Buell Wesley Frazier: "Where’s your Rider?" Part A

First topic message reminder :

This is full rebuild of the hugely popular thread created by Mick Purdy at the Webs forum in February 2015. – Stan

Mick Purdy

I believe Buell Wesley Frazier lied about seeing Lee Oswald with a package, a package two feet long on the morning of Friday November 22nd 1963.

I believe Linnie Mae Randle lied about seeing Oswald with a package, a package 27 inches long on the Morning of 22nd Nov 1963.

I believe both Linnie Mae Randle and Buell Wesley Frazier fabricated the curtain rod story.

I think there is ample evidence in their WC testimonies, affidavits and FBI interviews to support each of these contentions.

I have also come to the conclusion (after having a closer look at the testimonies and the various reports), that Buell Wesley Frazier lied about another crucially important matter that day. In my opinion the totality of the evidence suggests Frazier lied with regards to driving Lee Harvey Oswald to work that fateful morning.

Take a moment to reflect upon the importance of that drive to the case against Oswald before reading on.

The story was very likely fabricated not merely to have Oswald appear to carry a sack into work – but also to create the illusion of Oswald carrying a rifle. This conclusion is drawn from a study of the WC testimonies of both Randle and Frazier regarding Oswald, the package and his alleged arrival at the Randle residence that morning. Ten or more neighbours considered to be best placed to spot pedestrian movement in the vicinity were interviewed by the FBI as to whether they saw Oswald carrying a package from the Paine’s home to the Randle home. To a person, they stated they had not seen Oswald that morning – with or without any suspicious package which the police on more than one occasion, described as being similar in size and shape to a rifle case.

Frazier’s WC and Shaw trial testimony regarding the journey into work with Oswald appears rehearsed. Any questions relating to the “sack” or what was said in the car on the way in is met with what sounds very much like scripted answers that have become Frazier’s Lore. The sack, the curtain rods, the weather, and my favourite, Oswald’s kids, are IMO all part of the charade. Away from the small talk and banter about kids, he constantly flip flopped on testimony in a manner redolent with patterns of deceit.

Frazier’s WC testimony with regard to his arrival at work is at complete odds with the HSCA interview of Edward Shields. Though it could be argued Shields, unlike Frazier, was not under oath, and therefore is a witness of lesser value, the fact is that Shields was as close as you can get to a disinterested party merely reporting for the first what he had heard. Sadly, it took well over a decade for him to receive any relevant questions. In any event, it is highly unlikely he ever realized the import of his information.
  
From the HSCA interview of Shields
 

SHIELDS: I think Charles Givens hollered out there and asked Frazier where was his rider and he told him: "I dropped him off at the building." Yeah, that was it...Well, I was down on the floor when they hollered out and said and the answer he gave them, I don't know, I think he said: "I dropped him off at the building." Now, whoever it was hollering asked him, I don't know.
DAY: This is the morning of the assassination?
SHIELDS: Mm-hmm.
DAY: Somebody hollered out the window and say: "Where is your rider?" And to your recollection, Frazier says, "I dropped him off at the building."
SHIELDS: Yes.
DAY: Alright. The day of the assassination, did you see Oswald come to work with Frazier?
SHIELDS: No I didn’t.

 
To summarize what we have so far… no one claimed to see Lee Harvey Oswald walk to the Frazier residence that morning. No one claimed to see Lee Harvey Oswald in Frazier’s car that morning – except Frazier himself. No one saw Lee Harvey Oswald that morning with any package except Wes and Linnie Mae.

Frazier also testified that he let Oswald get well ahead on the walk from the car park to the loading dock entrance. But in the form of Edward Shields, we have a potential reason for Frazier to construct that story.

