Did Oswald deny living at 1026 N Beckley?

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Did Oswald deny living at 1026 N Beckley?





Greg
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Posts: 2049

According to Jim Leavelle he did. Casting his mind back 50 years once more, Jim recalls how Oswald began to spin lies during his interviews. “He gave me a phoney address,” he says. “And even though we had so many witnesses he denied any involvement in the murder of Tippit – but that was all about him setting up his alibi.”   http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/real-life-stories/james-leavelle-arrested-jfk-assassin-2711431 Let me state at the outset that I think Leavelle is full of shit - even if he is a good ol' Texas boy wearing a friggin Stetson (yes I hear it all the time. So and so is telling the truth... he's a good old-fashioned Texan, straight as an arrow). Leavelle claimed in this interview that he inerrogated Oswald prior to handing him over to Fritz. But there is not a skerrick of support for that. Nothing. Yet it is more than possible that Oswald denied living at 1026 N. Beckley. I mean, that's just one question - hardly an interrogation.  And tho Leavelle bats it aside as part of Oswald's devious scheme to have an alibi for Tippit (hey, I wasn't in that area - I live at_____________) what if it was the truth?

-- http://gregparke4.wix.com/gregrparker December 26, 2015 at 4:26 AM

Mick,

From Roberts' affidavit that you posted:


If he waiting for the bus, he'd be going the wrong way to get to the Theater wouldn't he?

Steve Thomas

But you'd be at the right stop to go downtown and hang around the President's shooting scene.

And that is exactly where Herbert Leon Lee calls his girlfriend from a couple hours after the assassination.

Cheers,
Ed

PS Earlene doesn't ask him about a cop killing

Steve Thomas wrote:Mick,

From Roberts' affidavit that you posted:


If he waiting for the bus, he'd be going the wrong way to get to the Theater wouldn't he?

Steve Thomas

Correct!

Sometimes the truth just stands there out by the street!

I found David Joseph's post and the diagram suddenly looked familiar.
Just a possibility but when I compare a rough sketch in the address book vs Beckley I am amazed the similarity



Screen porch in front, two rooms on left side, kitchen in back on left side, door in back on right side \ right side is unknown mostly due to not being allowed in the rooms or they were locked (see x's), a doorway to the right from the left where a bathroom is at Beckley... are matches.

Weird huh? Diagram if as Martin Shakleford contends repeatedly its just a rough sketch so it doesn't show the bathtub in the kitchen (though there was one in the kitchen at Judy's place) so I find it difficult to defend it being so "rough" that a TUB in a place so obviously out of place and possible to run into in the midst of retrieving a secret journal and microscope might run into in the dark.... why include the kitchen counter details, lights and other superfluous details but not a huge cast iron tub in the middle of a room?? 

So this diagram is supposedly a place Judyth Baker stayed... yeah that's it.

looks like a diagram of the tiny room Lee looked at and passed up. 
Was it to show Marina? Or perhaps whom steered him to the rooming houses, ... Ruth?
 
Cheers,
Ed

According to Patricia Puckett-Hall, the grand-daughter of Gladys Johnson, there were 18 rooms at 1026 North Beckley and all of them were filled at the time of the assassination.  I've only ever seen a partial list, which includes the name of Herbert Lee.  Does anyone know who the others were? 
This interview of Pat Puckett-Hall is quite informative.  She refers to Oswald as "Mr. Lee", which could ostensibly be referring to Herbert Leon Lee.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bj3RsTcgGOU

Phil Hopley wrote:According to Patricia Puckett-Hall, the grand-daughter of Gladys Johnson, there were 18 rooms at 1026 North Beckley and all of them were filled at the time of the assassination.  I've only ever seen a partial list, which includes the name of Herbert Lee.  Does anyone know who the others were? 
This interview of Pat Puckett-Hall is quite informative.  She refers to Oswald as "Mr. Lee", which could ostensibly be referring to Herbert Leon Lee.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bj3RsTcgGOU

Phil, she was 11 years old and is trying to recall minute detail.

Her grandfather testified that they had 17 bedrooms but could not recall if they were all filled.

Maybe someone can have a go at explaining that part of his testimony.

