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Mr. Oswald, going ... down? (TSBD elevators/Prayer Man) - Page 2 Empty Mr. Oswald, going ... down? (TSBD elevators/Prayer Man)

Tue 21 Feb 2023, 9:15 am
First topic message reminder :

This is about the use of elevators in the TSBD at the time of the assassination.

I'm 50 years old and have had a lifelong fascination with the JFK assassination, but was unaware that all the talk of "conspiracy" was anything more than nuttiness until I saw Oliver Stone's film in 1991. I've never had a moviegoing experience like that, before or since. It changed who I am. I've probably read 30 or 40 books on the topic in the 30+ years since.

I recently finished Stan Dane's Prayer Man, which brought me to this forum. While I find the case for PM to be LHO to be very compelling, it's probably ultimately impossible to prove. But the most interesting subject in that book, and which takes up most of the pages, is the evidence that the Second-Floor Lunchroom Encounter (2FLE) never happened, or rather that it was, in line with the Prayer Man theory, transplanted from the front steps of the TSBD.

It wasn't the first time I'd come across the theory that the 2FLE never happened (actually think I read that in DiEugenio's Reclaiming Parkland), but watching Sean Murphy put it together in that way, with the evolving and conflicting testimony forcing it to resolve in such a way, was far more impressive than the Prayer Man theory on its own, and in fact is sort of the backbone of PM.

But my question here is only tangentially related to the PM theory. You see, if there is any one piece of evidence that has always sealed Oswald as innocent in my eyes, it's the 2FLE. I remember reading Barry Ernest's book when it came out and thinking, "That's it. That seals it for me." I say this topic is tangential to the Prayer Man because the alleged 2FLE—convincingly revised in Prayer Man as a sort of best-we-can-possibly-do compromise to keep Oswald off the first floor of the TSBD at the time of the shooting (if not actually out front), only strengthens the case for Oswald's innocence in the JFK case. 

Thing is, the more I'd thought about it (prior to reading Prayer Man), there is a circular pattern here which turns this best evidence of Oswald's innocence back into a possible case for his guilt. And that is simply this: If Oswald could not have gotten down to the second floor, and certainly not the first, without encountering an ascending Truly and Baker, then no one else could have, either. Hence, if you believe there was an assassin on the sixth floor at all, it may as well have been Oswald as anyone else.

Which brings us to elevators.

My thought above was always based on two other factors, at least one of which I now know is not true.
1) No depository employee testified to witnessing the presence of any unknown persons in the building that day (with the exception of someone who was shown inside in the morning and then escorted out).
2) The elevators were not working AT ALL after the assassination. 

I'm not sure where I picked up the impression that the elevators did not function at all, or how I've held on to that for so long, but there it is. From reading Prayer Man, it's clear to me now that it wasn't so much a matter of the elevators not functioning as it was a matter of how they functioned. I.e., the west elevator could only be called remotely if the gate was closed, and the east elevator could only be operated manually from the inside (I believe this is correct).

So now my questions—

1) Why is it always assumed that Oswald, if he were the sixth floor assassin, came down the stairs? This presumption seems baked into the cake and is common to CTs and LNs alike. If there was even a slim chance of use of an elevator by Oswald, surely someone out there would have tried to make that case. If no one has, there must be an ironclad reason. I assume the explanation here is a simple one, but bear in mind I've never read the Warren Report. 

2) And now the real meat of my interest. Somewhere in the middle of Prayer Man, the author closes a very interesting discussion of elevators by declaring: "[T]he subject of the TSBD elevators relating to the assassination is very interesting and worth exploring further.' AND THEN DROPS THE TOPIC. 

Well yes! It is interesting! Tell me more!

As skillfully as Murphy builds his case, he drops what appear to me to be two bombshell assertions, with only a bit of evidence for one and none for the other: 1) Truly and Baker actually ascended in the west elevator and didn't take the stairs at all (evidence, such as there is, is tied to the revelation of the 2FLE incident as contrived), and 2) The assassin(s) got away in the east elevator.

To tie this all together, I've long wondered, if there was an active assassin on the sixth floor who wasn't Oswald, how he/they got out of the building. They must have done so very quickly indeed. When this is combined with the claim that no TSBD employee claimed to have seen any person in the building who was unknown to them that day, this "escape" must have involved a great deal of pre-planning and expedience.

To close on a related side-note, there are scenes in the 1991 film JFK, toward the end after Costner/Garrison says "So what really happened that day? Let's just for a moment speculate shall we ...," in which we see an entire TEAM of shooters and spotters get into position on the sixth floor. I mean, holy cow, they've got guns and binoculars and walkie-talkies! After the assassination there's a bit of dialogue in which one of them mutters, "We did it, buddy, now let's get out of here." Now, though I am a huge fan of the film, if it is true that no one in the depository saw anyone unknown to them in the building that day, then that dramatization feels comically absurd.

Finally, I understand that there was actually a third elevator in the building, toward the front. I believe it's on the first floor but I'm unaware of how many floors it goes up. All the way to the top? Haven't seen much discussion of this one.

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Mr. Oswald, going ... down? (TSBD elevators/Prayer Man) - Page 2 Empty Re: Mr. Oswald, going ... down? (TSBD elevators/Prayer Man)

Mon 20 Mar 2023, 3:31 am
Thanks to Malcolm Blunt. Scans by me.

The mystery of the west elevator

Analysis of the TSBD Elevators

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