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Send Lawyers Guns & Money Pt2

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Wed 26 Jul 2017, 1:22 pm
Just to clear something up that I started in an early post to this thread.

The Nichols who worked on Operation Integrity was not Dallas lawyer H Louis Nichols. It was ex FBI asst dir. Louis Nichols. Somewhere along the line, someone writing about the Nixon operation got the two Nichols mixed up and named him as H. Louis Nichols and I took that at face vale as being the Dallas lawyer. 

Ed, good pick up on who Nichols worked for.

Here is a Dallas Bar oral history int. with him

https://vimeo.com/87873075

_________________
Australians don't mind criminals: It's successful bullshit artists we despise. 
              Lachie Hulme            
-----------------------------
The Cold War ran on bullshit.
              Me


"So what’s an independent-minded populist like me to do? I’ve had to grovel in promoting myself on social media, even begging for Amazon reviews and Goodreads ratings, to no avail." 
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Thu 27 Jul 2017, 12:23 am
Nichols is an "City" attorney in 1959

 January, 1959 TKt Municipal League Asks Gas Price Hike Request Denied with Dallas iml Fort Worth offering legal ind city public utility! office help without diirge. 3. A letter advising the effect of the rate Increase on local rate itractures should be sent to all cities. The committee said fcat Lone Star's request for tn escalator clause would allow the company to raise gate rates automatically without going to the commission when field prices go up. ·You are reminded that last summer beginning in July most of the cities were asked and granted a three-cent Increase across the aoird on domestic and commercial users, nnrl likewise, we are Informed the company raised the Industrial rate two cents across the board," the com' mittee said. The committee's report was signed by J. W. Monk, Dallas public utilities supervisor, as chairman; Gordon W h i t m a n , Fort Worth assistant city attorney; J P. Cox Jr., Sherman city attor ney; Charles R. Griggs, Swoet water city attorney; Allen Harp Childress city attorney; and ' H Louis Nichols as attorney for five Dallas county towns.

https://www.newspapers.com/newspage/30122248/

In Texas, tradition still has meaning. The tradition of excellence represented by Nichols, Jackson, Dillard, Hager & Smith, LLP dates back to 1895, making it one of the oldest law firms in Texas.
“Since 1951 the firm has been dedicated to public sector clients,” explains Peter Smith, the firm’s managing partner.

Dallas Bar Association 1961-1970
http://www.tklaw.com/files/News/fb0de8c2-303a-4529-9b96-97fef3ca25b0/Presentation/NewsAttachment/d3390830-10e0-4367-b353-9bde1f3eff9f/HN_08-2009.pdf
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Thu 27 Jul 2017, 1:03 am
Nichols helped cover for Curry.
He was President of the DBA and it fell upon him to ask if Lee had been told he could get a lawyer once indicted.
Nichols could not be Lee's lawyer but was allowed to see him. Hmm
The two ACLU lawyers could have represented him for his arrest, bail, arraignment, lineups, perhaps interrogations, transfer, charges, and anything else a lawyer whom represents his or her client would do.
Yet they were dissuaded from such a face to face like Nichols received, even though Nichols said Lee asked for ACLU!!!!
Lee needed a lawyer as soon as he was charged. If not sooner.
Getting in front of those cameras and stating their client is innocent of all charges and this will be proven beyond a shadow of a doubt in a court of law was of huge importance in a Media trial. Lee had enough cash to retain such a mouthpiece for a short period, then he would be broke, and at indictment Lee could claim destitution and ask for legal aid. (having had to fire his attorney)

But this would have put pressure on the DPD,
so Nichols tries to quiet Lee, I can hear it now, 'shut up boy you can't get a lawyer till trial.'

Wisely Lee did use his time on camera at midnight press conference to again say no one has come forward to represent him.
Nichols is not a criminal attorney and was not there to try and represent him, he may of asked if he wanted the DBA to secure a lawyer for him but is that a trial lawyer after he is indicted and once again of no use
to Lee at that moment, and possibly detrimental to his defense.

The context of Nichols question to a criminal lawyer was so blatantly unorthodox given the complaints Lee was making about his treatment, hygiene, use of phone, lack of representation, false arrest, short and sweet hearings, nebulous arraignments, and evidence he said was fake.