Mr. JOHNSON. Well, they wanted to see the rooms. They had described his age, his build, and so forth, and we had two more boys rooming there. Uh-- and my wife was going to let them see the rooms.
Mr. BELIN. Your wife was going to let them see the rooms that you had--and you had a total of 17 roomers, I believe you said?
Mr. JOHNSON. Well, no. I don't know just how many roomers we had. We have 17 bedrooms--but I don't know just, at that time, how many roomers we had.
But, anyway, we had a couple of boys around his age that had moved in just a few days before, and, so, she was going to let them see their rooms.
Mr. BELIN. All right. And then what happened?
Mr. JOHNSON. Well, I saw his picture on television and I hollered at them and told them. They were out in the back, started around the house to the--uh--basement where these boys room. The bedrooms are all in the basement. And they were going back there.
And--uh--I just called them and told them, I said, "Why, it's this fellow that lives in here."


So according to AC Johnson, the cops gave a description of Oswald -- but that does NOT bring to mind the CURRENT resident of the tiny room. It brings to mind two similar generic-looking young white males who had basement rooms but had moved out a few days before!

Then he sees a photo of Oswald on TV well before such a photo was ever shown - and bingo! He suddenly realizes it's the dude in the little room. 

More TOTAL and UTTER BS.

The two who had left? James Watson was probably one and Herbert Lee the other.

There were two who others miss-remembered as Oswald. Herbert Lee was one and Floyd Degraffenreid was the other. 

I think what happened was this: James Watson rented room 17 or 18 per his FBI interview. This looks like it was in the basement.

Herbert Lee initially rented the "little room" aka "room 0". He was later offered a larger room and and took it - in the basement. My best guess is that Floyd then took over Room 0.

I base the above on the following facts:

1. Gladys Johnson testified that she offered "Mr Lee" a larger room as soon as one became available but he declined when one was offered (she had to say this because the story needs "Mr Lee" to remain in Room 0)

2. Gladys would later tell reporters that "Mr Lee" liked reading Westerns. This was definitely Floyd as there is an FBI report describing him as always wearing a cowboy hat. His FB page shows he still wears one - and more importantly - the only book he lists is - a cowboy book!

So Oswald becomes a mish-mash of memories of the two young men who previously occupied the "tiny room". 

You might wonder why AC Johnson does not think of Floyd after hearing the Oswald description. But Floyd was actually noticeably shorter than Oswald. The story, as I said, that he saw a photo of Oswald on TV and was able to place him in Room 0 was totally made up after the fact. All they found in that room was cowboy books, an ashtray and whatever else Floyd owned. Who knows? Maybe there WAS a holster in there? But if so, it belonged to the cowboy.

Speaking of utter nonsense.

Mr. JOHNSON. Well, no. I don't know just how many roomers we had. We have 17 bedrooms--but I don't know just, at that time, how many roomers we had.

So how on earth did he know who had just rented.
Let alone the tiny room's renter or if the room was even occupied.
Room 0 or O has still not been determined.
Tiny room certainly was not called room O or Zero when park service checked the rooms and their enumeration. Its odd Earlene would know with her slip of paper exactly that rooms tenancy but AC Johnson is clueless.
His and Gladys testimony were a few minutes apart, and he sat in on hers(?) thus could have gone to Beckley grabbed the register Gladys conveniently forgot and testified more aware of the information requested.
But no, couldn't have that register or a page from it entered into evidence nor any history of occupants, rents, and occupancy.
Cat meet bag.
Ed

I havent read all the replies, but Oswald most certainly never lived there. He used on his PO Box aplication 3160 N Beckley.

Yep
Mick Purdy has an excellent idea that was a mistake for Coz-i-eight address of 1306 N Beckley

More info,

"Oswald had been using Dallas post office box 2915 for his mail, but there does exist a change of address form dated March 6, 1963, switching from Elsbeth to West Neely. The envelope containing Marina’s first letter to Ruth Paine (with the map of the new address), did had a return address: 214 Neely St., postmarked March 8 (CE404-A)."

** The FBI’s Hosty obtained the Neely address on March 11 from a source at the Dallas Post Office.**

"Gary Taylor said his source was the Elsbeth Street landlords. Oswald’s change-of-address form sent from New Orleans on May 12, 1963 lists his old address as P.O. Box 2915 (CE794)."

