The Fritz Prisoner Transfer Plan

First topic message reminder :

"I instructed James R Leavelle to handcuff his left hand to the prisoner's right hand. The prisoner was already handcuffed. I instructed LC Graves to walk to his left and LD Montgomery directly behind him, and I told them I would walk directly in front of the prisoner out of the door to the car."
http://jfk.ci.dallas.tx.us/06/0652-002.gif

If Fritz does not break formation, Oswald probably makes it to trial.

The evidence in that film of conspiracy to murder Oswald is clear-cut.

It is Fritz’s gross dereliction of duty to protect Oswald in breaking formation precisely when it facilitated Ruby murdering Oswald. The “coincidental” timing is the evidence.

Fritz’s left-hand signal is further confirmation.

At the least,Fritz should have been reprimanded for his dereliction of duty. Maybe even removed from his position as chief of homicide .But he seems to have got away without even a slap on his wrist.

Vinny wrote:At the least,Fritz should have been reprimanded for his dereliction of duty. Maybe even removed from his position as chief of homicide .But he seems to have got away without even a slap on his wrist.

Yes, Vinny. Without a shadow of a doubt Fritz was an accessory to murder – if not actually an accomplice – and he wasn’t even subjected to an investigation about it.

Not that an investigation was even necessary. As they say in law, Res ipsa loquitur, the thing speaks for itself.

Agreed Goban.

So is it possible to have a re-investigation under the Civil Rights Statutes of The DPD actions with regards to Oswalds demise whilst in their custody/care?

Mick Purdy wrote:So is it possible to have a re-investigation under the Civil Rights Statutes of The DPD actions with regards to Oswalds demise whilst in their custody/care?

It's an interesting question.

This is from the HSCA report.

The HSCA under Blakey had a Mob bias because it was his area of "expertise". Obviously if you were a fair dinkum inquiry looking into this, you would look at more than just the Mob as a possibility behind Ruby.

But to answer the question... there it is in black and white. Oswald's murder was a civil rights case as far as the FBI was concerned. 

Yet I suspect running that line now would get nowhere...just a hunch.

As near as I can tell Fritz, at least according to the Warren Report and the various statements from his colleagues was really the man in charge of the transfer, ie times, security, method of conveyance and so on. There were others who were given specific tasks, but overall Fritz had the last say. Curry says as much. Decker was not involved with the City hall end of things.

It falls to Fritz in the end. He is really the only person who had the opportunity to facilitate the killing of Oswald as far as I can tell with his inside knowledge of the intimate details of the transfer and also a powerful motive to have Oswald murdered.

Just my opinion.

Greg,

have I got this right then,

There have been two investigations into Oswald's Civil rights whilst in custody. There is the one which you've placed a link to for the Warren Commission and the one above from the HSCA.
Am I reading that right?

Fritz in my view should be looked at by authorities today. A man was murdered whilst in his custody.

Mick Purdy wrote:Greg,

have I got this right then,

There have been two investigations into Oswald's Civil rights whilst in custody. There is the one which you've placed a link to for the Warren Commission and the one above from the HSCA.
Am I reading that right?

Fritz in my view should be looked at by authorities today. A man was murdered whilst in his custody.

Mick, the HSCA didn't investigate it as a civil rights case. They were simply reporting what a high FBI official told them about the 63-64 FBI investigation. 

Yes, the transfer plan was 100% Fritz. 

--------------

On a related matter, the latest petition story has made it into the Washington Post.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/history/2019/01/25/kennedy-king-malcolm-x-relatives-scholars-seek-new-assassination-probes/?utm_term=.03a25af627bb

I post this comment to the story:

Blakey's advice that the FBI had been very cooperative with his investigation makes perfect sense, since it was aiming for a limited hangout based around his Mob obsession.

The fact is that the HSCA final report is damning when it comes to the FBI efforts in its '63-64 investigation, stating "The Committee's conclusion that conspiracy was a blind spot in the FBI's investigation was reflected in the observation of the Asst FBI Director in charge of the General Investigative Division, who said that while the Division was charged with investigating who specifically fired the shot or shots that killed president Kennedy, whether persons other than Oswald were involved was an ancillary matter... within the General Investigative Division, the probe of Jack Ruby was delegated to the Civil Rights Division on the theory that Ruby violated Oswald's civil rights... (and) the Bureau was seriously delinquent in investigating Ruby's underworld connections." So there is the Mob obsession coming to the fore again. It was not the Mob who ignored threats to Oswald's life and it was not the Mob who broke the 4 man press around Oswald which allowed the kill shot. It was also not the Mob who framed and sent an innocent Tommy Lee Walker to the electric chair 10 years earlier. It was Oswald's interrogator and the man who broke formation, Will Fritz, along with DA Wade who were the framers in that case.

