Rushoman to Judgement

Yates rushed in to work to tell Jones of his picking-up a hitch-hiker who discussed shooting Kennedy from an office building with a high powered rifle (sound familiar?) during his motorcade. Yates rushed in to tell Jones this because it was a curious coincidence with their previous conversation about it being possible to shoot Kennedy on his visit. I don't think those researchers are quoting accurately either because I believe Yates mentioned to Jones that the man was carrying a package. Or do they think Yates rushed-in to work to tell Jones he picked-up an ordinary hitch-hiker?

I think what saves Yates is the fact he rushed back to tell Jones because the experience was freakishly similar to what they were discussing. I can't understand people who takes sides against a man who endured sanitarium persecution in order to stick to his story as well as passing a lie detector test. Yates contacting FBI in order to push a silly hoax that would only get him in serious trouble if exposed doesn't make sense. Funny how Yates had no signs at all of those alleged serious mental problems during his employment until he came forward with his story and refused to back-down.

If Yates just picked up an ordinary hitch-hiker why did he rush-in to tell Jones?

Richard Gilbride wrote:I'm not signed on to this idea that Crafard was Ralph Yates' hitchhiker, and didn't mean to give that impression. Crafard doesn't resemble Oswald closely enough, and I think Ralph Yates saw an uncanny resemblance between his hitchhiker & Oswald. I do think that Yates was telling the truth at his polygraph, which he passed,

Richard, c'mon. You know better. If you're going to dispute what has been explained, pony up with something solid. He did not and could not be said to pass (or fail) a polygraph where no reaction is recorded against both control and relevant questions.

which the FBI proceeded to judge as "inconclusive".

It was not a "judgement" call. It is not an area that has any grey.

In other words, I think that Yates picked up Oswald's "double". But Crafard is a very good alternative, for those who contend that Yates wasn't telling the truth at his polygraph.

Fair enough. I'll take that to mean you'll catch this train when you realize the one you're on is a clapped out junker without any steam left.

This Exhibit 5227 is, shall we say, out there? It seems basically a love letter to his first cousin. The second to last line reads "But Darling my heart cried out against this."
Mankind should be grateful that this passion didn't produce children- or should I say "creatures"?

Cue duelling banjos

WCD 1079 shows Crafard's true colors. While crash-landing at Gale Cascaddian's (sp?) house in Michigan after hitching back from Dallas, Crafard passed the time upstairs reading comic books while the downstairs TV showed near-continuous coverage of news programs about the assassination. Gale's characterization: "Crafard seemed about as disturbed over the President's assassination as he would be 'over the killing of a cat'."

Crafard was not playing with a full deck and was easily malleable in a scheister like Ruby's hands. In my opinion Crafard had a critical role in providing a weapon to the JFK kill zone team, and probably also had some critical role in subsequent events.

I really do admire your lack of fear in going for the three-pointers. And I think you do land some. But maybe not here.... the ball is bobbling around the hoop, yet to fall one way or t'other.

Richard Gilbride wrote:I'm not signed on to this idea that Crafard was Ralph Yates' hitchhiker, and didn't mean to give that impression. Crafard doesn't resemble Oswald closely enough, and I think Ralph Yates saw an uncanny resemblance between his hitchhiker & Oswald.

Richard Gilbride wrote: In my opinion Crafard had a critical role in providing a weapon to the JFK kill zone team, and probably also had some critical role in subsequent events.

Richard Gilbride wrote:By the way, Lee, Happy Birthday How does it feel to be as old as a field?

greg parker wrote:Paterson, Ruby, Crafard

https://www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/viewer/showDoc.do?docId=9881&relPageId=249

"While in Harrison on this occasion, Crafard said he had been employed by Jack Ruby at the Carousel Club in Dallas. In addition to being a book-keeper and janitor for Ruby, he 'worked the lights' during the floor show and '...got tired of watching naked women.' Crafard claimed that he served as Jack Ruby's 'personal secretary;' he had coffee with Ruby in the latter's office, and he and Ruby occasionally sat at the end of the bar near the rear door of the Carousel Club and talked. According to Mrs Cascaddan, these statements by Crafard were apparently designed to demonstrate was not only an employee, but also a 'buddy' of Ruby. Too, Crafard gave the impression that his employment by Ruby was a 'big deal' and it had been an honor to work for him." https://www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/viewer/showDoc.do?docId=11475&relPageId=4

Lee David Farley wrote:

Hasan Yusuf wrote:

Lee David Farley wrote:

Hasan Yusuf wrote:Lee,

The handwriting in that Crafard exhibit is probably the worst I've ever read, but I think that what you made out from it is correct. Somebody should have given Crafard proper handwriting lessons.

