The Beckley Bunch

First topic message reminder :

The Lone Gunman With Rob Clark,

Episode 161 The Beckley Bunch:

https://tlgpodcast.blogspot.com/p/podcast-episodes.html?m=1

Ed, the assemblage of material gathered for this is only equaled or bettered by the amount of material gathered by Barto on PM/2FE.

Sorry have been slow to the party but have been busy a JVB piece.

Go ahead and post whatever you want from what i sent. Probably not that much of any great value anyway.

What a comprehensive and concentrated dose of research. I’ve only had a chance to listen through one time. This episode and the primary source documents will take some time to completely digest.

Going to have another listen soon, so I’m not sure if you touched on the following.

If “Oswald” was living at the rooming house under an assumed name “O.H. Lee” then HOW did he receive ANY calls (like the ones supposedly in a foreign language) at the boarding house on Beckley? In other words WHO did the caller to the rooming house ask for? And how did the person who answered the phone know to give it to “Oswald.”

If you discussed that my apologies the episode is quite long and full of information, I may have missed that.

Will Hart wrote:What a comprehensive and concentrated dose of research. I’ve only had a chance to listen through one time. This episode and the primary source documents will take some time to completely digest.

Going to have another listen soon, so I’m  not sure if you touched on the following.

If “Oswald” was living at the rooming house under an assumed name “O.H. Lee”  then HOW did he receive ANY calls (like the ones supposedly in a foreign language) at the boarding house on Beckley? In other words WHO did the caller to the rooming house ask for? And how did the person who answered the phone know to give it to “Oswald.”

If you discussed that my apologies the episode is quite long and full of information, I may have missed that.

Hello Will,

yes, Ed did touch on that, but understandable that it could be overlooked or forgotten given the sheer amount of info involved. That you also zero in on that though, adds weight to the question.

Thanks for posting that response Greg. Currently listening again and I have found the pertinent portion of the podcast about the calls received by “Mr. Lee” and it begins around 1:13:00.

Glad you had a listen Will, and have questions! There should be an exponentially greater number of questions to the number of answers provided. Its a fractal universe and that's the pattern.
A reread of all the Avalanche Journal series articles (knowing Jones is Floyd de Graffenreid, and Adams is Hugh Slough) is necessary to see the Beckley juggling act in its full glory.

Each thinks the other is in on it. Such shenanigans happen when there are accusations but not the accused. Its the true form of a tragedy/comedy.
Part Five sums it up.

Jones (Floyd De Graffenreid) was 18, under the drinking age... yet went drinking with Duncan's employee Ford. Hmm, Floyd has a bit of a problem, and so does Ford if they admit going out for beers. Did Floyd have a fake ID? What beer joint did they go too??? Not one with loose standards, like Ruby's perhaps? Are they even asked? Is that a problem in of itself?

A big thanks to Greg; I pointed to a lot in the essay, that's why it was tough to get me to change parts as they lead to other parts.

Interestingly JVB and her visit to the rooming house brought up a ton of material.

...& That's not all it brought up  

Cheers, Ed

PaulJolliffe@the13inchheadforum wrote:The first one quotes Jerry Duncan extensively.
How in the world does Jerry Duncan's insistence that LHO's visits (a man with whom Duncan really met and interacted at least twice!) to the Humble Gas Station, directly across the street from 1026 N. Beckley,  support your theory that LHO did NOT live at 1026 N. Beckley? 
As you know, on 11/24/63, Duncan insisted to the FBI that LHO DID LIVE at 1026 N. Beckley, and that this "Oswald" had no automobile - he came to the gas station on foot!
https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh26/html/WH_Vol26_0143b.htm

And as you apparently don't know because you're cherry-picking... 

John Ford, a Duncan employee who supposedly went out drinking with Oswald on one occasion, stated he had never seen Oswald before in his life. It is right there in the the same link Mr Jolliffe provided.

And if we continue scrolling through the pages, we find out which resident of the rooming house did go out drinking with Ford.