In the above two short paragraphs alone, we have three “firsts” – firsts that are needed for the official story to hold. Oswald had never walked to the Randle residence for his lift before. He was always picked up at the Paine house. Oswald had never taken a long package to work before. Oswald had never neglected to take a packed lunch before. Oswald had never even needed a lift on a Friday morning before. Frazier had never let Oswald walk ahead of him from the car park before. They had always walked in together. That is a lot of “firsts” – all reliant on a very tight little knit of witnesses outside of which, no corroboration exists. Nobody else, not one person can verify Frazier’s version of events in Irving except for his sister. At the other end of the journey at the TSBD parking lot, we rely solely on Frazier. It beggars belief that there are no other witnesses. That walk was at least 2 and 1/2 blocks long. Shields and Givens smash his fairy-tale apart.

This “story” IMO has the same stench wafting around it, like the rest of the days fables contain.

The bus trip, the cab ride, the sack, the run, the walk, the ducking, the escape, the 2nd floor, the first floor, the sixth floor, the lunch bag, the rifle case, the back seat, the front seat, the white jacket the grey jacket, the gun, the revolver ……………
 
An alternative scenario

Postal Inspectors interviewed Mr and Mrs CP Schneider at 2707 West Fifth St in the early evening of November 22. Mr Schneider confirmed he had seen Lee Oswald in front of the 2515 residence at approximately 6:00pm of the previous evening. He also stated that a neighbour, Mrs Ed Roberts of 2519 West Fifth St had told him that Willie Randle, 2439 West Fifth St, had driven Oswald to work on the morning of November 22, and that Oswald was carrying a package large enough to have contained a rifle. (CD 296)

What sort of investigation is it that receives hearsay evidence such as the above and fails to follow up to confirm or refute it with the parties involved? WE are indeed, expected to believe that no follow up was done, because there is no evidence any follow up was done. Yet, there is actually circumstantial evidence that the authorities did believe that Randle was the man who gave the lift because that same night, the FBI was attempting to trace the origins of the scope in the names of Lee Oswald OR Willie Randall [sic]. (CD 87) It is virtually impossible to believe that the FBI would act on hearsay alone, when a few houses from where the hearsay was received, lived the person who had passed on that hearsay. You would almost have to believe that this “Willie Randle” lead was followed up and that it checked out given the ease with which such a lead could be checked out. To further complicate matters, the DPD already had Oswald’s alleged driver in custody. If Frazier truly was the driver, there would no reason at all to be checking on “Willy Randle/Randall” as a co-conspirator!

Randle had arrived in Austin at about 7:00pm on what was said to be work-related business in company with co-worker named Berry Caster. (FBI 105-82555 Oswald HQ File, Section 32, p44) It is between a 3 and 4 hour drive from Irving to Austin, so it is far from impossible that “Willie” drove Lee to work that morning on the basis that Frazier had already left.

Because of the holes in the official investigation, some conjecture is needed if we are to try understand the mess we have been left. What follows is some of my conjecture.

Frazier left that morning on his own – with the throwdown M-C rifle. The call from Givens of “where’s your rider?” was code giving Frazier the all clear to bring “the package” in, or was code for simply it’s clear to come inside.

Since Lee had missed his ride, Willie Randle offered to give him one, but needed to borrow Ruth’s car since his own was full of work gear for the trip to Austin later on. This leads to Oswald’s statement in front of Roger Craig concerning Craig’s description of a certain station wagon that "That station wagon belongs to Mrs. Paine. Don't try to tie her into this. She had nothing to do with it."

Doesn’t that sound like someone talking about a car that was being driven by someone else?

I’d like to thank Greg Parker for his enormous support and encouragement.

Terry Martin

Yes, I find that generally speaking, people who have nothing to say have something to hide.

Colin Crow

A thought for another project. See if Frazier can be persuaded to identify Jack Dougherty.

Stan Dane wrote:Colin Crow

A thought for another project. See if Frazier can be persuaded to identify Jack Dougherty.

Mick Purdy

Excellent thought!
Some of these names just keep coming up over and over....
There was a great slogan in Oz many decades ago used in a successful political campaign.....