A lawyer is need NOW to secure his rights, gather evidence of his innocence, and secure witnesses whom may try to leave the state!!!
Not weeks or months later... by then you may have no rebuttal, and any criminal lawyer knows better.
Mr. Nichols was a civil lawyer unfamiliar with criminal law. Hence the need to call a criminal lawyer for an opinion.... Finally he gets a call from a lawyer whom is a professor at SMU... 
Yeah Chuck Webster! Whom is hanging about looking out for Curry's rights also.

Nichols kept this "criminal" lawyers name secret for very good reason.

Cheers, Ed
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Thu 27 Jul 2017, 8:58 am
Ed. Ledoux wrote:Nichols helped cover for Curry.
He was President of the DBA and it fell upon him to ask if Lee had been told he could get a lawyer once indicted.
Nichols could not be Lee's lawyer but was allowed to see him. Hmm
The two ACLU lawyers could have represented him for his arrest, bail, arraignment, lineups, perhaps interrogations, transfer, charges, and anything else a lawyer whom represents his or her client would do.
Yet they were dissuaded from such a face to face like Nichols received, even though Nichols said Lee asked for ACLU!!!!
Lee needed a lawyer as soon as he was charged. If not sooner.
Getting in front of those cameras and stating their client is innocent of all charges and this will be proven beyond a shadow of a doubt in a court of law was of huge importance in a Media trial. Lee had enough cash to retain such a mouthpiece for a short period, then he would be broke, and at indictment Lee could claim destitution and ask for legal aid. (having had to fire his attorney)

But this would have put pressure on the DPD,
so Nichols tries to quiet Lee, I can hear it now, 'shut up boy you can't get a lawyer till trial.'

Wisely Lee did use his time on camera at midnight press conference to again say no one has come forward to represent him.
Nichols is not a criminal attorney and was not there to try and represent him, he may of asked if he wanted the DBA to secure a lawyer for him but is that a trial lawyer after he is indicted and once again of no use
to Lee at that moment, and possibly detrimental to his defense.

The context of Nichols question to a criminal lawyer was so blatantly unorthodox given the complaints Lee was making about his treatment, hygiene, use of phone, lack of representation, false arrest, short and sweet hearings, nebulous arraignments, and evidence he said was fake.

A lawyer is need NOW to secure his rights, gather evidence of his innocence, and secure witnesses whom may try to leave the state!!!
Not weeks or months later... by then you may have no rebuttal, and any criminal lawyer knows better.
Mr. Nichols was a civil lawyer unfamiliar with criminal law. Hence the need to call a criminal lawyer for an opinion.... Finally he gets a call from a lawyer whom is a professor at SMU... 
Yeah Chuck Webster! Whom is hanging about looking out for Curry's rights also.

Nichols kept this "criminal" lawyers name secret for very good reason.

Cheers, Ed
Couldn't have put it better. Everything done and said in regard to a lawyer by anyone but Oswald was done and said in the cause of denying and delaying.

_________________
Australians don't mind criminals: It's successful bullshit artists we despise. 
              Lachie Hulme            
-----------------------------
The Cold War ran on bullshit.
              Me


"So what’s an independent-minded populist like me to do? I’ve had to grovel in promoting myself on social media, even begging for Amazon reviews and Goodreads ratings, to no avail." 
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Thu 27 Jul 2017, 9:02 am
I go back to the documentary, Murder on a Sunday Morning where the defense nails one of the detectives on just this issue. The detective told the 15 year old kid he would organize a lawyer for him, but had to admit under oath he did nothing about it with the lame excuse that he never promised he would do it. In other words, the he did not include the "p" word in what he told the kid so he was under no obligation to do it.

_________________
Australians don't mind criminals: It's successful bullshit artists we despise. 
              Lachie Hulme            
-----------------------------
The Cold War ran on bullshit.
              Me


"So what’s an independent-minded populist like me to do? I’ve had to grovel in promoting myself on social media, even begging for Amazon reviews and Goodreads ratings, to no avail." 
Don Jeffries

"I've been aware of Greg Parker's work for years, and strongly recommend it." Peter Dale Scott

