Kharkiv is so lovely In October

First topic message reminder :

Thread for information regarding Marina and her vacation to Kharkov (Kharkiv) and any details about possible training to go to US.

Distance from Kharkiv to Vinnytsia and the Winniza Spy School was 458 miles, a 9 hr drive one way.
Of course the nice thing about Vinnytsia was an air base nearby, and a flight from Kharkiv to Bar was only an hour and a half.
(Drive takes route through Kyiv, largest city in Ukraine from Kharkiv, the second largest)

Also Marina's Aunt Polina and Uncle Yuri weren't even in Kharkiv when Marina arrives and are not to return for around a week. 
Some one is there to tend to Marina tho ... could be the trainers came to her???
This would be plenty of time for training her to help the CPSU in whatever was needed and Marina felt necessary too. Willing participants are better, and books like Epstein's are filled with family and friends pressuring her to stay and then leave Russia.
Playing her like a violin. 

What other trade craft schools were available in Kharkiv in 59-61?
There was a female school in East Germany, with its location as a spying base on West Germany/wall/embassy being close by.
Would there be any other female trade craft school in the Ukraine/Eastern Russia area?
Or was Winniza the school there. (Vinnytsia)

Leningrad had the KGB trade craft school, and of course Marina takes holiday there in a Rest Home on 1960.

In Kharkiv Marina vacations for:
A. Five Days
B. Three Weeks 
C. Nearly the whole month of October 61

To be continued;


Silver and gold engraved cups and all... of course not for vodka, but White Coke.
"White Coke - Wikipedia" https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Coke

SO...
It appears Marina sent money to Irina.
Was it because she owed her or just likes living in poverty herself... how about after Marina arrives in US she still sent "envelope" to the address

Marina is knowingly questioned about all of it and plays dumb.
The intell community knows what's happening here.
ITS PAYOFFS
Come on man

Interest in the RIF numbers has me looking for them and wondering about recent document releases.

Anything in them? (To be clear the 105-82555-3578 no. And associated numbers to it)

THY CUP RUNNETH OVER



The (unnamed) dated birthday gift would be given to Robert in December 1963.
Where was the CUP on November 22?
In a sea bag with the other items DPD "missed"?




HOLY GRAIL OF KHARKOV CUPS

'MOLOTOV' COCKTAIL







Cheers, Ed

Ed.Ledoux wrote:

I'll give you $5000 for it if you swear it was once owned by Boris Badenov as a gift from Natasha Fatale!

I swear Greg, those names were never mentioned, by my third cousins girlfriends aunt, at any time*

*(between Oct 8th and 21st 1961)

John Kedzie Jacob's has interesting job with America Illustrated - USIA.
He took a tour through Russia, Moscow and Kharkov in 1967.
Staying 4 days in Kharkov.
He also had an unexpected visitor in 1964,... Marina Oswald
An interesting visit no doubt.
What was discussed?
We aren't told here.

https://www.archives.gov/files/research/jfk/releases/2018/docid-32205608.pdf

CITRYNELL, HAROLD
Returning defector from KHARKIV / KHARKOV 1959

RICCIARDELLI, LIBERO (in article above)
He took his family and defected to KIEV.
Collection of his papers in Amsterdam library note:

Libero Ricciardelli (also called Lee or Rick), born in Needham, Massachusetts, 6 August 1917 and past away ca. 1999. Has lived in the USA until 1959 and moved to the Soviet Union during that same year with his wife Norma, daughter Lina and sons Paul and Steven. Lived in the Soviet Union until 1963, when Libero and his family went back to the USA. Married Norma Clauser in 1944, divorced in 1965. Married Vivian Bold in 1972, divorced four months later in 1973 and resulting in court cases that lasted until 1980. Married Katerina (Katka, Katya) Volkova in 1985, divorced in 1986. Because of all the court cases Libero got financially ruined and moved from the USA to Europe. He travelled through Greece, Egypt, France, Hungary, Portugal and Switzerland. He lived some years in France, Italy and former Czechoslovakia. He eventually settled in the United Kingdom, where he lived until at least 1998.

Documents relating to his military career and financial documents of his family's contractors' firm 1943-1947; correspondence and statements by Ricciardelli relating to the period that he moved from the USA to the Soviet Union, the period the family lived in Kiev and the problems to return to the US 1958-1963; juridical documents on the lawsuits Ricciardelli was involved in related to divorces and other cases 1944-1986; documents and correspondence on the period that Ricciardelli travelled through and lived in Europe 1980-1998.

Defector: Libero Ricciardelli
http://jfk.hood.edu/Collection/Weisberg%20Subject%20Index%20Files/W%20Disk/Webster%20Robert%20Edward/Item%2001.pdf

EXECUTIVE SESSION
27 Jan 1964

Mr. Rankin. Then in the period that they lived in Russia there are manifold problems about the fact that the way he lived, the additional income he received under the name of the Red Cross, you will remember, the question of when that income terminated. She said he had never been to Leningrad. He said he had, she went to Kharkov, and there is no explanation of any communications between the two of the during that period of time. There is a period when they were there that she indicated she was fearful of her marriage, and whether it was — it may not be maintained, ther[e] is no explanation of that in anything she has given in any of her

p.201

interviews.