Stan Dane wrote:Ed Ledoux

OBTW, I called Marvin Randle and he did not care to give an interview. 

Mick Purdy

Nice try anyways.....
Ahhhh! Jack and Wes.
Two likely candidates if ever I've seen a pair.
The Jack and Wes Show....has a good ring to it.

Stan Dane wrote:Terry Martin

Yes, I find that generally speaking, people who have nothing to say have something to hide.

Mick Purdy

Yes Terry, very good observation.
I see that in Wes, flaps his gums an awful lot but says absolutely nothing, and I'll wager he's got plenty to hide.

Mick Purdy

Mick Purdy wrote:Q: Did Jack Dougherty "open up" in the mornings as part of his "extra chores"?
 
Q: And if so would this have meant he had access to the buildings keys outside of normal business hours?

 
Are there answers to these questions?
I suppose not....

Worth a thought don't you think?

Stan Dane wrote:

Stan Dane wrote:Ed Ledoux

OBTW, I called Marvin Randle and he did not care to give an interview. 

Greg Parker

That is in no way shape or form, any surprise whatsoever.

Linnie and Willie never gave interviews either - not to anyone snooping around a conspiracy, anyway.

Ed Ledoux

As I always do, I spent time researching Marvin and had many questions not related to JFK.
I said I wanted to do an interview and he said to take me off the list.
I explained I was writing an news article and I had no list.
He said he did not care to do an interview.
He was on his cellular so I asked to contact him at his land line.
He did not wish to give any interviews.
Again I was very pleasant and simply was requesting to do a news interview for the Lancer, he still did not wish to grant an interview.
So I thanked him anyway...

I sent an Email saying I will go ahead without his input and if he would like he can contact me.

Ed Ledoux
 
Again nothing was said about JFK, OSWALD or BILL
Just that I was doing a news article for online publication.
I was ready to ask about his plans for running for Mayor again...
 
PS: He has another business. It is custom homes.
David runs the counter top shop. I may try talking to David to see if he can get Marvin to talk with me.
 
I don't want to harass anyone whom doesn't want to speak to me.
Althought an ad in the Irving paper naming Bill, Marvin and Buell would get their attention.
How about this headline
"QUESTIONS SURROUND WILLIAM RANDLE AND LEE HARVEY OSWALD, MARVIN RANDLE REFUSED AN INTERVIEW TO CLEAR UP THESE QUESTIONS."
 
You listening Buell?

You better call Marvin and your handlers!

Stan Dane wrote:Mick Purdy

Mick Purdy wrote:Q: Did Jack Dougherty "open up" in the mornings as part of his "extra chores"?
 
Q: And if so would this have meant he had access to the buildings keys outside of normal business hours?

 
Are there answers to these questions?
I suppose not....

Worth a thought don't you think?

Ed Ledoux


JD did open the TSBD at 7 am.

JD did often have to go to the TSBD after hours due to the water system pressure alarm.
When was the last alarm received that JD had to go to the TSBD?

Interesting that this job was left to a guy who had to catch a bus to get there...

Stan Dane wrote:Mick Purdy

Mick Purdy wrote:Q: Did Jack Dougherty "open up" in the mornings as part of his "extra chores"?
 
Q: And if so would this have meant he had access to the buildings keys outside of normal business hours?

 
Are there answers to these questions?
I suppose not....

Worth a thought don't you think?

Ed Ledoux

JD did open the TSBD at 7 am.

JD did often have to go to the TSBD after hours due to the water system pressure alarm.
When was the last alarm received that JD had to go to the TSBD?

Interesting that this job was left to a guy who had to catch a bus to get there... 

Stan Dane wrote:Mick Purdy

Mick Purdy wrote:Q: Did Jack Dougherty "open up" in the mornings as part of his "extra chores"?
 
Q: And if so would this have meant he had access to the buildings keys outside of normal business hours?