The FBI locates Ford and he describes the roomer he went drinking with as wearing cowboy clothes. The feds then go to Gladys Johnson to see if she can recognize the person from Ford's description. She says the person she has rooming who wears cowboy clothes is Floyd deGraffenreid who confirms he went out drinking with Ford.
https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh26/html/WH_Vol26_0145a.htm

Conclusion: the person who interacted a couple of times with Duncan was deGraffenreid.

Now, maybe (maybe) LHO did not live at 1026 N. Beckley, but Duncan's above story - which you cited! -  makes it very likely that LHO really did live there. Furthermore, the fact the FBI completely made up a phony refutation a month later is very powerful evidence that on 11.24.63,  Duncan told the FBI the truth - LHO really did come to the Humble Gas Station directly across from 1026 N. Beckley at least twice to make long distance pay phone calls. Moreover, Duncan believed that LHO really did live at 1026 N. Beckley and on 11/24/63, said so to the FBI!

A phony refutation? A month later?

Duncan was interviewed on Nov 24. Ford was interviewed on Nov 25. 


So according to you, the FBI got John Ford, Gladys Johnson and Floyd deGraffenreid to all refute Duncan??? Is that the claim being made? Wow! Just fucking wow!

Typical FBI. Coerce three witnesses to make false statements regarding a sighting of Oswald that actually helps the FBI case! The FBI NEEDS Oswald to be living at the rooming house, yet here they are forcing three witnesses to refute a supporting witness to that. 

Logic is not your strong suite is it, Mr Jolliffe? 

Even if you could come up with some cockamamie story to explain why they would do that.... why wouldn't they instead, take the far easier route of altering Duncan's statement... or better yet, just "losing" it?

In the second story you posted,  "John Adams" living at 1026 N. Beckley, clearly believed that he been introduced to the accused assassin, also living at 1026 N. Beckley,  by the name "Harvey Lee."  You have speculated that perhaps "John Adams" misheard or mis-remembered that name. While that is theoretically possible, you have no evidence that "Adams" was mistaken about the name "Harvey Lee". You have based your speculation on the phonetic similarity to another previous roomer - Herbert Leon Lee. 

Hugh Slough gave many versions of his stay at the rooming house. A good reason perhaps to keep being interviewed under different names. 

But just on the general issue of any witnesses slipping up and recalling Lee Oswald as Harvey Oswald... let me add to the speculation... Lee is most commonly, a middle name, or the second part of a hyphenated first name.

Some people therefore, post-assassination, will automatically rearrange "Lee Harvey Oswald" as "Harvey Lee Oswald"  in their mind. It is a different story now, simply because the name "Lee Harvey Oswald" is too deeply ingrained for a brain fart. You can't look at this through 21st century eyes.

However, you neglected to tell your readers that Herbert Leon Lee did not use the name "Herbert."
No, instead he went by "Leon" Lee, a name far less likely to be mistaken as "Harvey Lee." 
https://www.legacy.com/obituaries/shreveporttimes/obituary.aspx?n=herbert-quotleonquot-lee&pid=128925162#fbLoggedOut

Mr Lee obviously signed in to the rooming house under his real first name of Herbert. He therefore was most likely known in the rooming house by that name. The fact that he preferred his middle name of "Leon" is neither here nor there... have you never heard of anyone being introduced under their real name only to learn later that his close friends and family call him by his middle name (or a nickname)? 

As far as Mr Lee goes, it's not as if he was planning on staying in that rooming house very long. Why bother telling people to call him Leon when he has no plans of ever seeing them again?

Finally, "John Adams" described overhearing "several" (at least three) phone conversations - at least one of which turned heated - between "Harvey Lee" at 1026 N. Beckley and an unknown party in Russian. Those conversations were between real people, but you have speculated they did not involve the accused assassin. 

Fair enough. It is your right to speculate all you like. But you have produced not one tiny drop of evidence that any other person in residence at 1026 N. Beckley between the middle of October and November 22, 1963 even spoke Russian, let alone that they were later mistaken for "Harvey Lee" using the phone!