I wish the petitioners well, but I believe they chose the name and the idea poorly. I cannot see any administration humbling itself with a process designed and used in third world countries. I truly believe, at least in the JFK case, a better path is giving Oswald the "Innocence Project" treatment. There is material that can be DNA tested and documents that have been buried all these years that point to how he was framed, and how they sought to twist his alibi in order to take it from him.  I can only add that if Oswald;s murder was a civil rights matter then, it should still be now. 

greg parker wrote:

Mick Purdy wrote:Greg,

have I got this right then,

There have been two investigations into Oswald's Civil rights whilst in custody. There is the one which you've placed a link to for the Warren Commission and the one above from the HSCA.
Am I reading that right?

Fritz in my view should be looked at by authorities today. A man was murdered whilst in his custody.

Mick, the HSCA didn't investigate it as a civil rights case. They were simply reporting what a high FBI official told them about the 63-64 FBI investigation. 

Yes, the transfer plan was 100% Fritz. 

--------------

On a related matter, the latest petition story has made it into the Washington Post.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/history/2019/01/25/kennedy-king-malcolm-x-relatives-scholars-seek-new-assassination-probes/?utm_term=.03a25af627bb

I post this comment to the story:

Blakey's advice that the FBI had been very cooperative with his investigation makes perfect sense, since it was aiming for a limited hangout based around his Mob obsession.

The fact is that the HSCA final report is damning when it comes to the FBI efforts in its '63-64 investigation, stating "The Committee's conclusion that conspiracy was a blind spot in the FBI's investigation was reflected in the observation of the Asst FBI Director in charge of the General Investigative Division, who said that while the Division was charged with investigating who specifically fired the shot or shots that killed president Kennedy, whether persons other than Oswald were involved was an ancillary matter... within the General Investigative Division, the probe of Jack Ruby was delegated to the Civil Rights Division on the theory that Ruby violated Oswald's civil rights... (and) the Bureau was seriously delinquent in investigating Ruby's underworld connections." So there is the Mob obsession coming to the fore again. It was not the Mob who ignored threats to Oswald's life and it was not the Mob who broke the 4 man press around Oswald which allowed the kill shot. It was also not the Mob who framed and sent an innocent Tommy Lee Walker to the electric chair 10 years earlier. It was Oswald's interrogator and the man who broke formation, Will Fritz, along with DA Wade who were the framers in that case.

I wish the petitioners well, but I believe they chose the name and the idea poorly. I cannot see any administration humbling itself with a process designed and used in third world countries. I truly believe, at least in the JFK case, a better path is giving Oswald the "Innocence Project" treatment. There is material that can be DNA tested and documents that have been buried all these years that point to how he was framed, and how they sought to twist his alibi in order to take it from him.  I can only add that if Oswald;s murder was a civil rights matter then, it should still be now. 

Thanks Greg,

much appreciated.

steely dan wrote:Am I right in saying that some members of the DPD wanted to move LHO early hours Sat/Sun but couldn't contact Curry?. He claimed his wife had taken the phone off the hook. I'm sure I read that somewhere.

Not sure Steely.
Commission Document 1 - FBI Summary Report
Current Section: L. Large Crowd Present
This following is from the MFF: 

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=10402&search="armored_truck"#relPageId=385&tab=page

All on Fritz despite his trying to shift it somewhere else.

And why does Fritz NEED to "step forward" to open the car door? Couldn't he do it with the others staying right up tight behind him? Or better still, couldn't one of the other cops down there open the damn door?

It couldn't possibly be more blatant. The time of 10 am was abandoned because Ruby was not in place. They awaited word that the eagle had landed before going down. The assumption that is made that Ruby just got lucky with the timing, is bullshit. Oswald's death was a case of planned obsolescence which was facilitated by Fritz with the aid of Olsen and maybe one or two other cops, and the Carlins. 

And it was Ruby himself making those death threats. The cop who took the call for the DPD even thought it sounded like Ruby. Ruby was hoping the threat would force them to move Oswald secretly and with more than enough security so he could get out of his mission and not face any consequences himself from those pushing him into it.

Mick Purdy wrote:

steely dan wrote:Am I right in saying that some members of the DPD wanted to move LHO early hours Sat/Sun but couldn't contact Curry?. He claimed his wife had taken the phone off the hook. I'm sure I read that somewhere.