 
Are there answers to these questions?
I suppose not....

Worth a thought don't you think?

Colin Crow

Jack got to work at 7 and had to check the gauges.....I assume they were inside the building, so yes he had access "after hours".

Logical to leave the retarded guy with safety checks, no problem there.....

Mick Purdy

One would assume in the blind rush to nail Oswald for the crime of the century, that the DPD, FBI, and secret service would have scoured the earth for hard evidence to convict the little commie bastard. Especially when it came to the conveyance of his person and the rifle inside the sack on that fateful Friday morning. I mean, they surely would've spoken with multitudes of people whom might have witnessed Oswald that morning carrying a large paper sack with a rifle hidden inside.

From the moment Oswald awoke to the final climatic moment of his momentous entrance into the TSBD paper sack, rifle and all!!  

Don't you think those same authorities if they had witnesses to Oswald's treasonous journey into work with the weapon hidden in that bag, would not their sworn recorded utterances be rammed down our throats so hard that they would appear where the sun don't shine. That record if it had been collected would've been shouted from the highest rooftops for all the world to hear.

But no, we have at our disposal as evidence for placing that rifle inside the TSBD and what should have been one of the most crucial pieces to the puzzle on that day regarding Oswald's journey into work and the sack with the rifle are just TWO witnesses, brother and sister. Buell Wesley Frazier and Linnie Mae Randle. Nobody else. Not a soul, no-one, squat, zip, naught, absolutely zero.
We have not one other person who we know of who saw Oswald that morning with a sack. We have no other person who saw Oswald with Wesley, we have no other person who was witness to Lee being driven by Buell into work, we have no other person whom saw Oswald walking through the TSBD carpark.

We do have Wes and Linnie. And their stories are a crock of shit.

Thank you Earl Warren; your legacy lives on.

Stan Dane wrote:

Stan Dane wrote:Mick Purdy

Mick Purdy wrote:Q: Did Jack Dougherty "open up" in the mornings as part of his "extra chores"?
 
Q: And if so would this have meant he had access to the buildings keys outside of normal business hours?

 
Are there answers to these questions?
I suppose not....

Worth a thought don't you think?

Colin Crow

Jack got to work at 7 and had to check the gauges.....I assume they were inside the building, so yes he had access "after hours".

Logical to leave the retarded guy with safety checks, no problem there.....

Mick Purdy

Extremely logical, I wonder how close he was to Wesley, seeing how friendly Wes was and all.
Wes knew how to break down a rifle too.
Wes was keen on the basement just as Jack was.
They both liked the basement.

Terry Martin

I think you have pretty much established the fact that this pair were the lone wielders of the paper bag, rifle transport, "curtain rod" story, as we can find no other fount for this line of wisdom.

The question I have is WHY. Were they simply coerced by others to create the tale? Probably not, I believe the story appeared in the narrative much sooner than the fabled second floor encounter.

So this little biscuit must have been to cover up something they were already involved in and they perjured themselves, apparently hoping to through their neighbor under the bus and save themselves and undue suspicion.

But what were they up to? Were they complicit in the assassination? (Hey, if I were going to kill a President, I would not want a 19 yr old kid running any major portion of the program, would you?) Or were they involved in something else and merely coerced into aiding and abetting the cover-up?

And I wonder if Buell knew about the assassination before hand or did he merely panic after the fact and run from the TSBD like a sceered lil wabbit. Y'know, like Ozzie was supposed to.

I'm rambling. I'll stop. (before the Collective gets here.)

Stan Dane wrote:

Stan Dane wrote:Mick Purdy

Mick Purdy wrote:Q: Did Jack Dougherty "open up" in the mornings as part of his "extra chores"?
 
Q: And if so would this have meant he had access to the buildings keys outside of normal business hours?

 
Are there answers to these questions?
I suppose not....

Worth a thought don't you think?