And

"10  Coz-I-Eight Apartments 1306 North Beckley; 604 Elsbeth; 214 West Neely; 621 North Marsalis (the Bledsoe rooming house); 1026 North Beckley. see The Cozy Eight Apartments (R.F. Gallagher, The Fourth Decade, Volume 5 Number 1). During a March 3, 1964 FBI-led tour through the neighborhood, Marina Oswald had the rooming house at 1026 North Beckley pointed out at her request. She stated “she had often seen this house because it was situated near a bus stop which she and her husband had used” (CE1838). Lake Cliff Park, mentioned in Marina’s testimony several times, also by Ruth Paine, is within walking distance of these addresses. Oswald’s denouement on 11/22/63, from the North Beckley rooming house to the Texas Theater, played out, for him, on very familiar turf."

Hmmm,
Why would the Oswald's use the bus stop in front of Beckley rooming house???
Its not convenient to any of the addresses they occupied. Especially with children in tow.

And is there any doubt a postal informant informed on Oswald when he opens that new po box.
And any delay informing police is bogus. Again it is not necessarily Holmes dialing police immediately.
Cheers, Ed

Ed,

I was staggered by CE 1838.
In March, 1964, she re-traces a route she and Oswald had taken in March, 1963 when "Oswald took his rifle wrapped in a raincoat".

Not a month earlier, in February, 1964, Marina had told the WC that,

WC testimony of Marina Oswald February 3, 1964
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/oswald_m1.htm


"Mr. RANKIN. Did you ever observe your husband taking the rifle away from the apartment on Neely Street?
Mrs. OSWALD. Now, I think that he probably did sometimes, but I never did see it. You must understand that sometimes I would be in the kitchen and he would be in his room downstairs, and he would say bye-bye, I will be hack soon, and he may have taken it. He probably did. Perhaps he purely waited for an occasion when he could take it away without my seeing it."

For a number of reasons, I believe that it was Marina who ordered the rifle.

Steve Thomas

oswald never owned a rifle or the .38 and his PO box was in another building. These kind of things were exposed like a decade ago. i dont understand wh they are still discussed. Anyone who sticks to the Oswald did it theory either has suffered traumatic brain injury, rode the short bus to school, is too lazy to open a book, or works for the CIA like McAdams and Mary & Buck Ferrell.

Thanks to Malcolm Blunt.

Dowling proved it was not Lee.
FBI asked Roy Truly and Roy said Lee was at work Wednesday November 20 at 10am.

Dowling may have been sympathetic to Tippit as a regular, known customer, and allowed herself to finger Lee when it was not and could not be Lee cursing a stack of pancakes.

Cheers, Ed

Nice doc Bart!
Slow Steve Roe wouldn't know how to read it though... do you have a braille version handy for him?
Thanks, Ed

She is telling tall stories again...
This is a PAThetic HALLmark moment!

How or why number a room or a side porch, THAT WASNT RENTED OUT, as #3. All her Grandmas plants were in there...it was kids play room etc.
(not a library though...)

Lets say you have a packet of numerals you are going to number rooms for renters identification, rooms #1-10, leaving out the #0.
(Which is the number you would have left to later use to number the tiny room.)

But one thing she cant show is a number 3 above that door...as she says, other doors have their numbers. (old survey says the back rooms still had 3,4 had been removed but the outline of where those numbers were could still be seen!
Pat wont allow the Tours of back porch or downstairs. She'd need to hide all the evidence of this. It'd be a task for sure!
Suppose there isnt a single receipt for him.... or Leon down there in the dusty basement with all the other evidence. (or Non-evidence)
Not a single renter has a correct memory of Oswald at Beckley. They do recall Floyd DeGraffenried whom read Westerns, drank, went to Mexico, wore Western clothes...was small like Oswald and 'might' be mistaken for Oswald (if you didnt really know either)
Pat Hall, like Grandma, wont ever show "Mr Leon Lee's receipt, or any receipt of the era,
nor any guest books!
Roomer named 'Dan'(?) lived there for life!
But he never knew a thing about any Oswald living there.
Of course Pat avoids telling us a thing about HERBERT LEON LEE.
No surprise because everything she says IS about HERBERT LEON LEE
No key to lock up the room and pistola...even though There Were Locks on tiny room etc.
So not THEE genuine story.
Proof is in the pudding, 
SURVEY SAYS:


"The basement contains 5 rooms, No. 5-10, each with its metal number and with the last city inspection notice taped to the door."

