to change? In other words, why did the woman on Marsalis disappear from proceedings and why did Mary Bledsoe boarding the bus on Elm Street take her place?

On Saturday morning they have the following:

i) Eyewitness sightings of Oswald leaving in a car
ii) A possible phone call detailing seeing “Oswald” on the Marsalis bus
iii) A witness who saw Oswald on the “Bishop” bus wearing a hat
iv) A non-ID ID of Oswald from the driver of the Marsalis bus.
v) An affidavit from the Marsalis bus driver that fixates on a woman and boy. The same affidavit stating in black and white that the altercation between the woman and boy taking place over on Marsalis Avenue.

McWatters’ affidavit tied their hands logistically. The disagreement between the woman and boy took place on Marsalis Avenue. In a perfect world this logistical avenue would have worked in their favour because they could get him from Elm Street over to Oak Cliff in one swoop.

But the bus was:

a) Caught in traffic for a sustained period of time and didn’t get over to Oak Cliff until after Oswald was supposed to be on his way to the Theater.
b) Would only take him within 6-7 blocks of his rooming house

So the bus avenue on Saturday morning was null and void for all intents and purposes and it was at this point that another mode of transportation was needed. According to the bogus interrogation notes it was Oswald himself who threw them the lifeline they needed. They had the transfer from McWatters bus already in their possession and Oswald was kind enough to admit to them on Friday that he left Dealey Plaza on the bus and went all the way to his rooming house on it which was nice of him. Then when it became apparent to them that the bus didn’t go all the way to his rooming house and that McWatters bus didn’t reach oak Cliff until well after 1:00PM the question is allegedly thrown at him at 10:30AM on Saturday morning from Fritz about him having information that he got a taxi. Oswald, according to the bogus interrogation notes, now changes his story and confirms he got a cab.

The problem was at 10:30AM they didn’t know about William Whaley and when he was brought it around 2:00PM to view the Oswald line-up and have his affidavit written out for him I believe the cogs were really beginning to turn in trying to get a viable “escape theory” boxed off.

Once Whaley was “found” they now had two modes of transport available for them to get Oswald away from Dealey Plaza and, more importantly, away from any type of automobile driven by “dark complexioned” men.

Early Saturday afternoon they now had:

i) McWatters bus that didn’t take him all the way home and didn’t get him to Oak Cliff in time
ii) The taxi that the passenger got into at 12:30PM and dropped off at the 500 block of North Beckley

They couldn’t use the bus as a complete journey and they couldn’t use the taxi as a complete journey. The bus driver didn’t ID the suspect and the cab driver did, allegedly.

Now, here is where I think the Odell story may have come into play. They interview Odell on Saturday morning or afternoon and he says he thinks he saw Oswald on a Bishop bus wearing a hat. They take his statement and I think it reasonable that they now feel they need something more concrete than an ID from someone who did not know him. They have two separate bus sightings both from people who had never met him. The Odell sighting is obviously erroneous, and the Bledsoe sighting as confirmed in McWatters affidavit related to someone who was over on Marsalis Avenue having an altercation with Mary Bledsoe long after Oswald is needed at 10th & Patton.

I believe it was later Saturday afternoon that a decision is made to bring in Mary Bledsoe to have her assist in creating the best possible case against the assassin of President John Kennedy and a combination of bus and taxi “escape” is decided upon.

The importance of Bledsoe to the official narrative cannot be underestimated and it is why there was a complete blackout in reporting even the most fundamental of details concerning her or her story. When we begin to dissect matter in this way I think Bledsoe’s testimony comment concerning her interview explains her importance:

“There sure was a lot of them. Two Secret Service men, and two to do this, and oh, I had interviewed about 9 or 10 or 12, plenty of them.”

Now, whether the L.C. Graves statement is the original is something that we may have to consider. Bledsoe is a bit of an enigma concerning something else; she is the only major witness who was spoken to by the Dallas Police that has no handwritten affidavit in their records.

By the time the statement was allegedly taken by Graves on Saturday night I believe they had quite a grasp on what was working in their favour and what needed to be changed or manipulated and I believe the “9 or 10 or 12” people who were “interviewing” Bledsoe did all of the necessary “interviewing” prior to Graves taking the statement who was simply brought in after Bledsoe had been prepared.