Ed Ledoux

JD did open the TSBD at 7 am.

JD did often have to go to the TSBD after hours due to the water system pressure alarm.
When was the last alarm received that JD had to go to the TSBD?

Interesting that this job was left to a guy who had to catch a bus to get there... 

Mick Purdy

TSBD was an extremely progressive employer, considering they were operating and located in Dallas Texas 1963

They had the "retarded" Jack Dougherty charged with the responsibility of opening the building in the mornings and Eddie Piper (African American) staying back late at nights and presumably closing up.

My what a fair and reasonable work place. The absolute forefront of equal opportunity. I sincerely trust they were rewarded in some ways for their ultra progressive liberal approach.

Jack,
Eddie
Wes.

Bet they could've told us a thing or two about what went on that day.

Stan Dane wrote:Terry Martin

I think you have pretty much established the fact that this pair were the lone wielders of the paper bag, rifle transport, "curtain rod" story, as we can find no other fount for this line of wisdom.

The question I have is WHY. Were they simply coerced by others to create the tale? Probably not, I believe the story appeared in the narrative much sooner than the fabled second floor encounter.

So this little biscuit must have been to cover up something they were already involved in and they perjured themselves, apparently hoping to through their neighbor under the bus and save themselves and undue suspicion.

But what were they up to? Were they complicit in the assassination? (Hey, if I were going to kill a President, I would not want a 19 yr old kid running any major portion of the program, would you?) Or were they involved in something else and merely coerced into aiding and abetting the cover-up?

And I wonder if Buell knew about the assassination before hand or did he merely panic after the fact and run from the TSBD like a sceered lil wabbit. Y'know, like Ozzie was supposed to.

I'm rambling. I'll stop. (before the Collective gets here.)

Mick Purdy

Terry, I can understand peoples reservations in accepting my theory about Frazier NOT driving Lee to work on the Friday. I get that, its been long established as something that was viewed as fact. I think it has been established with a reasonable amount of certainty that the bag (the one Frazier and Randle said they saw) did not exist...it was a fabrication.

But in its sum, I still firmly believe Frazier did not drive Oswald to work....there are many reasons for this view too many to mention here.

Suffice it to say, Nobody saw Lee that morning leaving the Paine residence, bag or no bag. No one saw Lee walking to the Randle house, and no body saw Lee with Wes either at the Randle house, in the car, or in car park 1 on Houston Nth. The clincher for me is Shields testimony, he had not one reason to lie or embellish his recollection. He was as disinterested as one could be. The fact is IMO he proves Wes is a liar with regards to that walk through the carpark. There is no explainable way of Shields missing Oswald with Wes in that carpark IMO. And IMO its because Wes was not with Oswald.

Its interesting too, that we have from Shelley's testimony or sworn statement the fact that he sighted Oswald "at work" sometime before he had arrived at 8.00 am. I know  I sound like a broken record but for whatever reason, Wes was not with Lee.

Your Question of "Why" is as valid as any question posed. 

The fact is Linnie Mae went to Adamcik at around 2.45 pm - 3.00 pm with "vital" important information with regards to what she and Wes had observed that morning. No doubt info relating to some long paper sack which Oswald had with him and the story of the curtain rods. Now its interesting that we now know that Wes headed home first (or where ever) before he went to the hospital. Thats probably IMO when those two met and had a chat.

IMO those two were NOT simply throwing a neighbor under the bus....I would contend they had foreknowledge at least of the throwdown weapon and a sack which would be "discovered" in the TSBD. I have said before, its possible Wes was coerced.

I don't believe they were in on the Assassination plan per se. Just a small cog in the framing element helped along by the Paines.

I don't buy into the fact Wes was 19 years young so there for he wasn't capable, there's too many examples of this being a false premise.....18 year olds kill. This was Texas 1963. Them boys had guns in their hands when they were born.

Now I'm rambling.......