Not sure Steely.
Commission Document 1 - FBI Summary Report
Current Section: L. Large Crowd Present
This following is from the MFF: 

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=10402&search="armored_truck"#relPageId=385&tab=page

Cheers Mick. My mistake.
Feel free to call me Steely Doyle

BBgreg parker wrote:All on Fritz despite his trying to shift it somewhere else.

And why does Fritz NEED to "step forward" to open the car door? Couldn't he do it with the others staying right up tight behind him? Or better still, couldn't one of the other cops down there open the damn door?

It couldn't possibly be more blatant. The time of 10 am was abandoned because Ruby was not in place. They awaited word that the eagle had landed before going down. The assumption that is made that Ruby just got lucky with the timing, is bullshit. Oswald's death was a case of planned obsolescence which was facilitated by Fritz with the aid of Olsen and maybe one or two other cops, and the Carlins. 

And it was Ruby himself making those death threats. The cop who took the call for the DPD even thought it sounded like Ruby. Ruby was hoping the threat would force them to move Oswald secretly and with more than enough security so he could get out of his mission and not face any consequences himself from those pushing him into it.

Bullseye!

greg parker wrote:All on Fritz despite his trying to shift it somewhere else.

And why does Fritz NEED to "step forward" to open the car door? Couldn't he do it with the others staying right up tight behind him? Or better still, couldn't one of the other cops down there open the damn door?

It couldn't possibly be more blatant. The time of 10 am was abandoned because Ruby was not in place. They awaited word that the eagle had landed before going down. The assumption that is made that Ruby just got lucky with the timing, is bullshit. Oswald's death was a case of planned obsolescence which was facilitated by Fritz with the aid of Olsen and maybe one or two other cops, and the Carlins. 

And it was Ruby himself making those death threats. The cop who took the call for the DPD even thought it sounded like Ruby. Ruby was hoping the threat would force them to move Oswald secretly and with more than enough security so he could get out of his mission and not face any consequences himself from those pushing him into it.

Yep Greg,

Fritz organised this, it was left to him all on his own.
Ruby - good timing ...FFS. Ruby and Fritz were in on this for sure.

Did The Police Pay Jack Ruby To Kill Oswald?

https://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=757&dat=19780916&id=mQ1OAAAAIBAJ&sjid=7K0DAAAAIBAJ&pg=6216,1982347

Vinny wrote:

Did The Police Pay Jack Ruby To Kill Oswald?

https://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=757&dat=19780916&id=mQ1OAAAAIBAJ&sjid=7K0DAAAAIBAJ&pg=6216,1982347

Thanks for this Vinny.

It's in there, isn't it. Hidden in plain sight. Dean allowed Ruby entry to the basement. The cops all knew Ruby. he was allowed a free pass. Fritz and probably 1 or more unknown persons had employed Ruby to murder Oswald. No big conspiracy. 

Thanks for posting this.

Means and motive eh Mick? Damn straight.

Jake Sykes wrote:Means and motive eh Mick? Damn straight.

It's simple and uncomplicated isn't it Jake?

The most basic human instinct. Fear.
I'd go so far to say had Oswald lived and  got to testify in front of a jury it would have been the end of Fritz' career

To my mind it's logical and makes the most sense. 
It is the most simple explanation which involves not more than two or three people.

I'll word my question slightly differently, who wanted Oswald dead more than anyone else?

FRITZ! Probably Wade too. 

My opinion.

https://flashbackdallas.com/2016/11/22/november-22-1963-will-fritz-and-the-investigation/

Vinny wrote:https://flashbackdallas.com/2016/11/22/november-22-1963-will-fritz-and-the-investigation/

The success rate of Fritz’s detectives was impressive:

The record of Fritz and the Police Department’s Homicide and Robbery Bureau — which he has led since its formation — is a nationally enviable one. Over the past quarter century, he and his aides have solved roughly 98 per cent of the 54 to 98 homicides committed each year. (Dallas Morning News, March 1, 1959)

That's right Vinny, put another way almost zero unsolved murders. Now that's impressive. And unrealistic! It says to me they were corrupt. And I think over time others have come to that same conclusion. Thanks to the Innocence Project in Texas we now Know Wade was sending innocents to prison, sometimes for very long stretches and even to their deaths. For him to be doing this Fritz had to have been involved - handing these suspects to Wade to prosecute. It is that simple, and it is a fact.

Will Fritz:


https://tshaonline.org/handbook/online/articles/ffr24