The fact that he was paid proportionally so much more than she was when he was a workman in the factory and she was at least a semi-skilled person with her pharmacy knowledge, and all, is another problem that isn't covered by any of their testimony.

The fact that they moved to another apartment during the period that they were trying to arrange to come to the United States, which according to what their testimony — what she testified to, was going to be of relatively short time, that she would get an answer and it doesn't seem like there was any good reason for them to move to another apartment.

That is unexplained, and the members of her family are a curious thing. She was apparently a child with a father unknown at the child she was born, and yet she acquired a name of a father in some of the registrations under the Soviet system. Well, according to information we have it is very rare that they would insert anything like that or would allow it, because their controls are so carefully made to try to identify people all their life and particularly where they were born so they can trace down through for the rest of the period, and that is an unexplained feature.

Then the fact of her uncle and what his status was apprently[sic] a part of the Interior government and not a part of the Intelligence, but nevertheless he had a telephone, and the style in which they lived, and the partment[sic] and all were very unusual comparatively.

p.202

Sen. Russell. You mean while they were in Russia?

Mr. Rankin. Yes, I mean not only Oswald but this uncle, too, and it would appear that he was much more than just a person of the Interior government like she had said, from what we have been able to get from the CIA and others about it.

Then the fact she was allowed to leave the country the way she was is not adequately explained by her testimony, her statements or anything.

Why they did it so relatively promptly when that is a very difficult operation with most people, and what he did in Moscow when he went there, and was there for better than a month, and was there, and there's no explanation of what he did there.

Mr. Dulles. The beginning of his trip, you mean?

Mr. Rankin. Yes.

Mr. Dulles. When he tried to commit suicide?

Mr. Rankin. Yes. And then this period that he belonged to the gun club, and there is no explanation by her of that or what he did in that. He might have had all kinds of training during that period that is entirely unexplained.

The fact that they went to, when they came back, they went to Amsterdam and were there for, I think, it was two days before they went to Rotterdam to take a boat, and it is unexplained why they happened to go there and stay, and got a place to live, some little apartment, and what they were doing in the interim, that entire period is just full of possibilities for training, for

p.203

working with the Soviet, and its agents, and unusual compared with the experience of most Americans.

Now, you recognize it is going to be very difficult to get all of that out of her no matter how well informed we are about her, what she has testified to, what she has given statements about, and she has given a good many of them, and what her written statement in Russian is, all of those things will be — we have, and we examined them in great detail and are prepared on them, but whenever she gets to these areas that might be enlightening for us she is unable —

Sen. Russell. "Don't understand what you are talking about"?

Mr. Rankin. That is correct. Give us anything on it and just seems to come up to a blank.

We are trying to get sufficient material to try to get to persuade her to try to explain how these things were possible, and it is difficult to anticipate what she will do except she may just say she can't understand or she doesn't know, and that will be all we can get out of her.

Mr. Dulles. Has the letter gone forward to the State Department for the Russians?

Mr. Rankin. It hasn't, it isn't going forward yet because we have to ask them about that, and the CIA is going to help us develop the questions, and they have been working.

Mr. Dulles. I think we ought to get thatoff[sic] as soon as we can.

p.204

Mr. Rankin. Yes.

Mr. Dulles. If she has any chance to tell the Russian ambassador I don't know whether she will do it or not, she might after this interview, she might ask, get in touch in some way with the Russian embassy, they would be very anxious to get in touch with her. I guess the guard is such that they couldn't do that.

Mr. Rankin. Well, the Secret Service has been with her constantly and all. I don't know how much longer after we would take her testimony you would want that to continue.

Sen. Russell. What interpreter have you arranged to have?

Mr. Rankin. We have asked the "State Department to furnish one and they have said the would do so. And we also are going to have a man from the secret service here who has been talking to her and translated everything so we could be sure about anything she said we wouldn't have to rely on just one person.

Sen. Russell. There is a fellow here named Reuben Efrom who is one of the best that I ever saw.

Sen. Russell. Do you know him, Mr. Dulles?

Mr. Dulles. I don't think I do.

The Chairman. Senator, is he with the State Department?

Sen. Russell. No, sir.

Mr. McCloy. There is another fellow named Akelovsky who is a star. He may be over in Geneva. It is awfully important that you get a bilingual man

Commission believed there was ample training possibilities for Lee/Marina.
Rankin spelled them out in a most interesting exchange with Russell and Dulles.

The implications are there and Rankin points out them one by one but the eventual spin or paranoid psychosis is more focused on Lee.
Why?...
When Kharkov is so lovely in October.