Terry Martin

Mick, I don't mind your rambling a bit. If you hadn't began this thread the mystery of that morning may have hung over our heads for a long time hence.

Yes, I suppose nineteen was not too young back them. I was there (not Dallas but West Texas) at the time and almost everyone I knew had a rifle (& hunted) by the time they were twelve. I knew quite a few girls marrying at fourteen and a few guys at sixteen. It was a different planet, fer sure.

I was just trying to get the depth of BWF's involvement. The way he seems to have departed the building so quickly after the event SEEMS to indicate that he got scared shitless and needed a cover story quick. So he goes to see big sister for help.

That's my take at the moment. I would just like to know what that day looked like to BWF before the assassination. What did he think he was up to?

Maybe we'll know sometime... and soon, I think.

Stan Dane wrote:Terry Martin

Mick, I don't mind your rambling a bit. If you hadn't began this thread the mystery of that morning may have hung over our heads for a long time hence.

Yes, I suppose nineteen was not too young back them. I was there (not Dallas but West Texas) at the time and almost everyone I knew had a rifle (& hunted) by the time they were twelve. I knew quite a few girls marrying at fourteen and a few guys at sixteen. It was a different planet, fer sure.

I was just trying to get the depth of BWF's involvement. The way he seems to have departed the building so quickly after the event SEEMS to indicate that he got scared shitless and needed a cover story quick. So he goes to see big sister for help.

That's my take at the moment. I would just like to know what that day looked like to BWF before the assassination. What did he think he was up to?

Maybe we'll know sometime... and soon, I think.

Mick Purdy

I'm not writing off the idea that Wesley had a hand in Oswald's "getaway" either.....as far as I can tell there's absolutely no reason whatsoever that I've seen to date to suggest otherwise..its plausible.....completely possible IMO.

Not buying into the scared Lil Wabbit either......

Mick Purdy

I just had to bring this over from the Lovelady thread. Many thanks Lee.

Lee Farley

I have mulled over the question of Billy Lovelady's whereabouts after the immediate aftermath of the shooting for a long time now.
 
I never bought into the Gerda Dunckel work that was said to show Bill Shelley and Billy Lovelady walking toward the parking lot area approximately 20+ seconds after the shots.
 
Now I categorically dismiss this work. I do not believe that Bill Shelley and Billy Lovelady left those steps and went out onto Elm Street or anywhere near the parking lot. I have been looking at the Weigman film for days now and I am absolutely convinced that this person is Billy Lovelady in the frame on the left. Frame on the right is Lovelady from Darnell:
 
Bald head, dark shirt, white t-shirt underneath, looks like he may be smoking as hand is up to his mouth. This, IMO, is Billy Nolan Lovelady. His original affidavit as it appears in my OP above was correct when he wrote that after the shooting he "went back into the building and went to work" and he did not go outside with Bill Shelley.
 
Not only did he stay on the steps but he was stood directly in front of Prayer Man and Buell Wesley Frazier and would have seen the approach of Officer Marrion Baker. If this is Billy Lovelady in Weigman, and I now have no doubts that it is, then I believe it possible that the figure stood to Buell Wesley Frazier's left on the landing is Bill Shelley. It was Shelley who "vouched" for Oswald on those steps when Baker got to those doors. Truly was too far behind and he certainly did not reach the doors at the same time as Baker.
 
Shelley was Oswald's "Supervisor" and therefore it makes sense that the designated "patsy" was being shepherded by his "Supervisor" that day. Shelley was watching Oswald's every move, IMO. Shelley made sure that Oswald was pushed into the shadows of those steps away from view. It was Shelley who sent Oswald home. Shelley and Truly were the one's who put the spotlight on Oswald as soon as they were certain he had left.
 
I'm beginning to think, seriously, that Frazier left with Oswald. I don't believe Frazier stayed after the assassination. If he had, he'd have been rounded up with the others and taken to be interviewed.