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Sat 29 Jul 2017, 9:04 am
greg parker wrote:
Ed. Ledoux wrote:Nichols helped cover for Curry.
He was President of the DBA and it fell upon him to ask if Lee had been told he could get a lawyer once indicted.
Nichols could not be Lee's lawyer but was allowed to see him. Hmm
The two ACLU lawyers could have represented him for his arrest, bail, arraignment, lineups, perhaps interrogations, transfer, charges, and anything else a lawyer whom represents his or her client would do.
Yet they were dissuaded from such a face to face like Nichols received, even though Nichols said Lee asked for ACLU!!!!
Lee needed a lawyer as soon as he was charged. If not sooner.
Getting in front of those cameras and stating their client is innocent of all charges and this will be proven beyond a shadow of a doubt in a court of law was of huge importance in a Media trial. Lee had enough cash to retain such a mouthpiece for a short period, then he would be broke, and at indictment Lee could claim destitution and ask for legal aid. (having had to fire his attorney)

But this would have put pressure on the DPD,
so Nichols tries to quiet Lee, I can hear it now, 'shut up boy you can't get a lawyer till trial.'

Wisely Lee did use his time on camera at midnight press conference to again say no one has come forward to represent him.
Nichols is not a criminal attorney and was not there to try and represent him, he may of asked if he wanted the DBA to secure a lawyer for him but is that a trial lawyer after he is indicted and once again of no use
to Lee at that moment, and possibly detrimental to his defense.

The context of Nichols question to a criminal lawyer was so blatantly unorthodox given the complaints Lee was making about his treatment, hygiene, use of phone, lack of representation, false arrest, short and sweet hearings, nebulous arraignments, and evidence he said was fake.

A lawyer is need NOW to secure his rights, gather evidence of his innocence, and secure witnesses whom may try to leave the state!!!
Not weeks or months later... by then you may have no rebuttal, and any criminal lawyer knows better.
Mr. Nichols was a civil lawyer unfamiliar with criminal law. Hence the need to call a criminal lawyer for an opinion.... Finally he gets a call from a lawyer whom is a professor at SMU... 
Yeah Chuck Webster! Whom is hanging about looking out for Curry's rights also.

Nichols kept this "criminal" lawyers name secret for very good reason.

Cheers, Ed
Couldn't have put it better. Everything done and said in regard to a lawyer by anyone but Oswald was done and said in the cause of denying and delaying.

Olds was given the runaround by Webster, Fritz and King on the 22nd.
Nichols walks in late afternoon on the 23rd at which time Lee had apparently conversed with Ruth Paine and Marina, about getting Abt.
I do not find that part not to be very truthful,  Ruthy throws him under a bus with her answer during the wc (she did not bother).
I have not found anything showing Webster was around on the 23rd.

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Sat 29 Jul 2017, 9:06 am
greg parker wrote:Just to clear something up that I started in an early post to this thread.

The Nichols who worked on Operation Integrity was not Dallas lawyer H Louis Nichols. It was ex FBI asst dir. Louis Nichols. Somewhere along the line, someone writing about the Nixon operation got the two Nichols mixed up and named him as H. Louis Nichols and I took that at face vale as being the Dallas lawyer. 

Ed, good pick up on who Nichols worked for.

Here is a Dallas Bar oral history int. with him

https://vimeo.com/87873075

I took the film at that link and re-cut it to the segment of Nov 22-23

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Sat 29 Jul 2017, 10:50 am
Why is every one ringing the president of the CIVIL lawyers association?

Lawyer friends who he can't remember the names of?

_________________
Australians don't mind criminals: It's successful bullshit artists we despise. 
              Lachie Hulme            
-----------------------------
The Cold War ran on bullshit.
              Me


"So what’s an independent-minded populist like me to do? I’ve had to grovel in promoting myself on social media, even begging for Amazon reviews and Goodreads ratings, to no avail." 
Don Jeffries

"I've been aware of Greg Parker's work for years, and strongly recommend it." Peter Dale Scott

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Sat 29 Jul 2017, 11:07 am
greg parker wrote:Why is every one ringing the president of the CIVIL lawyers association?

Lawyer friends who he can't remember the names of?
Regarding part 2. Olds had the same issue......