"Harvey Lee" absolutely did converse with his wife in Russian all the time! But besides "Harvey Lee",  there is not the slightest shred of evidence that either "Leon" Lee or anyone else living at 1026 N. Beckley even could have made those calls in Russian.

Well, let's examine some of things Slough told Mark Bridger under anonymity (Bridger simply refers to him as Mike)

"I recall a small nervous man. Unimpressive. I dismissed him as anyone I would care to be around.I never saw him with anyone, or even conversing with anyone."

How do you reconcile that with Pat Hall (Gladys Johnson's grand-daughter) recalling Oswald as playing with her brothers on the lawn, breaking up their fights and lecturing them that violence was not the answer?

I reconcile it this way. Slough was recalling deGraffenreid -- who was indeed smaller than Oswald and may have had a nervous disposition being probably the youngest boarder among a creepy bunch of older men.

Pat Hall on the other hand, was either recalling Leon Lee -- or she  simply stole a similar story told by Ruth Paine about Lee playing on her lawn with neighborhood kids.

 "We all had to eat before arriving at the rooming house or we had t go out for meals. We had no kitchen privileges and food was not allowed."

Yet we are led to believe that Oswald did keep food in the refrigerator and made sandwiches in his room. Why would Slough lie about that? No reason at all. But then why would anyone lie about Oswald keeping food there? Simple. We are told repeatedly how frugal Oswald was. Any indication that he had to eat out every night, would simply blow his tight budget. 

When asked about Oswald's accent, Slough gave an interesting reply since he had already said Oswald never spoke to anyone. In part, he replied that "Oswald did not have any outstanding accent." Unfortunately Mark Bridger did not follow up on how he could know his accent if her never heard him speak (at least not in English).

As for the phone calls in Russian. Just where was this phone situated so that every man and his seeing eye dog could hear the conversations?

But I'll make some other points. Slough (as John Adams) also recalled Oswald being introduced as someone who spoke German. Others thought the phone calls Slough refers to as being in Russian were actually in German. Slough (in correspondence to Bridge under the name "Mike") stated that "Dallas is a very cosmopolitan area" - another way of saying it had a rich cultural mix. Did Oswald speak German? Maybe a few phrases. Not enough for a conversation. What can be said with absolute certainty is that DeGreaffenreid is a German name. Did he speak German? Maybe some day someone will ask him. 

In answer to another question, Slough recalls a carpenter named Floyd. Obviously "Floyd" is deGraffenreid. But Degraffenreid was not a carpenter - he was a mechanic. The "carpenter" was most likely one of the floor-layers - Herbert Lee or James Watson. This shows how memories get blurred. What we see continually coming out of N Beckley is Floyd and Leon being blended in memories and then wrongly recalled as Oswald. We know on other occasions, people were simply recalling someone who looked a bit like Oswald, but had convinced themselves it was him. In line-ups, we know some witnesses picked the person who looked most like the person they thought they were there to ID. McWatters for instance, thought he was there to ID Milton Jones and picked Oswald because he was closest in looks.

The problem with the Harvey and Lee crowd is that they have to pretend memory is infallible - when every single study on witness memory points the other way.

Ed Ledoux has made an outstanding case for Oswald never having lived at that rooming house. This was also my position for a long time, until having second thoughts that he may have stayed there for a short period, but was not living there on Nov 22. Point is, one of those scenarios is correct. The only false scenario is Oswald moving in on Oct 14 and leaving there for the last time on the morning of Nov 20 (except of course for racing in to grab his invisible pistol on Nov 22!). 

And it only becomes more of a farce when you start claiming it was the mythical "Harvey" staying there. 

Any idea where "Lee" was staying at the time? You guys never say. I think you need to. 

I think he must have been holed up with Larry Crafard and all of the other fake Oswald's at the Official Fake Oswald convention in Oshkosh. or the OFOCO as it is known to the "in" crowd.