April 3, 2015 at 7:38 PM Flag Quote & Reply
M.P.
I am now more than ever convinced Frazier left with Oswald after the assassination and much earlier than he ever admitted to.
If this is true then BWF's involvement that day IMO sky rockets into the stratosphere. On the back of Lee's piece above noting where Lovelady is standing on the steps, and Stan's fine work with the Darnell frames, we now know with near certainty that Buell looks to PM whilst on the steps of the TSBD, possibly talks with him, and that Bill Shelley is stood to Frazier's left. This IMO suggests in an extremely persuasive way that if PM is Oswald ( and I think it is) then Frazier knew who was to his right, there can be no doubt that.
If Frazier left with Oswald then it is almost certain he dropped Oswald off at a destination around town.
I'll conclude with this thought too. We are only able to come to the determination that Frazier left with Oswald thanks to the tireless efforts of Lee Farley and Ed Ledoux regarding the bus trip fraud along with the shonky cab ride too. The real and actual conveyance of Oswald from the TSBD is now well and truly on the table thanks to this forums contributions.

Terry Martin

Wow! Mick and Lee re-configure the universe.

What I wonder now - since it seems most likely that Lee left with his usual ride (BWF) - is the destination: the Texas Theater.

IF Frazier took Oswald to the theater, how was Oswald supposed to get home after the film?

What seems likely to me is that BOTH the boys went to the theater (just as I have in my script "Feral Buell's Day Off"). Only in this rendition, after getting seated, BWF leaves the theater. Oswald, wondering where the fellow has gone to, goes back to the lobby and upstairs to the balcony. After taking seats looking for Buell, he returns to the lower level and changes seats a few times still looking for Frazier.

And about then, the cops arrive. After that, Frazier's whereabouts become superfluous.

Now, of course, I have to figure out about the shoe salesman calling the cops - since it apparently wasn't Frazier ratting out Ozzie to the fuzz (unless it was BWF and the other was a red herring) why did he call?

Did Frazier come out of the theater, hear the sirens and duck down rather quickly before darting back into the theater (without paying since he had already gotten a ticket) and the shoe guy called it in. As tall as Frazier is, the act of ducking down at a siren would be especially noteworthy.

Stan Dane wrote:Terry Martin

Wow! Mick and Lee re-configure the universe.

What I wonder now - since it seems most likely that Lee left with his usual ride (BWF) - is the destination: the Texas Theater.

IF Frazier took Oswald to the theater, how was Oswald supposed to get home after the film?

What seems likely to me is that BOTH the boys went to the theater (just as I have in my script "Feral Buell's Day Off"). Only in this rendition, after getting seated, BWF leaves the theater. Oswald, wondering where the fellow has gone to, goes back to the lobby and upstairs to the balcony. After taking seats looking for Buell, he returns to the lower level and changes seats a few times still looking for Frazier.

And about then, the cops arrive. After that, Frazier's whereabouts become superfluous.

Now, of course, I have to figure out about the shoe salesman calling the cops - since it apparently wasn't Frazier ratting out Ozzie to the fuzz (unless it was BWF and the other was a red herring) why did he call?

Did Frazier come out of the theater, hear the sirens and duck down rather quickly before darting back into the theater (without paying since he had already gotten a ticket) and the shoe guy called it in. As tall as Frazier is, the act of ducking down at a siren would be especially noteworthy.

Mick Purdy

I'm with you Terry, more than possible the two lads ended up at the theatre............

Now, thanks to the many people here, we can possibly join up those dots a lot easier than ever before. I think way back on this thread, I posted a vague theory of Oswald being given a lift by Frazier to the Beckley Alley LOL and dropped of at the theatre there after. Someone mentioned that the timing might have been out.....I'm not so sure, I'll have to check.

Frazier ratting out his little mate has way more merrit in my humble opinion than any other version posed.......he only needed a pay phone and the job was done...Linnie phones the DPD

Plausible YES! Possible YES! 
Likely.....I say YES!