Thanks for your perspective, Hasan.

Let's see what Greg and Richard think and if we've got the four of us saying the same thing then I'm claiming a home run.

It's interesting isn't it, how Hubert glosses over the content. Offering to give Crafard the letter back because it was "personal." I don't believe we have the whole letter. But they had Crafard on the stand for days. His testimony goes on for hundreds of pages. They were specifically asking about Jack Ruby's possible homosexuality but failed to ask Crafard about his given the content of the letter that they had in their damn hands.

Unbelievable

I certainly agree that it's unbelievable, Lee. And as you undoubtedly know better than myself, practically everything concerning this case is unbelievable. I mean, Johnny Brewer giving his first statement to the DPD 14 days after the assassination, Oswald's jacket being "discovered" more than 3 weeks after the assassination in the TSBD, the memories of certain witnesses remarkably improving over time etc.

I wish I could contribute more to this fascinating discussion, but I'm probably gonna be pretty busy with my damn review of the Don Thomas book. My guess is that both Greg and Richard will agree with us about the Crafard letter.

I once was flabbergasted by the time it took them to formally interview the likes of Brewer and Postal, Hasan. It was Greg who gave me the best explanation that made me understand it better. On the afternoon of 11/24 the case was all but shut once Oswald was declared dead. The "investigation" was all but dead too. It wasn't until the Warren Commission was announced that the different agencies shit a brick and ran out to do the work they should have been doing throughout the end of November and early December. I think you'll find the interviews of the likes of Brewer and Postal, as well as the submission of many outstanding DPD reports all coincide with the announcement of the Warren Commission. I'm sure the jacket being found also coincided with it.

Something to consider as you stumble onto things in the future...

Though let me say that I don't believe that Oswald was ever outside Brewer's store looking "funny/scared".

greg parker wrote:

"While in Harrison on this occasion, Crafard said he had been employed by Jack Ruby at the Carousel Club in Dallas. In addition to being a book-keeper and janitor for Ruby, he 'worked the lights' during the floor show and '...got tired of watching naked women.' Crafard claimed that he served as Jack Ruby's 'personal secretary;' he had coffee with Ruby in the latter's office, and he and Ruby occasionally sat at the end of the bar near the rear door of the Carousel Club and talked. According to Mrs Cascaddan, these statements by Crafard were apparently designed to demonstrate was not only an employee, but also a 'buddy' of Ruby. Too, Crafard gave the impression that his employment by Ruby was a 'big deal' and it had been an honor to work for him." https://www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/viewer/showDoc.do?docId=11475&relPageId=4

Crafard's exuberance about having worked for Ruby may be partly explained by Ruby's sudden infamy. But I don't think it solely explains it. Ruby knew people. Ruby dropped names. Ruby talked big. And he was kind of in show biz. Crafard had run concession stands at fairs and done a few other drab jobs. He had been given an early general discharge from the army. Ruby gave him "important" jobs. Important sounding titles. It's no wonder Crafard looked up to him.

Now go back to Ralph's hitch-hiker. He allegedly asked Ralph if he knew Ruby or had heard of the Carousel. Those pushing the doppleganger theory make all sorts of nonsense out of that.

But if this was Crafard (as I think is more than possible), it makes sense that he was asking about Ruby. If Yates had heard of this important man, Crafard could brag that he worked for him, or was an associate, and that was where he was headed: to the Carousel. It would have been a big boost to his self-esteem.

When the answer to both was negative, the subject was probably dropped and there would be no point to asking to be taken those 6 or so extra blocks...

Yates described his hiker as

5' 9"
slender
dark eyebrows and hair

FBI description of Crafard

Age. 22
Height. 5'8"
Weight. 150 lbs
Hair. Brown
Eyes. Brown
Complexion. Med
1/2" scar center of upper lip

Photo of Crafard

http://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh17/html/WH_Vol17_0100a.htm

I note RC-D does not think Crafard's hair and eyebrows could be described as "dark". Maybe it's just me, but I don't think "dark" is exactly way off the mark.

Crafard was mistaken for Oswald at an electronic store. That's now beyond dispute.