Jolly Paulie has been well and truly doppelganged by Jimbo Baggins...he's seeing Harveys popping up everywhere now!!
Maybe Swinging Sandy can get him t put on a 13 inch hat and join the neighborhood doppelganger patrol.
You made a mistake Greg..the official fake Oswald Convention was held in NOSH Oshkosh...a sleepy hamlet deep in the Sanibel badlands..lotta doppelgangers wandering about down Nosh Oshkosh way...
One time Swinging Sandy was out doppelganging when he remembered he had a meeting with Ming and Rottenfuhrer Speer t discuss the imminent FEMA takeover...
The cold Sanibel moonlight echoed with his anguished cry..
"OFOCNO..I've gotta go t S.U.C.C.O.C....
You can imagine what Ming thought..
And Brian too..he was out walking his mommies giant Cuban Cockhound..
Sanibel Island isn't known as the Baskerville Hall of Florida for nothing..

MY REPLY TO PAUL IN CAPS. ED


On 1/19/2020 at 11:55 AM, Paul Jolliffesaid:
Thanks, Ed for posting these two articles.

NO WORRIES, MY REPLY IN CAPS.

  Quote

The first one quotes Jerry Duncan extensively.

How in the world does Jerry Duncan's insistence that LHO's visits (a man with whom Duncan really met and interacted at least twice!) to the Humble Gas Station, directly across the street from 1026 N. Beckley,  support your theory that LHO did NOT live at 1026 N. Beckley? 

As you know, on 11/24/63, Duncan insisted to the FBI that LHO DID LIVE at 1026 N. Beckley, and that this "Oswald" had no automobile - he came to the gas station on foot!

https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh26/html/WH_Vol26_0143b.htm

 

FUNNY AS FORD STATED HE HAD NEVER SEEN OSWALD BEFORE IN HIS LIFE.

PS. IT IS RIGHT THERE IN THE SAME LINK PAUL PROVIDED...

  Quote
Now, maybe (maybe) LHO did not live at 1026 N. Beckley, but Duncan's above story - which you cited! -  makes it very likely that LHO really did live there.

NO IT DOES NOT.

IT ALONG WITH THE OTHER INTERVIEWS SHOW IT WAS NOT OSWALD DUNCAN THOUGHT WENT OUT FOR BEER WITH FORD, THAT WAS FLOYD. 

THE PERSON DUNCAN INTERACTED WITH GOT CHANGE, AND MADE LONG DISTANCE CALLS.

THOSE CALLS WERE FROM HERBERT LEE TO HIS GIRLFRIEND.

PER THE FBI.

TRY AS THEY MIGHT THEY TRIED TO MAKE DUNCAN BELIEVE THE CALLS WERE MADE BY FORD TO HIS MOTHER IN LOUISIANA.

IM SURPRISED YOU WOULD FALL FOR THIS IDEA RATHER THAN THE ACTUAL FBI INVESTIGATION INTO THE CALLS.  I CALL THAT DISHONEST.

 

  Quote

Furthermore, the fact the FBI completely made up a phony refutation a month later is very powerful evidence that on 11.24.63,  Duncan told the FBI the truth - LHO really did come to the Humble Gas Station directly across from 1026 N. Beckley at least twice to make long distance pay phone calls. Moreover, Duncan believed that LHO really did live at 1026 N. Beckley and on 11/24/63, said so to the FBI!

YOU ARE NOT BEING OBJECTIVE BUT FALLING FOR AN EASY PIECE OF BAIT. THERE IS NOTHING TO FORD'S CALLING HIS MOTHER, UNLESS YOU BELIEVE DUNCAN DIDN'T RECOGNIZE HIS OWN EMPLOYEE.... HAHA! 

ACCORDING TO YOU THE FBI GOT FORD, GLADYS, AND FLOYD DEGRAFFENREID TO ALL REFUTE DUNCAN? REALLY? ARE YOU SURE PAUL????

In the second story you posted,  "John Adams" living at 1026 N. Beckley, clearly believed that he been introduced to the accused assassin, also living at 1026 N. Beckley,  by the name "Harvey Lee."  You have speculated that perhaps "John Adams" misheard or mis-remembered that name. While that is theoretically possible, you have no evidence that "Adams" was mistaken about the name "Harvey Lee". You have based your speculation on the phonetic similarity to another previous roomer - Herbert Leon Lee. 