Also in '59 is the supposed raping by soccer team (oy vey) and then Afghan diplomat (in Moscow?)
Was this in Kharkov and Irina was involved, or was Irina just knowledgeable (somehow) about it happening in Moscow....?

Seems the rapes are tied to Irina some way, yet Marina goes to Kharkov and is taken care of by IRINA?

Does this make sense?
Do I have this correct?

Thanks,
Ed

There is the Rest Home in Leningrad and the Printseva - Prizensev's whom Marina meets and writes names and addresses in her address book.

Printseva has a St. P / Leningrad address...

Prizentsev is a similar but different St. Petersburg/Leningrad address...

Am I missing something here

Were to believe the intelligence service couldn't locate Lev Printseva or was it Lev Prizentsev or even a third possibility or incantation of Printsev?
This in regards to Webster and Marina... are they sure they couldn't find Lev or Galina, but Vladimir Makarov seems to have the same telephone number as an A.A. PRINTSEV.



These names, addresses and that telephone number are beyond suspicion.
I was almost thinking the apartment building has a payphone or something but I digress....

Where is this Rest Home is where Marina meets and shares addresses with several Leningrad residents all somehow previously intertwined?

Is Rest Home the proper terminology for this place near Leningrad?
Resort or Spa sounds more appropriate but what do I know about Russian rest homes,,,

Wasn't Marina retrained into a factory type setting, filling prescriptions in a warehouse... which didn't last long (One day).

Was Lev a counselor or psychiatrist at the "Rest Home?"

Any thoughts

Head spinning...her nurse or a nurse at the home(?), the first meeting with Lee at the dance / slide show presentation, etc etc... all seem 'related' to the rest home, and that Telephone number is not going away..........

Switchboard must have been busy job.
...with Marina's calls alone.

The happenstance of another Prussakova is almost predictable at this point.

So A0-0036 is a large telephone exchange, and each extension is the individual number.

This explains some things.
Others not so much.

Back to the informant... no not Irina but Mrs Burt.
url=https://servimg.com/view/17602890/1629][/url]


Donald L. Burt passed away September 29, 2010. Born October 6, 1924, in Coldwater Kansas. Beloved husband and father. Survived by his wife of 65 years, Lydia Michailovitch, formerly of Kharkov, Ukraine; four daughters: Mary Else, Janet and her husband, Mike, Julie, and Diane; seven grandchildren; and 12 great grandchildren. Served his country 1943-1979, entering the army as a Private, serving initially in the European campaign of the Second World War. Awarded the Silver Star for personally eliminating a machine gun nest and three sniper positions with hand grenades and rifle fire, despite being wounded three times in the process, allowing his unit ("Easy" Company, 15th Infantry Regiment) to move forward in battle during the Colmar Pocket offensive. Also awarded the Bronze Star, Legion of Merit, three Purple Hearts, Combat Infantryman Badge, and numerous other awards. Rose through the enlisted ranks and was later commissioned. Served two tours in Vietnam. As a field officer, served as Commanding Officer of a Supply Battalion, Deputy Chief of Staff for Logistics for the Military District of Washington, and Post Commander of Cameron Station, Alexandria, VA. Was an active supporter of the VFW and Wounded Warrior Project, and Founding Member of the National Law Enforcement Museum. A devout Christian, he served a term as President of the local Northern Virginia chapter of Full Gospel Businessmen Fellowship International. Burial with full military honors will be held on January 14, 2011, at Arlington National Cemetery. [

Ed.Ledoux wrote:Wasn't Marina retrained into a factory type setting, filling prescriptions in a warehouse... which didn't last long (One day).

Was Lev a counselor or psychiatrist at the "Rest Home?"

Any thoughts

Possibly.

Of these three, the annual vacation was the most revolutionary contribution of Soviet socialism to promoting the welfare of its work force. Its labor code of 1922 stipulated that all workers with at least five-and-a-half months’ work tenure were entitled to an annual two-week vacation. And as early as 1920, Soviet leaders began to create a series of vacation institutions that would maximize the benefit of workers’ annual breaks from production and labor.

Rest homes and health resorts would become “workshops for the repair of toilers,” offering structured rest and medical therapies that would allow workers to recover their strength and energy for the
work year to come. The Soviet vacation did not provide an escape from the mobilization of citizens toward the common goal; from its beginning it was a continuation of that mobilization by other means. 

https://www.ucis.pitt.edu/nceeer/2008_822-06g_Koenker.pdf

Makes sense I suppose. R&R, rest and retraining.


Sending money to her relatives too makes more sense, and still doesn't explain Marina saying she does not know the names and postulates about their origins...why the subterfuge?


If you read Russian,
https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=6861#relPageId=5

I have to wonder if sending the letter is tantamount to telling the authorities in Russia the same story without the bare bulbs.
We know the mail will be opened read, copied, and placed in each person's file...and that's just the American intelligence

Shared a room with Galina at the rest home /resort.
She would be a person of interest to speak with.

Friends could not be believe Marina got an exit visa