Addionally, I think he was mistaken for Oswald in the Carousel club, at sex parties Ruby held or attended, and possibly at Dobb's House just before Yates drove onto the scene in his trusty pickup.

greg parker wrote:Lee,

Here's what I get, in part,

"I thought you could tell it by looking at my face and the way I touched you & talked to you. I guess that for some stupid reason I thought you may have felt the same way."

The big question is - is it addressed to "Gail" or "Gale" because the former would more than likely denote "female" and the latter, a "male" - as in the actor Gale Gordon.

Greg,

Any idea what was involved in homosexual aversion therapy in the 1960's? Ralph was possibly seeing a psychiatrist and was on medication prior to his FBI visit. Do you think it likely that he was part of an aversion programme with Dr. Weaver? i mean, homosexuality in many circles was seen as a mental illness wasn't it?

He turns up to his first FBI interview with his uncle and not his wife. He specifically asks that he not receive any media attention. He cannot prove why he was in Oak Cliff. He's picking up strange men and this one (possibly) just happens to hang around with Big Butch Pinky Ruby.

Would his wife finding out, if he was partaking in homosexual activities, not send him a bit doo-lally? Five kids?

P.S. I thought the eyebrows quote from RCD was a bit left-field. Does the case hinge on dark versus brown eyebrows?

Mr. HUBERT. How long did you serve altogether?
Mr. CRAFARD. Thirteen months.
Mr. HUBERT. Is that the usual tour?
Mr. CRAFARD. No, sir. The usual tour is 3 to 4 years.
Mr. HUBERT. Well now, what caused you to get out sooner?
Mr. CRAFARD. As far as I understand it is the next thing to a medical discharge.
Mr. HUBERT. What was it based upon, do you know?
Mr. CRAFARD. General, under honorable conditions.

4. Claim to be gay or bisexual. Under the "don't ask, don't tell" law, expressing attraction to the same sex or engaging in "homosexual acts" is grounds for discharge. Sounds much better than shooting yourself in the foot for a medical discharge, doesn't it? There are two problems, however. First of all, if your commander doesn't believe you, you won't get the discharge. Secondly, you will get a "General Discharge" rather than the "Honorable Discharge" given to most soldiers, which is somewhat of a blot on your record.
http://www.ehow.com/how_4840471_out-military-early.html

Lee David Farley wrote:http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=PJfUHb7mB9UC&pg=PA328&lpg=PA328&dq=jolly+west+homosexual+aversion&source=bl&ots=XUcppGwe3U&sig=yU-pIPGruZAr4HntEH7WMysm_lQ&hl=en&sa=X&ei=GP1bUdypD4Oh0QXZqYCoDQ&ved=0CDEQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=jolly%20west%20homosexual%20aversion&f=false

greg parker wrote:

Lee David Farley wrote:http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=PJfUHb7mB9UC&pg=PA328&lpg=PA328&dq=jolly+west+homosexual+aversion&source=bl&ots=XUcppGwe3U&sig=yU-pIPGruZAr4HntEH7WMysm_lQ&hl=en&sa=X&ei=GP1bUdypD4Oh0QXZqYCoDQ&ved=0CDEQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=jolly%20west%20homosexual%20aversion&f=false

1975... 2 years after homosexuality was taken out of the textbooks as a psychiatric problem.

I actually remember Nixon's push to eradicate violence the West way... it was a huge story in the day...

Lee David Farley wrote:

greg parker wrote:

Lee David Farley wrote:http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=PJfUHb7mB9UC&pg=PA328&lpg=PA328&dq=jolly+west+homosexual+aversion&source=bl&ots=XUcppGwe3U&sig=yU-pIPGruZAr4HntEH7WMysm_lQ&hl=en&sa=X&ei=GP1bUdypD4Oh0QXZqYCoDQ&ved=0CDEQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=jolly%20west%20homosexual%20aversion&f=false

1975... 2 years after homosexuality was taken out of the textbooks as a psychiatric problem.

I actually remember Nixon's push to eradicate violence the West way... it was a huge story in the day...

If Jolly was still up to after it was taken off the list then one can only imagine what he was up to when it was on it.

The behaviorist school in psychology also attempted to convert gay people into heterosexuals. Some of their treatments were caustic. Three forms of aversion therapy were used. The first was electrical aversion therapy, in which an electric shock was administered to the patient if he responded erotically to a picture of a new man. Another technique was called covert sensitization, in which disgust and images of vomit were thought to cure homosexual desire. The third type of aversion therapy used the drug apomorphine, which induces nausea in the patient. Gay liberationists viewed these aversive procedures as punishment, not treatment.