However, you neglected to tell your readers that Herbert Leon Lee did not use the name "Herbert."
No, instead he went by "Leon" Lee, a name far less likely to be mistaken as "Harvey Lee." 

https://www.legacy.com/obituaries/shreveporttimes/obituary.aspx?n=herbert-quotleonquot-lee&pid=128925162#fbLoggedOut

PAUL HIS NAME IS HERBERT.

I SAID HE WENT BY LEON WHEN CALLING HIS GIRLFRIEND THUS I NEGLECTED NOTHING.

YOU NEGLECTED ANYTHING TO BACK YOUR ARGUMENT THO PAUL...

AND HE OBVIOUSLY SIGNED INTO BECKLEY AS H. AS IN HERBERT AND NOT L. AS IN LEON LEE

PERHAPS HE DID NOT GO BY HERBERT, HE WENT BY HENRY AS TWO PEOPLE SAW THE RECEIPT FOR HENRY.

RIGHT PAUL?

NEXT??

  Quote

Finally, "John Adams" described overhearing "several" (at least three) phone conversations - at least one of which turned heated - between "Harvey Lee" at 1026 N. Beckley and an unknown party in Russian. Those conversations were between real people, but you have speculated they did not involve the accused assassin. 

Fair enough. It is your right to speculate all you like. But you have produced not one tiny drop of evidence that any other person in residence at 1026 N. Beckley between the middle of October and November 22, 1963 even spoke Russian, let alone that they were later mistaken for "Harvey Lee" using the phone!

PAUL ITS MERE SPECULATION IT WAS RUSSIAN.

WHAT ISNT SPECULATION IS THE INTRODUCTION OF A GERMAN SPEAKER.
NOT SPANISH OR DUTCH BUT GERMAN.

PLEASE POST THE INTRODUCTION OF ANYONE AS A "RUSSIAN" SPEAKER.

TIA!

"Harvey Lee" absolutely did converse with his wife in Russian all the time! But besides "Harvey Lee",  there is not the slightest shred of evidence that either "Leon" Lee or anyone else living at 1026 N. Beckley even could have made those calls in Russian.

MORE UNSUBSTANTIATED SPECULATION ON YOUR PART.

DALLAS HAD A LARGE DIVERSE POPULATION. ANYTHING FROM CROATION TO HUNGARIAN COULD BE "RUSSIAN" TO THE MISINFORMED OR IGNORANT.

WHAT WASNT DISPUTED WAS THE INTRODUCTION OF A GERMAN SPEAKER. RIGHT PAUL?

SLOUGH TOLD MARK BRIDGER UNDER ANONYMITY : "I recall a small nervous man. Unimpressive. I dismissed him as anyone I would care to be around. I never saw him with anyone, or even conversing with anyone."

SOUNDS LIKE HE HAD LITTLE CHANCE TO FORM AN OPINION OTHER THAN SUPERFICIALLY.

HOW CAN YOU RECONCILE THIS WITH PAT HALL'S STORY OF PLAYING WITH HER BROTHERS ON THE LAWN, BREAKING UP FIGHTS AND LECTURING THEM TO "NEVER HARM ANOTHER HUMAN BEING"

SLOUGH WAS RECALLING FLOYD DEGRAFFENREID THE SMALL 18 YR OLD 'NERVOUS' ROOMER.

WHEN ASKED ABOUT OSWALD'S ACCENT, THOUGH HUGH STATED EARLIER THAT OSWALD NEVER SPOKE TO ANYONE, YET SAID "OSWALD DID NOT HAVE ANY OUTSTANDING ACCENT."

HOW DOES ONE KNOW IF SOMEONE HAS AN ACCENT IF THEY ONLY OVERHEARD RUSSIAN TELEPHONE CALLS, EH COMRADE PAUL?