Wait a minute... if Pat says 1 2 3 4 & 5 are upstairs then Downstairs must begin 6 7 8 9 10, but historical survey DISAGREES with Pat Hall.
5-10 are downstairs.

If there were only rooms 1-4 for rent upstairs then there must be 5-10 downstairs as survey says.
They later numbered the tiny room, but sorry Pat room 3 was already numbered and it was in the back of house, where the back porch is now, next to #4.
Rooms 3 and 4 are no longer there. Removed for some reason...hmm
Please chime in your thoughts on room #s and Pats memory hole.

Then please re-read, or listen to my essay.
Ive been two steps ahead of this woman since day one.

Seems Grandma' excuse for LEE HARVEY OSWALD signing in as or being interviewed and given a through and through by Grandma wasnt so thorough
if she thought his name was O.H. Lee.

Seems the only people whom can ascribe Lee as Oswald have a financial interest in telling "A Story" not "The Story."
Her charade is flimsy and unsupported
CHEERS!
Ed

PS.
Pat is trying to use the Historic Survey's numbering of upstairs rooms (which were not all there) to say #3 is how it was labeled in 1963.
HA!

Ed,

This is one of the best threads I've seen on any JFK forum - Period. An outstanding effort. 
Are you able to supply a link to your essay here?

Cheers Mick

Not a worry Mick!
I quite enjoyed producing the works.
I love how everything from Beckley needed huge grains of salt.
Nothing was as described.

Read:
https://reopenkennedycase.forumotion.net/t2127-the-beckley-bunch

Listen:
https://www.spreaker.com/user/thelonegunman/ep-161-the-beckley-bunch-w-ed-ledoux

Watch the fallout:
https://educationforum.ipbhost.com/topic/26290-the-beckley-bunch/

Beckley tales were a valiant effort to steer the observer away from asking questions about where Lee resided in Dallas.

Cheers,
Ed

PS Pat says Female renters used first room/s #1&2 which have same doors as tiny room 0.
Did these woman feel safe in an unlocked house in an unlockable room... but the men are behind TWO locked doors??

Oh BTW Pat should really study her own evidence more carefully.
Exhibit 3:
Receipt for ROOM 0

Ask Pat Hall why her Grandmother decorated the room, for CBS(?), with ANOTHER CURTAIN on a blank wall, with no window! 

Cheers!
Ed

It is now basically a tourist attraction. If she were to say that Oswald never lived there her business will collapse. The JFK case has become a nice cottage industry for many.

She might have to work for a living and give up the carnival sideshow.... nah Judy gave her advice.

Quote:
“My grandmother screened her tenants and checked their belongings when they moved in, and he did not have a gun,” she says. “But he was quiet and paid on time, so she had no reason to inspect his property after that.”

He was late once. So that was an opportunity to inspect.
Gladys was a wise woman....and yet historically speaking she didnt get LEE HARVEY OSWALD'S name correct? Not in six weeks? Really... and all guests and everyone at Beckley just knew him too wrongly as Mr Lee???
So Oswald then began introducing HIMSELF as Mr O.H. Lee? Or just Mr O?
Nah
No one called the roomer Mr. Oswald, Mr Harvey nor
O.H.
That southern slave term for a master just doesnt fly.
Mr Lee my arse.
Mr Herbert Lee more like it.
Mr Lee was a respectful use of Herberts last name.
Mr Lee was in ROOM 0 per receipt.

Gladys took the roomer in, and searched his stuff.
Glady's search of belongings and cleaning of the room by her and Earlene never once produces a scrap of paper with OSWALDS name on it?
Amazing how tidy Lee was no never leave out a single piece of mail etc.. no trash???
(landlords etc search through trash to find use of alcohol drugs etc to evict)
There was no Oswald at Beckley.

Receipt books vs Guest Register
So Gladys ripped out every page of people she owed money to.
Guess she owed Mr Lee some rent money back.
So there ARE pages of receipts of money owed to Gladys.
PRODUCE THEM PAT!
or would JFK RECORDS ACT APPLY HERE?
Can someone turn Simpich on to this!

I feel those records should have been collected since they were 'used' in the proceedings to place OH Lee there.
Along with calendar page from Bledsoe and the
NBC films.

THEY CAN KEEP THE FN COPIES.
Ed