Davison, who later rejected his early work, called his system "Playboy therapy," in which a gay man masturbated to pictures of naked women. A good review of the aversion therapy literature is provided by Bancroft, who himself contributed significantly to the aversion therapy literature. Masters and Johnson also attempted to change the sexual orientation of gay people.

Perhaps the most bizarre attempt to reorient the sexual orientation of a gay man was performed by Heath at Tulane University in 1972. Heath implanted electrodes into the brain of a gay man. The patient was then placed in a room with a woman prostitute, who was hired to seduce him. As the same time, Heath stimulated the pleasure centers in the brain of the man. This attempt was not a success.

Robert Charles-Dunne wrote:Crafard being gay is entirely conceivable, for reasons stated. It would also help explain why Ruby so instantly placed him in a position of great trust.

"He [Ruby] liked to surround himself with clean cut, well-dressed 'Hollywood"-type men because it made him feel important."
http://www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/viewer/showDoc.do?docId=57076&relPageId=88

But Ralph Yates? While not impossible, in my experience on this planet, gay men don’t usually have five children. Not because they’re incapable of the contribution required, but because they don’t relish physical intimacy with women sufficiently to impregnate a woman five times. Yet Ralph seems to have managed five kids by a very early age, indeed. But anything’s possible, one supposes.

I'm pretty sure Crafard's lesbian wife had a kid with him, and I've heard of fathers waiting for their kids to grow up and then having a sex change. As you say, anything is possible. Maybe he just "turned" or maybe he had been trying extra hard to live in denial. Five kids. Who's gonna question his manliness?

As for the description of hair and eyebrows provided by Yates, “dark” is a relative term and it would have been nice had authorities insisted on an actual colour, such as black or brown or chestnut, or what have you. Perhaps it’s just me, but when I think of blonde, brunette and black, I think light, medium and dark.

Though I cannot at present recall where, I long ago saw a photo of Crafard in which he looked more fair than he is usually depicted in photos, and thought the difference was down to using some kind of pomade like Brylcreem. Pre-Beatles, slicked hair was very much the fashion in North America, and the requisite liberal use of pomade gave me - for example - hair several shades darker than what the Good Lord provided me.

Thanks for clarifying your definitions. Maybe he wore pomade that day?

Crafard-as-hitchhiker would explain much, but I’m not sure how one would be able to corroborate it.

Well, the doppleganger theory has been getting along just fine without corroboration. Just lots of picking and choosing and misrepresentation of evidence.

And I do think that had it been him, he would have prevailed upon Yates to drive him to the club instead of Houston and Elm.

I tried to cover this earlier:
----------------------------------

While in Harrison on this occasion, Crafard said he had been employed by Jack Ruby at the Carousel Club in Dallas. In addition to being a book-keeper and janitor for Ruby, he 'worked the lights' during the floor show and '...got tired of watching naked women.' Crafard claimed that he served as Jack Ruby's 'personal secretary;' he had coffee with Ruby in the latter's office, and he and Ruby occasionally sat at the end of the bar near the rear door of the Carousel Club and talked. According to Mrs Cascaddan, these statements by Crafard were apparently designed to demonstrate was not only an employee, but also a 'buddy' of Ruby. Too, Crafard gave the impression that his employment by Ruby was a 'big deal' and it had been an honor to work for him." https://www.maryferrell.org/mffweb/archive/viewer/showDoc.do?docId=11475&relPageId=4

Crafard's exuberance about having worked for Ruby may be partly explained by Ruby's sudden infamy. But I don't think it solely explains it. Ruby knew people. Ruby dropped names. Ruby talked big. And he was kind of in show biz. Crafard had run concession stands at fairs and done a few other drab jobs. He had been given an early general discharge from the army. Ruby gave him "important" jobs. Important sounding titles. It's no wonder Crafard looked up to him.

Now go back to Ralph's hitch-hiker. He allegedly asked Ralph if he knew Ruby or had heard of the Carousel. Those pushing the doppleganger theory make all sorts of nonsense out of that.

But if this was Crafard (as I think is more than possible), it makes sense that he was asking about Ruby. If Yates had heard of this important man, Crafard could brag that he worked for him, or was an associate, and that was where he was headed: to the Carousel. It would have been a big boost to his self-esteem.

When the answer to both was negative, the subject was probably dropped and there would be no point to asking to be taken those 6 or so extra blocks...
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Unless, or course, that was his intended destination because he was dropping something off for Warren Caster, who apparently needed new curtain rods. ;-)