Hence, IMO, the reason why the first Bledsoe affidavit simply says, “I know this man was Lee Oswald because he lived at my home from October 7, 1963 to October 14, 1963.”

The rest would come later once the FBI and Secret Service began working in all of the details and the media were warned off their “witness” over the coming days.

Someone who was obviously outside the loop over the weekend was Henry Wade who was still using the “grinning boy” and “woman” who the grinning boy told of the President being shot as one of his 15 pieces of evidence during his Sunday night press conference. Little did Wade know but the Woman he was talking about in his press conference was about to teleport from Marsalis Avenue over to Elm Street.

We know it was Hugh Aynesworth who was closely following this story and it was his Tuesday 26th of November story that is the only real evidence we have that the woman (Bledsoe) who saw grinning boy (Roy Jones) had now let it be known that she knew the accused.

Lee,

very limited with time right now, but I couldn't go without saying what a great job you've done on this.

As to when the decision was made... look to the phone calls from the WH telling the DPD to take conspiracy off the table. Up until then, Curry was telling the media about the car escape and how much they wanted to find the driver. When the bus story took over, one intrepid reporter asked "what about the car?" From memory Curry simply ignored the question.

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.conspiracy.jfk/I70qDpyO6VE

Colin Crow wrote:Greg and Lee, great read. I have always doubted the interrogation travel switch. How helpful of the Lee "your the cop, you figure it out" Oswald.


I agree the "no conspiracy" clamp was put on from on high. Early stuff from the DPD was all conspiracy. Do we have a rough time that it was imposed? Sometime Friday evening?

Perhaps around the time LBJ talked to Hoover... maybe?

Richard Gilbride wrote:This has been very impressive research, Lee. I enjoyed watching it develop from your old Ed Forum threads about "Oswald and Cab 36 William Whaley's 'story' in tatters" and "Oswald and Bus 1213 McWatters' and Bledsoe's 'story' in tatters"- which I did download parts of.  I couldn't at the time, for lack of free time, keep up with all the minutiae developed by you & Greg & Duke, especially about Bledsoe. But I have to admit I'm thoroughly convinced that Oswald left the TSBD, waited around somewhere (near pergola?) and got in a Rambler.

There are occasions, rare blue moons, when I wander off to mourn the passing of the famous afternoon ride on  Bus 1213. But I shouldn't feel so melancholy about something that never happened.

It is interesting that a person can give up their insistence on a manufactured event like the bus ride but remain so adamant that another area of the case actually happened... against all the evidence we have. Like the 2nd Floor Encounter...

But then I suppose we all have blind spots in this morass of a case.

terlin wrote:It is interesting that a person can give up their insistence on a manufactured event like the bus ride but remain so adamant that another area of the case actually happened... against all the evidence we have. Like the 2nd Floor Encounter...

But then I suppose we all have blind spots in this morass of a case.

Indeed, Terry.

Posted for consideration and comment. It is similar (from memory) to something I came up with in the bus thread at the Ed Forum before dropping it in favor of what Lee was producing. This isn't an endorsement, but since there are some here interested in these areas, but who were not part of that original debate, it may spark further observations.
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/alt.conspiracy.jfk/ArzHml7u4fg

Who wrote the post on the Google groups website, Greg?

Hello Goodbye wrote:Who wrote the post on the Google groups website, Greg?

Don Willis.

greg parker wrote:

Hello Goodbye wrote:Who wrote the post on the Google groups website, Greg?

Don Willis.

I think he's mistaken about quite a few things.  I'll explain later after England go out the World Cup.

World cup excitement here in America... you can see it in the faces of the crowd...


I think he's rooting for England, now that Spain is out. But I could be wrong.

terlin wrote:World cup excitement here in America... you can see it in the faces of the crowd...


I think he's rooting for England, now that Spain is out. But I could be wrong.

So it's his fault we went out.  Jinxing bastard...

terlin wrote:World cup excitement here in America... you can see it in the faces of the crowd...


I think he's rooting for England, now that Spain is out. But I could be wrong.

He has approximately 10 minutes plus injury time before he'll need to root for someone else again.