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Sun 30 Jul 2017, 7:37 am
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Sun 30 Jul 2017, 9:17 am
New York Times had the name wrong, but finally corrected itself:


John de J. Pemberton Jr.,
who as executive director of the American Civil Liberties Union during the turbulent 1960s helped double its size and shift its focus to the criminal courts as an arena for issues like civil rights and Vietnam, died Oct. 21 in Monte Rio, Calif. He was 90.The cause was congestive heart failure, said his daughter Nancy Pemberton. Mr. Pemberton, who said he considered himself a militant on civil liberties issues, sometimes had to balance the views of other militants with those of A.C.L.U. members who favored a more moderate approach. A contentious issue early in the Vietnam War was whether the civil rights group should help draft resisters. It eventually did, in 1968. “The in-fighting gives us our strength,” Mr. Pemberton said in an interview with The New York Times in 1970.The A.C.L.U. certainly grew stronger under Mr. Pemberton’s leadership. When he became executive director in 1962, there were 28 A.C.L.U. affiliates with a membership of 61,000 people and a total income of $535,000. When he stepped down in 1970, there were 47 affiliates with a membership of 144,000 and a total income of $2 million. Mr. Pemberton helped orchestrate a major shift in the A.C.L.U.’s legal strategy. The group had historically chosen to pursue appeals of important test cases in higher courts in order to establish a constitutional principle, often as a friend of the court.
But, under Mr. Pemberton and his board, the A.C.L.U. came to serve as criminal counsel for an individual defendant in 95 percent of the cases. He said in an interview with The New York Times Magazine in 1966 that this change was necessary to make the lower courts work.
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Sun 30 Jul 2017, 9:27 am
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Sun 30 Jul 2017, 9:44 am
ACLU held Dallas police responsible,... how?

I would claim they were prevented from seeing their client.
I would sue them for civil rights violations.
But hey I'm no 95 percenter like Pemberton. 
I'd say Oswald case checked every box.
Right up until Oswald filled one.

Cheers, Ed
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Sun 30 Jul 2017, 11:30 am
Pemberton jumps ship in Jan 6 1964 for Otto Otepka
https://www.marxists.org/history/etol/newspape/themilitant/1964/v28n01-jan-06-1964-mil.pdf

Otto was being bugged and Mr. P said State Dept. was breaking laws.

https://kennedysandking.com/john-f-kennedy-articles/what-did-otto-otepka-know-about-oswald-and-the-cia



Hon. J. Edgar Hoover

Federal Bureau of Investigation w ,

Walton, B.C. Q^ fj^J^

My dear Edgar:



For your eyes alone I am sending a copy

of letter addressed by Mr. Pemberton, of the ACLU
to Osmond K. Fraenkel. I am also sending a copy
to Irv Ferman, who put me to work on this little
chore .

Yours
Ernst


CIVIL LIBERTIES UNION AMERICA
156 FIFTH AVENUE
NEW YORK 10, N. Y,
October 7 9 1964

Osmond K Fraenkel Esq*
120 Broadway
New York.

Dear Osmond

Further to our correspondence and discussion concerning the
Warren Commission Report I am writing to ask if you would take
on the drafting of a proposed statement of ACLU's comments on
the civil liberties issues raised by the report*

It occurs to me that these issues are three

(1) The prejudicial publicity*

Here the report seems to endorse all of the criticise)
wc issued in our December 6th statement* Since we
have not since then beer, able to resolve our views as
to what remedial measures should be adopted (whether
limited to measures imposing restraint on the law
enforcement agencies and prosecutors or whether re-
straints on the representatives of the media them-
selves should be added) p ^there may be little else we
can say*


<2) The interrogation of Oswald and the protection of right to counsel*
I have the impression that the report here offers little
but conclusions that Oswald's rights were recognized*
It would seem to me that would have doubts as to,
factually^ whether prolonged or oppressive .interroga-
tion occurred and in principle, whether mere mention
of a right to counsel during the course of an arraignment
that was not public and the interview with Louis Nichols
of the Dallas Bar Association,, the opportunities afforded
him to make a telephone call to John Abt and to request
his relatives to do so afforded sufficient recognition
of his right to counsel*
Here again is an issue which wc
raised in our December 6th statement; I am not sure
whether the report answers the questions we asked*