 

PAUL, IF YOU HAVE ANY ACTUAL EVIDENCE PLEASE PRESENT IT. SO FAR THIS IS BEEN A CHERRY PICKED REHASH.

PAUL WHERE IS HIS KEY?

WHERE IS A SINGLE RECEIPT PAUL?

SHOW US THE GUEST REGISTER PAUL SO WE CAN HAVE AN EDUCATED CONVERSATION AND SEE IF 'YOUR ROOMER' WITHOUT KEY OR RECEIPT IS IN THERE.

 

SO FAR YOU HAVE BEEN STUDYING A JUGGLING ACT. NOT EVERYONE CAN JUGLE PAUL, AND IM PRETTY SURE SOME CANT DESCRIBE IT OR BELIEVE IT WHEN THEY SEE IT.... DO THE BALLS REALLY CHANGE HANDS PAUL OR ARE THEY JUST TRYING TO TRICK YOU : - ?

TO SUMMARIZE;

DUNCAN THINKS FLOYD IS OSWALD.

FORD THINKS NO ONE IS OSWALD.

DUNCAN PROVIDES COINS FOR CALLS HIS OSWALD MAKES.

CALLS THE FBI CHECKS OUT WITH GENE ALLEN. CALLS ARE FROM HERBERT LEON LEE TO GENE'S NEICE PATRICIA BAKER. 

HUGH SLOUGH RECALLS A CARPENTER NAMED FLOYD. THIS IS OBVIOUSLY FLOYD DEGRAFFENREID, RIGHT PAUL?

BUT WAIT, FLOYD IS NOT WORKING IN CONSTRUCTION BUT AT AN AUTO PARTS STORE LATER SEARS!!!

OF NOTE, A PERSON WEARING "WHITE PANTS" IS NOT OSWALD BUT LIKELY JOHN CARTER A HOUSE PAINTER.

THIS SHOWS THE BLENDING OF MEMORIES OF AND BY HERBERT, FLOYD, CARTER AND SLOUGH... AND WRONGLY BEING RECALLED AS OSWALD. EXACTLY HOW BUS DRIVER MCWATTERS ID OSWALD AS THE BOY HE LATER FOUND OUT WAS MILTON JONES. OH BTW PAUL, I FOUND MILTON JONES. HE WAS SMALLER THAN OSWALD, AND ONLY IF YOU NEVER KNEW OR MET LEE HARVEY OSWALD YOU MIGHT THINK THEY ARE SIMILAR. THERE'S THE RUB PAUL.

NO ONE DESCRIBED OSWALD. 

DID THEY PAUL.

WHERE'S THE DESCRIPTION WITH SILVER BRACELET WITH LEE ON IT (AS THIS SHOULD BE SUPPORTIVE OF A MR. "LEE" STORY) 

WHERE IS THE DESCRIPTION OF MR. LEE WEARING A MARINE CORP RING OR ANY JEWELRY, THERE IS NONE BECAUSE IT WAS NOT OSWALD.

CHEERS, ED

 

PS.

PAUL, FIND THE SEA BAG AND SHOW IT IS NOT STENCILED "OSWALD" THEN WE CAN TALK.

 

The Avalanche Journal newspapers also bring up a man named 'Paul' a large bricklayer whom was the phantom roomer.

The portrayal is of a mobbed up dude, although how successful are you at either profession if you're living in the Johnson's basement.

His stay and unconfirmed disappearance are part of this story too. 

Also an Air Force serviceman, likewise unnamed. 

Was this Don Green and he worked at a bank and wore suits for that job? or was Insurance Salesman more likely Mr. Green?

One thing is clear the finger pointing of Oswalds by all these supposed witnesses is weak tea indeed. No proofs are ever supplied, just mistaken identities and stories. Bad stories. The available evidence, calls, records, reports, documents and study of the witnesses and their stories are we able to say with the utmost resonance: OSWALD DID NOT LIVE AT 1026 N. BECKLEY.
HERBERT LEON LEE DID.