Details need to be worked on.

PS: Left out a reply for "how Oswald gets home after the theatre"

In my world, BWF had foreknowledge.....IMO there was never to be "how you gettin' home"

Of course, In someone else's world, Lee may have simply said:

"I'll make my own way home after the movie, but thanks for the lift anyway Wes. And thank Bill for the ride this morning, by the way did you get the things you were fixing to do before breakfast done? I'll see ya Monday morning."

Ed Ledoux

After the double feature LHO would have taken the bus to Irving at the usual time he normally went home.
Seems he was "killing" a couple hours. Nothing sinister about it. Got off early and had the chance to see some war flicks, went to the theater in OC that was cheap and had two good movies playing. Probably saw the movie listings and times in the paper that morning...

And he could have hitched a ride from the theater with a negro or dark complected Hispanic. 

Stan Dane wrote:

Stan Dane wrote:Terry Martin

Wow! Mick and Lee re-configure the universe.

What I wonder now - since it seems most likely that Lee left with his usual ride (BWF) - is the destination: the Texas Theater.

IF Frazier took Oswald to the theater, how was Oswald supposed to get home after the film?

What seems likely to me is that BOTH the boys went to the theater (just as I have in my script "Feral Buell's Day Off"). Only in this rendition, after getting seated, BWF leaves the theater. Oswald, wondering where the fellow has gone to, goes back to the lobby and upstairs to the balcony. After taking seats looking for Buell, he returns to the lower level and changes seats a few times still looking for Frazier.

And about then, the cops arrive. After that, Frazier's whereabouts become superfluous.

Now, of course, I have to figure out about the shoe salesman calling the cops - since it apparently wasn't Frazier ratting out Ozzie to the fuzz (unless it was BWF and the other was a red herring) why did he call?

Did Frazier come out of the theater, hear the sirens and duck down rather quickly before darting back into the theater (without paying since he had already gotten a ticket) and the shoe guy called it in. As tall as Frazier is, the act of ducking down at a siren would be especially noteworthy.

Mick Purdy

I'm with you Terry, more than possible the two lads ended up at the theatre............

Now, thanks to the many people here, we can possibly join up those dots a lot easier than ever before. I think way back on this thread, I posted a vague theory of Oswald being given a lift by Frazier to the Beckley Alley LOL and dropped of at the theatre there after. Someone mentioned that the timing might have been out.....I'm not so sure, I'll have to check.

Frazier ratting out his little mate has way more merrit in my humble opinion than any other version posed.......he only needed a pay phone and the job was done...Linnie phones the DPD

Plausible YES! Possible YES! 
Likely.....I say YES!

Details need to be worked on.

PS: Left out a reply for "how Oswald gets home after the theatre"

In my world, BWF had foreknowledge.....IMO there was never to be "how you gettin' home"

Of course, In someone else's world, Lee may have simply said:

"I'll make my own way home after the movie, but thanks for the lift anyway Wes. And thank Bill for the ride this morning, by the way did you get the things you were fixing to do before breakfast done? I'll see ya Monday morning."

Mick Purdy

And since we're looking at Wes taking Oz to the movies after the assassination, Its got to be on the table at least for consideration IMO that Wes dropped his little mate off, went to park the car, and phoned Linnie. All Linnie had to do is phone the DPD.

Ed Ledoux



Yeah Linnie drops the dime on LHO now that Wes had told her where he was.
Linnie runs down the street and gives the cops a bad lead on Wes to buy him time to get from OC to Irving and to the hospital.
Pure speculation of course. 

Stan Dane wrote:Ed Ledoux



Yeah Linnie drops the dime on LHO now that Wes had told her where he was.
Linnie runs down the street and gives the cops a bad lead on Wes to buy him time to get from OC to Irving and to the hospital.
Pure speculation of course. 

Mick Purdy

Of course....