Osmond K. Fraenkel, Esq. Page 2 October 7 P 1964

(3) Impairment of individual liberty in efforts to protect the security of the Presidents *
From what I have seen (eog d(> recommendations 1 9 4(a) 9 7» and
11 of chapter one ft on page 3 of the newspaper copy; and the
discussion of "preventive intelligence" in- chapter VIII ^ pages
35 and 36 of the newspaper copy) I agree that the Commission
does not recommend preventive detention of defectors 9 sub-
versives atxd other- suspicious characters*
However j> I haven 7 1
seen the report explicitly negative such preventive detention 9
And what is more serious 9 I think excessively security minded
individuals (especially among law enforcement agencies) may
well read into the recommendations a -justification for taking
risks with police practices that 'may well result in (1) haras-
sment of such suspicious characters 9 and (2) leaks of infor-
mation that they are on security lists by reason of their
associations „ political beliefs 9 or even presumed psychiatric

quirks*
The risk;, as I see it, nay arise out of the insistance
upon a much larger screening d£ potential undesirables 9 requiring
the participation of additions to the SEcret Service force who
may be less well trained and cooperation of local law enforce-
ment officers who may be relatively untrained and insensitive to
principles of individual liberty* The report^ of course^ calls
for such substantial increase in the numbers of names to be
submitted to and screened by the Secret Service and explicitly
calls for use of local law enforcement agencies in evaluating
these names and taking preventive measures a

I dont think we need to criticize the report or charge its authors with
civil liberties insensitivity, in order to make the point that national
preoccupation with security of the President may well endanger other im-
portant national values
I think Mr hoover in his testimony released
last Friday makes our point for us quite well*

Very sincerely,,
John de J Pemberton Jr
Executive Director
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Sun 30 Jul 2017, 12:15 pm
Gold

_________________
Australians don't mind criminals: It's successful bullshit artists we despise. 
              Lachie Hulme            
-----------------------------
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              Me


"So what’s an independent-minded populist like me to do? I’ve had to grovel in promoting myself on social media, even begging for Amazon reviews and Goodreads ratings, to no avail." 
Don Jeffries

"I've been aware of Greg Parker's work for years, and strongly recommend it." Peter Dale Scott

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Sun 30 Jul 2017, 12:17 pm
Would it be worthwhile revisiting the idea of contacting the ACLU, reminding them of this early work and showing how much we have expanded upon it with a view to taking whatever further steps in the legal system that can be taken?

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-----------------------------
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              Me


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"I've been aware of Greg Parker's work for years, and strongly recommend it." Peter Dale Scott

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Sun 10 Sep 2017, 3:49 pm
That's not a bad idea, would be worth a try.

Just an add on. I have managed to get scans of a lot of DCLU material which I have all included in my Anatomy Of Lee Harvey Oswald's Interrogations paper. All on pages 243-262.

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Sat 06 Jan 2018, 11:18 pm
Not sure whether this has been posted before.
Here is the ACLU's reaction from Dec 63

http://jfk.hood.edu/Collection/White%20Materials/White%20Assassination%20Clippings%20Folders/Security%20Folders/Security-Police/Item%2006.pdf

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Fri 26 Jun 2020, 9:20 am
Greg Olds, Grier Raggio Otto Mulinax and L.N.D. Wells were the four men who went to the D.P.D. Friday night.

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Fri 26 Jun 2020, 10:03 am
Outstanding Bart,

The Usual Suspects

Send Lawyers Guns & Money Pt2 - Page 7 Mwbcwi10
L to R: Otto Mullinax, L.N.D. Wells, Jr., Oscar Mauzy

Cheers,Ed
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Fri 26 Jun 2020, 10:12 am
Grier H. Raggio Jr. 
Send Lawyers Guns & Money Pt2 - Page 7 16559210
But not Lee's family...
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Send Lawyers Guns & Money Pt2 - Page 7 Empty Re: Send Lawyers Guns & Money Pt2

Fri 26 Jun 2020, 10:31 am
Thanks Bart. Wells was the one I didn't know about. Good job!

Both Mullinex and Raggio took credit for being the catalyst for going.  I remain deeply suspicious of the Raggios.

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Send Lawyers Guns & Money Pt2 - Page 7 Empty Re: Send Lawyers Guns & Money Pt2

Fri 26 Jun 2020, 5:50 pm
They were prodded into 'action' by Rev. Brandon Lovely, the chairman from the ACLU in Austin.
He had heard Oswald say on TV that he had no representation

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Fri 26 Jun 2020, 5:52 pm
Send Lawyers Guns & Money Pt2 - Page 7 Grier_10
G. Raggio

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Send Lawyers Guns & Money Pt2 - Page 7 Empty Re: Send Lawyers Guns & Money Pt2

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