Sept 30th ymca oswald
https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=10408#relPageId=486&tab=page

Steve Roe is seeing it backwards.
Peanut Gallery doesn't have a clue.
Pinning things on Oswald is not the same as evidence of Oswald living there.



Roe forgets Fritz claims a policeman in the hall gives him the address, but cannot name this man.

Why does Fritz say Oswald never did deny Beckley, if Oswald gave it straight away,... why even say that unless there was mention of an Beckley address (like on his po box app) which they pin 1026 N. Beckley on him and do not provide a lick of evidence Oswald resides there.
They suppressed the parts they wanted and paraded out parts of the notes to support their conclusions.
Much like Roe.
Roe and James are duped by the worst story the Warren Commission had.

Phone records show Oswald was not the tiny rooms renter.

Roe cant weasel out of the evidence. Its been answered, they just cannot accept it.
Cheers, Ed

The Parker Commission, eh...

Steve Fish-Eggs must have read this review of my book by journalist Ross Tarby which has the opening lines...

In this eye-opening biography of the alleged assassin, Australian JFK expert Greg Parker digs more deeply into Lee Oswald's background than the Warren Commission and the House Select Committee on Assassination combined!

Ed is right. "He never did deny it" is a "tell" that he did in fact deny it, or was simply never asked. Fritz's words anticipate a dispute about him living there, so those words are shoved into Oswald's mouth to preempt the question.

I mean, why would he deny it if he lived there? The evidence for it would be overwhelming wouldn't it, so what would be the point? 

But the evidence, far from being overwhelming, is exactly the opposite. As exquisitely teased out by Ed and others.

We would also not have at least four different stories about how the address was obtained. 

A lesson in spy-craft terminology for Steve... because these same methods can be used to help frame someone...

Backstopping
The extent and degree of protection given when using an alias, false documentation, phony address, or are employed in a "front". When there is little or no "backstopping", an alias is referred to as a "throwaway" - this type to be used only once or twice for a single purpose then discarded. Backstopping might include what is referred to in the trade as "pocket litter". Driver's license, library card, army papers etc. A phony address might be backstopped with phony receipts, utility accounts, or even say just the say-so of a landlord/lady. The extent of backstopping will determine how long the false name, address or business "front" will hold.

Is any "backstopping" of an address and the use of a "throwaway" alias and weird pocket litter discernible  in the life of Oswald?

Yes! But backstopped after the fact as a frame, not to provide cover for clandestine activities.

A hand-written scrap of paper, untested by any forensics?

OH Lee? Living in room 0? Sharing the same rooming house with H. Lee?

A late found bus ticket?

An American Bakeries pay slip linked to 214 Neely?

-------------
Against.... no production of any ledgers or the like...

Aynesworth's discovery of an ashtray and matches in the room... (maybe those pesky grand-kids smoked?)

Not a single mention of anyone wearing a USMC ring and a name bracelet...

No indication of how he did his laundry or where it was done...

None of these issues or other issues raised by Ed, would be with us if he had truly lived there. 

But do tell us how Fritz -- a man you admit to knowing deliberately sent an innocent man to the electric chair, was as honest as the day is long... even during daylight saving. Obviously Oswald was the liar. Fritz said so!

The ledger! Oh the Ledger. Where be the Ledger? No a scrap of paper. A copy no less of a scrap of paper from Gladys Johnson which was the only piece of evidence offered to the Warren Commission for which to prove Oswald did in fact live at Nth. Beckley. 

I have said to Ed this is an outstanding piece of detective work, research which is worthy of much praise.

NO ledger is a red flag in any man or woman's rational logical thinking mind.

It beggars belief it was not subpoenaed by the WC lawyers. And then any logical rational person would rightly ask why. 

Shenanigans!

Gary Taylor's story needs to be scrutinised. He was looking for Oswald on Beckley. The Cozi-Eight apartments.

Holme's version of the pulling of the PO Box application with the Beckley address on it from the files needs a good going over too.

The anagram of  the two address numbers is surely more than coincidence.


As curious as it gets. Coincidence?

Great posts!

Thanks Greg.
You and I are spot on as far as Steve Roe's bs goes.
Bart is nailing his ass to the cross for his claiming Oswald was shooting out the Depository window (though no one points this out at the time...shockingly)

I feel MICK deserves a medal too.
He just proved that both Oswald and Taylor counld not recall the Coz-I-Eight address... 3610, 1404...

What was at 1404 Mick?
looks like "1402, 1404, 1406, same 1 story"

This address list has my spider senses going off!

Cheers, Ed

Gary Taylor! My BS radar is in the red zone on this guy.

Driving about aimlessly looking for Oswald. Please! He mentions Cozi - Eight apartments - rabbit outta the hat? PO Box application and Taylor have the number of the address wrong! Got the Street name right. Got the number wrong.  Beckley - Cozi - Eight and Oswald! 

One of the all time great threads this. Bloody Brilliant.

Ah the notebook.

Looks like Ruth either gave Lee the numbers to check out for him and Marina, the tiny room may have been just a bit small though, both times... haha
So he tried Bledsoe's and did stay for a week and was out... and not due to being kicked out, that's some smoke Bledsoe blows after the fact.

No receipts are given.

No key is discussed.

Lee seems to be week to week and not a month to month tenant.

Also is the Edward Shields testimony and Mick Purdy's assertion that if Lee rode daily with Buell.

Where is Buell's polygraph that could support Buell or conversely Shields.... DPD made it go bye bye... not because Buell passed but because it interfered with the railroading of Oswald. 

I do find every single Beckley witness credible about the man they saw. They in fact proved that man could not be Oswald.

Odd not a single roomer can verify another roomer in six weeks!?!?

The calls... sink any chance for Steve Roe, BPete,or BJ James.

They are denier scum so this is just another Bus Ride Fantasy story via Warren Commission. Completely disproven yet still bandied about by fools like Roe.

Roe has notes, a note here, a note there. Do notes or numbers equate residency?

What were exactly the family sized apartments numbers and addresses Ruth Paine helped Oswald to locate??? 
Were they on Beckley?
Ruth needs to be put under a bare bulb, or simply asked "Where were these Apartments" and "How did she find them?" .... I suspect the numbers she gave Lee and wrote in her and Lee's notebook were to Bledsoe's and Johnson's.... but the Johnson's did not rent to Oswald. They rented to a Mr. Lee.

Cheers, Ed

Yes Ed, as they say timing is everything. The cops headed out to Ruths place as early as 2.20pm. Fritz had the Aitken slip of paper with the Irving address on it.

As soon as Fritz got to his office tell me he didn't send cops to that address immediately. Of course he did. How did Ruth know to expect the cops out at her address? Remember those words "we've been expecting you"
Phone call from Fritz? asking if Lee resided there? Ruth ever helpful - gives Fritzz the Beckley and  Marsalis numbers. Boom!!

Ruth needs to be put under a bare bulb, or simply asked "Where were these Apartments" and "How did she find them?" ..


Yep! Sure does. Along with Frazier. They're alive upright and breathing.

I dont think Lee walked or rode busses around till he saw a for rent sign.
Its more likely one would check the paper.
Make a call to verify location and availability....
Nope not our man.
He just grabs all his shit and knows he will find a place by golly....
I dont fn buy this story any more

How bout u.
Ed

So he walks from 1026 N. Beckley to Bledsoe's.....

WHY?

How did he know to walk ALL THAT WAY WITH ALL HIS SHIT and there would be a room available there...

I'm really not buying the story now,
... or the notebook phone numbers as anything but what Oswald and Ruth checked out

What is your take?

Cheers, Ed

Dang! Great thread.

Ed. Ledoux wrote:So he walks from 1026 N. Beckley to Bledsoe's.....

WHY?

How did he know to walk ALL THAT WAY WITH ALL HIS SHIT and there would be a room available there...

I'm really not buying the story now,
... or the notebook phone numbers as anything but what Oswald and Ruth checked out

What is your take?

Cheers, Ed

There is also this

https://reopenkennedycase.forumotion.net/t2113-oct-14-1963